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Careful here. You're changing what the NYTimes actually said.
First of all, a whopping 895 people were polled. I didn't see any desription of who those people were, or how they were chosen, but in any case, it doesn't strike me that such a small number would be truly representative of the entire nation.
That being the case.....
The actual statement from the article said "85 percent of respondents said the health care system needed to be fundamentally changed or completely rebuilt" Your statement that 85% insist on coverage for all is specious at best. In fact, the best you can point to in that article to support the theory of "broad support for government-run health care" is this; "Sixty-four percent said they thought the federal government should guarantee coverage". And for my money, asking the government to guarantee coverage is a long way from asking the government to run the health care system.
If you are unhappy - express your dissatisfaction to your elected officials...
Maybe my statement should have been worded less awkwardly and I did put two poll findings in one sentence with one percent... sue me...
But the poll clearly indicates overwhelming support for government health care - like it or not.
If you are unhappy - express your dissatisfaction to your elected officials...
Can you point to anything in my post that said or suggested I was unhappy about anything, much less about something over which "elected officials" have control. I can't seem to find it, and I am wondering what this obnoxious little chiding is supposed to be about.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HubbleRules
Maybe my statement should have been worded less awkwardly and I did put two poll findings in one sentence with one percent... sue me...
Instead of suing you, I decided to correct you here, where those you seek to influence can see it. Not that I think you did it accidentally.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HubbleRules
But the poll clearly indicates overwhelming support for government health care - like it or not.
No, the poll of these few people clearly indicates overwhelming dissatisfaction with the current system, and strong support for a government guarantee of insurance. As I said earlier, that's a long way from overwhelming support of government run health care, despite your unsubstantiated insistance to the contrary.
Last edited by Bill Keegan; 06-20-2009 at 07:14 PM..
Reason: typos
Polling data like this is going to make it a lot easier for Obama and the Democrats to move us towards UHC - starting with a system of public/private health care components to begin with - and probably several years down the road making bolder and more comprehensive change.
The country can insist on whatever it wants. That does not obligate elected officials to provide it. Why not BMWs for all?
Besides not having the money, single payer systems don't work. Hospitals and doctors are already underpaid by Government insurance. They use the money they make from private insurance to make up for that. These underpayments costs the system a lot more than the uninsured. If the only payer is the Government, how many providers will go out of business? Nobody is owed Health insurance!
Define not work?? How has any single payer system not worked? I here this crap all the time as if we must accept that as a given, but the fact is that no country who has a single payer system has switched to anything else. No single payer system is advocating going to an american system. So again I ask, define not work.
Can you point to anything in my post that said or suggested I was unhappy about anything, much less about somethinng over which "elected officials" have control. I can't seem to find it, and I am wondering what this obnoxious little chiding is supposed to be about.
Instead of suing you I decided to correct you here, where thpse you seek to influence can see it. Not that I think you did it accidentally.
No, the poll of these few people clearly indicates overwhelming dissatisfaction with the current system, and strong support for a government guarantee of insurance. As I said earlier, that's a long way from overwhelming support of government run health care, despite your unsubstantiated insistence to the contrary.
You see - I had you pegged - you think I intentionally distorted the article... when nothing is further from the truth.
You sound to me like someone who is against government health care and is going to try to minimize the poll results for self-serving purposes - so why not just admit it???
You see - I had you pegged - you think I intentionally distorted the article... when nothing is further from the truth.
You sound to me like someone who is against government health care and is going to try to minimize the poll results for self-serving purposes - so why not just admit it???
You think you have me pegged, but you are wrong. I'm not trying to distort the poll, but I am trying to be sure that your distortions are pointed out. Notice how you conveniently switch to attacking me instead of defending the erroneous statements you made in your post. And I notice, by the way, that you still haven't bothered to go back to that post & correct the "awkward wording." Want people to read the statement that way, do you?
That being said, yes, I am against government run health care. Our government is too large already. And it has demonstrated an inability to manage many of the programs it has tried. I for one do not want to entrust the care of me & my family to a beaurocrat in DC or Trenton.
You think you have me pegged, but you are wrong. I'm not trying to distort the poll, but I am trying to be sure that your distortions are pointed out. Notice how you conveniently switch to attacking me instead of defending the erroneous statements you made in your post.
That being said, yes, I am against government run health care. Our government is too large already. And it has demonstrated an inability to manage many of the programs it has tried. I for one do not want to entrust the care of me & my family to a beaurocrat in DC or Trenton.
I did not defend my eroneous statement - I clearly said it was worded ambiguously... and I clearly linked to the article that gave the poll results so people could read on their own. Thanks for pointing out my distortion... But you were dead wrong about it being intentional - that is you attributing bad intent on my part without a single shred of evidence... You see - this holier than though attitude cuts both ways...
So you get to the real crux of the matter - you feel that the government is too big already - and you oppose government run health care.
So you will naturally try to shoot down any arguments for it - I get it - and I still support it like the vast majority of Americans... Who do you think the politicians will listen to - the 15% or the 85%???
Business Week has a poll printed in this magazine just out (pg 027):
Quote:
A survey of US physicians last year found that 59% support federal legislation to establish national health insurance. Especially supportive are the primary-care doctors, who make $148,000 a year on average. AMA members, on the other hand, skew toward surgeons who pull in $261,000 plus and cardiologists who rake in well over $300,000 per year.
The US spent $2.4 trillion on medical care last year. Doctors took home 31% of those dollars.
Quote:
Estimated annual payments to doctors in the US, equal to about one-third of the total yearly bill for health care = $744 billion
Medical-cost inflation is running at about 6% a year. And most economists lay the bulk of the blame for rising costs on America's fee-for-service payment system. Paying doctors for volume instead of value is inflationary.
Excuse...I got a bill a couple of years ago where the radiologist charged $500 for five minutes of work. The laws in our state insist that a certified radiologist review everything imagery. The regular doctor isn't good enough. SO....this Syrian doctor charges at a rate that isn't anything like
what this survey said...$300,000 per year. What a farce!
These docs who are specialist and in the
AMA do NOT want Obama and his plan because they have it too good now.
The public has got to come down on these greedy people. No person should make $500 for 5 minutes work and think that they are going to
slip quietly by.
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