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You should tell that to some men that who have sex with women and then later cry when she wants to get an abortion. They KNOW she can do it so why not be responsible and look at who you have sex with?
OR I could tell that to the women who have sex with men and cry later when he doesnt pay child support.
I am the biggest advocate of personal responsibility FOREMOST. Both parties should exercise responsibility. However, when either party is not responsible I simply think men should have a post ex facto option as women have.
I am not "whining" about a woman's right to abort a child. I support it in many cases. Im "whining" about the absence of a man's right to abort his obligation to the child.
Same thing, double standard, thats all.
A woman knows what can happen as well..yet she TOO CHOOSES to have sex anyway. And should she consider the outcome undesirable, she can exercise her right to abort the pregnancy.
So we should allow a man some recourse should he find the outcome undesirable.
Fair enough, I say.
Double standard? Hahah. How many double standards do women have to go through? I will let Beehave go through that.
Yes, women can have an abortion. Men know that. They should stop whining and realize when they stick it in, anything can happen.
Sorry but I have no sympathy toward men at all in situations like this. It is called common sense. If you know a woman can have an abortion, then YOU be careful. Or at the very least, get to know that woman and see what she wants like me and my partner did.
He knows that if I ever got pregnant, I would go and have an abortion asap. No problems. We talked it through.
Quote:
Originally Posted by solytaire
so you are arguing on behalf of women with whom you share no commonality on this issue?...I wonder why would you do that?
oh well, whatever.
I can argue whatever I want, you know?
Just because I don't expect a man who got me pregnant to pay does not mean he should not. I am more understand that way. He talked me at least before having sex and that is him being responsible.
Give me a break. I have a child care license and I have changed the diapers of kids that arent even mine. I have seen women whom have kids and dont even care about them, but they care when the father is late on a support payment. I have helped two fathers get their children from their mothers because they where not fit to be mothers. Neither of them have to pay child support and only the father and I see this as wrong. One woman is a nurse, and the other owns her own small chain of salons. They both have plenty of money to pay child support. But they both pleaded that the depression of not having their kids was more than enough. How messed up is that?
I worked in the child care industry for 6 years and have changed more diapers than any parent could possibly imagine and have been spit up on more times than anyone has. I keep my certificates up to date in case the question of my parenting skills ever come into question if I ever have children.
I also, have seen many fathers who could care less about the kid they have but still have to pay and they never see them. Yes, I think it is wrong, and could never imagine not loving any child I bore. But, these men have no right to be fathers in any way. Having a financial connection does nothing but make things worse when a man does not want to be a father.
In all fairness, I was addressing Nickle...but since we're on a roll....
I have never written that men are bad dads and women rule as parents. Yes, there are good and bad on both sides. The men who have custody should be receiving support from the mothers -- I believe I addressed 50/50 about a thread or two ago.
The undercurrent in your words says you want to be a dad, you've got the practice in child care, but when your time does come, you'll understand my perspective even more. (No disrespect intended.)
OR I could tell that to the women who have sex with men and cry later when he doesnt pay child support.
You could.
But you know the system will get her the money if she tries hard enough. And the court will say the same thing to you. Should have thought about it before having sex with her.
Yes, women can have an abortion. Men know that. They should stop whining and realize when they stick it in, anything can happen.
Where do you keep getting the impression that anyone is whining about a woman's right to abort a child? I WILL SAY IT AGAIN: A FEMALE'S RIGHT TO ABORT A CHILD IS GREAT. SHE SHOULD ABSOLUTELY EXERCISE THE RIGHT TO THAT CHOICE; wisely of course.
I am arguing on behalf of fathers who wish to abort their responsibility to an unwanted child.
Women should really quit whining about men not wanting to assume responsibility for a child they do not want, and either kill the child or shut up and deal with it..IMO
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theliberalvoice
Sorry but I have no sympathy toward men at all in situations like this. It is called common sense. If you know a woman can have an abortion, then YOU be careful. Or at the very least, get to know that woman and see what she wants like me and my partner did.
I completely agree with this...I think women should be careful if they dont want to have a child by a dad who wont take financial responsibility...If they know a man can turn into a deadbeat dad they should exercise much more discretion...absolutely no sympathy at all..agreed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theliberalvoice
I can argue whatever I want, you know?
Just because I don't expect a man who got me pregnant to pay does not mean he should not. I am more understand that way. He talked me at least before having sex and that is him being responsible.
Yeah I wasnt discouraging you from enjoying your argument...just curious thats all...no harm intended.
Where do you keep getting the impression that anyone is whining about a woman's right to abort a child? I WILL SAY IT AGAIN: A FEMALE'S RIGHT TO ABORT A CHILD IS GREAT. SHE SHOULD ABSOLUTELY EXERCISE THE RIGHT TO THAT CHOICE; wisely of course.
I am arguing on behalf of fathers who wish to abort their responsibility to an unwanted child.
Women should really quit whining about men not wanting to assume responsibility for a child they do not want, and either kill the child or shut up and deal with it..IMO
I completely agree with this...I think women should be careful if they dont want to have a child by a dad who wont take financial responsibility...If they know a man can turn into a deadbeat dad they should exercise much more discretion...absolutely no sympathy at all..agreed.
Yeah I wasnt discouraging you from enjoying your argument...just curious thats all...no harm intended.
Sorry-the abortion thing just goes hand in hand. I apologize.
And as far as men and their financial issues or whatever, they know the court will come after them. The justice system will come after them.
Might as well be smart and be careful who to have sex with.
Shut up and kill the child? Yep. Some do. Problem solved.
Perhaps you should understand something -- I realize that you're dancing around and creating dust. Spin those tires!
Nice comeback for your inability to comprehend.
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Originally Posted by OhBeeHave
Yes. Instead of giving your reasons, supporting them, you insult by suggesting that an individual can't comprehend what you've written. That's counterproductive to coming to an understanding. So is the little snarky facetious undertone in your above comment.
So instead of actually replying to me, you just whine about your feelings getting hurt?
I'm pretty sure nothing I saw is going to hurt you, just like nothing you say could affect me. Grow up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhBeeHave
Deadbeat dads do not pay. Absentee dads don't show up. Deadbeat dads can show up, but choose not to pay child support for any number of reasons.
Ok, I guess I'm not up to date on the terminology.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhBeeHave
An accidental pregnancy is not always chosen. Some people are against abortion for religious reasons -- they HAVE to have the baby. A chosen pregnancy sometimes ends in adoption. (FWIW I have family members who are grateful to several young women who chose life and adoption as opposed to abortion.)
Religious reasons are no cop out, its still a choice. Its not like if the man is religious, that stops the woman from having an abortion. So no religion doesn't count at all, it hold the same weight as any other reason to not have an abortion, its still a choice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhBeeHave
18 years of forced taxation? Call it what it is: Child support. Supporting your 50% contribution to the carbon based life form you've helped create. You're not supporting the woman. You are supporting the child. She should be paying the other 50%. I don't believe men should be left holding the entire child support bill. If she opted to carry to term against the partner's wishes, she should be paying half the support for the child.
Lol so you don't think that women get pregnant simply to get a fat check to support them for the rest of the child's life? I know you can't be that naive so maybe you are just denying it. Again, it comes down to a woman forcing a man to do something.
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Originally Posted by OhBeeHave
You used the term 'double standard'. I made the comparison on an earlier post that men also use a double standard on women.
So your argument is two wrongs make a right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhBeeHave
Contradictions left and right. Basically what you're saying is that men: 1) Don't want to be responsible for contraception and 2) wants control over what a woman choses to do with her body so that he can avoid paying child support. That doesn't sound very equal to me.
Again trying to put words in my mouth, wasn't as nice a try this time tho. I don't want men to be forced to pay child support for a baby they are not choosing to have. Women get a chance to make up for their mistake, men get none, that is not fair no matter how you look at it.
As I've said before, but you so conveniently seem to forget, men and women should share the responsibility of having safe sex, and have equal options if a mistake were to happen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhBeeHave
If a man does NOT want to become a father, he should be handling his contraception. What proof would he have otherwise that the contraceptive device wasn't tampered with?
This is you once again stating that men should be solely responsible for having safe sex. This is blatant sexism.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhBeeHave
Talk to me when you're older and have to pass a kidney stone. That tiny little urethra will burn like a mofo as that tiny stone takes a slow, painful journey on it's way out. I've seen men faint. I wish pregnancy and childbirth had been that easy.
That really sucks man
But I don't think having a kidney stone makes you any more knowledgeable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhBeeHave
Maybe you should tell your son what a financial burden he is. 6 down, 12 more years to go. Whether your half of the carbon based life form was wanted or not, you have to think about everyone else in addition to the child. Would you deny your parents the right to their grandchild?
Don't you ever talk about me and my son that way, you have absolutely no idea about my life or about our relationship. Its a real indication of what kind of scum you are that you would attack someone's relationship with their son, being absolutely ignorant of any details. You are disgusting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhBeeHave
Speaking of context, don't take my quote out of it.
"Life isn't Fair."
Now go and kiss your egg donor and thank God she CHOSE to have your son. I bet he's your shining star.
Whats the point of saying life isn't fair then? what part of life are you implying isn't fair? I'm pretty sure I was accurate when saying that you are admitting that a man's rights when it comes to his child are not fair. Theres nothing else that you could logically be referring to. But then again there isn't a lot of logic to anything you say.
In all fairness, I was addressing Nickle...but since we're on a roll....
I have never written that men are bad dads and women rule as parents. Yes, there are good and bad on both sides. The men who have custody should be receiving support from the mothers -- I believe I addressed 50/50 about a thread or two ago.
The undercurrent in your words says you want to be a dad, you've got the practice in child care, but when your time does come, you'll understand my perspective even more. (No disrespect intended.)
I do want to be a Dad, But I feel that if a woman has the right to abort then a man should have a form of abortion as well. Since the only role people care about these days is financial, then his abort option should be financial.
Oh, and no disrespect received. People who get over worked about this stuff and let it ruin their day need to drink a beer, smoke some grass or pop a pill...lol
I wasn't looking to be right, I was hoping to find some understanding and common ground.
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And the court will say the same thing to you. Should have thought about it before having sex with her. 
