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After they have served their time and paid their debt to society (even though they didn't 'borrow' anything by possessing drugs anyway), why do you think they should continue to be punished beyond what the law determined sufficient? Seems that you have a bit of a hang up here, a bias against people you don't know just because of a personal choice they made. They did nothing to you. Bottom line, if you have ever smoked tobacco or drank alcohol, then you are no different than any other drug user. It's just that there is an arbitrary discrimination against certain drugs, enforced by the law, and kept on the books despite their idiotic and hateful purpose, because of biased and hateful people like you.
Even once all races, women, and gays finally achieve equality and are no longer discriminated against, there will still be hate and discrimination against users of non-government-approved drugs. It's shameful.
This is my issue. They are a burden on society. Yes some have paid their dues either by fines, probation or jail. Because of their lack of care for themselves, their families and others around them, getting educated should not be handed to them. The guarenteed student loans should be for people who are law abiding people.
If you are a convicted anything, go to the bank and get a loan. If you do not qualify for a loan, then instead of spending money on the drugs, they could have putten it towards their education. Those are the people who acted stupidly I think is a word that the president has used in the past.
Bottom line, let them go to the Bank and get their Own loan for school.
You do realize that a drug conviction can be a very simple charge right? It doesn't mean you're out pawning moms silver to get a hit. A lot of kids in that age group make stupid decisions not realizing that it will affect them for the rest of their lives. And Stafford loans still come from banks...mine was through Suntrust.
I just don't agree with continuing to punish people once they have done whatever the courts mandated.
Sooooo..you want to exclude anyone who has had ever broken the law? Run a red light? Failed to register their car in time? Didn't pay their cable bill?
I would want to exclude anyone who has comitted a crime. A ticket is an infraction and not something that is on your "criminal record". Someone who did not pay their cable bill did not break a law unless it is a crime wherever you are. They just shut their service off. Now you are stretching.
After they have served their time and paid their debt to society (even though they didn't 'borrow' anything by possessing drugs anyway), why do you think they should continue to be punished beyond what the law determined sufficient? Seems that you have a bit of a hang up here, a bias against people you don't know just because of a personal choice they made. They did nothing to you. Bottom line, if you have ever smoked tobacco or drank alcohol, then you are no different than any other drug user. It's just that there is an arbitrary discrimination against certain drugs, enforced by the law, and kept on the books despite their idiotic and hateful purpose, because of biased and hateful people like you.
Even once all races, women, and gays finally achieve equality and are no longer discriminated against, there will still be hate and discrimination against users of non-government-approved drugs. It's shameful.
First off, let me ask this. Out of everyone answering and is pro them getting financial aid for school, let me ask how many people have worked in the court system in any capacity where you were in the courtroom all day. Not as a defendant, but worked there. I did. The courts do not set the punishment "most" of the time. A lot is set by the lawyers on both sides. They cut deals to get the case off the judge's docket. Ask anyone who has worked in a courtroom. It doesn't matter if they are hocking mom's good silver or using their own money. Breaking the law is Breaking the law, no matter how you cut or dice it up. You can sit there and justify that it is a petty crime. A crime is a crime. The only tobacco I ever smoked were cigars, which are "LEGAL". Did I ever drink? When I was 21, which at that point is "LEGAL" Whether it is idiotic for some drugs to be on the law books or not, the bottom line is it is on the books.
If you do not like the law, contact your congressperson and have them introduce a bill to change it. If it were legal, then nobody would be punished, but the FACT OF THE MATTER is it is illegal. Keep on justifying it in your head. Do I have a bias when it comes to this? Yes I do. Does it make me a bad person? Nope. Let them finance their own education. My building hires people with records. They all do really well here too. I have no problems with them working and making an honest living. My problem is in this thread when it comes to funding for school. Let them get their own private loan. Not my problem they "made a small mistake" as you make it seem and got caught. That is their own dumb mistake and they have to live with that for the rest of their life.
How about medical students who get caught with a joint and go to court. If convicted on any level, they are booted from Medical School even after they "paid their debt". Heck, a Judge in Florida got busted (sat on for the Anna Nicole case", paid his debt and is no longer a judge.
Location: Partisanship Is An Intellectual/Emotional Handicap
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bentlebee
College students convicted of drug possession may soon get access to federal student loans due to a little-noticed provision in the 181-page Student Aid and Fiscal Responsibility Act of 2009.
The provision would reverse a 1998 amendment that made students convicted of drug-possession ineligible to receive federal funding unless they completed a rehabilitation program and passed two unannounced drug tests. Students convicted of dealing drugs would continue to be prohibited from receiving financial aid.
Under Obama more money is wasted....wow, great...if you have a son or daughter who doesn't qualify...maybe get them on drugs and they will qualify... Is this what American wants?
This is a good move. A positive move.
Losing your funding because you were caught with a few joints, is plain stupid and archaic. It doesn't solve anything. It only creates a down sprial of more problems.
Good move. One of the few I agree with, from this administration.
College students convicted of drug possession may soon get access to federal student loans due to a little-noticed provision in the 181-page Student Aid and Fiscal Responsibility Act of 2009.
The provision would reverse a 1998 amendment that made students convicted of drug-possession ineligible to receive federal funding unless they completed a rehabilitation program and passed two unannounced drug tests. Students convicted of dealing drugs would continue to be prohibited from receiving financial aid.
Under Obama more money is wasted....wow, great...if you have a son or daughter who doesn't qualify...maybe get them on drugs and they will qualify... Is this what American wants?
Something you should check out is the Americans with Disabilities Act, you can be classified as disabled because of a drug problem therefore able to get SSI benefits including money for school. Thats been going on for years, I used to know a guy in college who went through school just that way.
Lets not put it all at Obama's door when its been going on for a LONG time.
First off, let me ask this. Out of everyone answering and is pro them getting financial aid for school, let me ask how many people have worked in the court system in any capacity where you were in the courtroom all day. Not as a defendant, but worked there. I did. The courts do not set the punishment "most" of the time. A lot is set by the lawyers on both sides. They cut deals to get the case off the judge's docket. Ask anyone who has worked in a courtroom. It doesn't matter if they are hocking mom's good silver or using their own money. Breaking the law is Breaking the law, no matter how you cut or dice it up. You can sit there and justify that it is a petty crime. A crime is a crime. The only tobacco I ever smoked were cigars, which are "LEGAL". Did I ever drink? When I was 21, which at that point is "LEGAL" Whether it is idiotic for some drugs to be on the law books or not, the bottom line is it is on the books.
If you do not like the law, contact your congressperson and have them introduce a bill to change it. If it were legal, then nobody would be punished, but the FACT OF THE MATTER is it is illegal. Keep on justifying it in your head. Do I have a bias when it comes to this? Yes I do. Does it make me a bad person? Nope. Let them finance their own education. My building hires people with records. They all do really well here too. I have no problems with them working and making an honest living. My problem is in this thread when it comes to funding for school. Let them get their own private loan. Not my problem they "made a small mistake" as you make it seem and got caught. That is their own dumb mistake and they have to live with that for the rest of their life.
How about medical students who get caught with a joint and go to court. If convicted on any level, they are booted from Medical School even after they "paid their debt". Heck, a Judge in Florida got busted (sat on for the Anna Nicole case", paid his debt and is no longer a judge.
That's the way it is. Deal with it.
Actually, the way it is will be that drug offenders will now be able to borrow money for college. That will be the law and that is what people will have to deal with. The olnly reason this thread is lasting this long is because they obviously can't.
Why the hell shouldnt drug offenders be given a chance to rebuild their life? What, if a person is convicted of a drug offense, they are then limited to never being able to acheive an education and get a chance at life?
That will only make sure they are more likely to reoffend. I cant beleive any rational human being would object to this. Next people will be complaining about the taxes paid to these nonviolent drug offenders (if you dont want to pay for them, dont make their actions, which hurt no one but themselves, illegal!)
Why the hell shouldnt drug offenders be given a chance to rebuild their life? What, if a person is convicted of a drug offense, they are then limited to never being able to acheive an education and get a chance at life?
That will only make sure they are more likely to reoffend. I cant beleive any rational human being would object to this. Next people will be complaining about the taxes paid to these nonviolent drug offenders (if you dont want to pay for them, dont make their actions, which hurt no one but themselves, illegal!)
The only conclusion I can come to are all of the people that feel so strongly that they should get aid are either illegal drug users themselves or someone who has been convicted of something.
Stop reading too much into what I am saying. I am not saying they should not be allowed to go to school. I am very much so for education for ALL. What I am against are people who break the law be given the same opportunity like me, or someone else who has followed the law, meaning any criminal law.
Let them get a job, put money away and pay for school. Let them get in with an employer that may offer tuition assistance. I don't know if they changed the application process for jobs, but it only says have you been convicted...if there is a with held of ajudication, that is not an ajudication, so you can check no unless employers changed the language.
There are tools out there for them. They just have to work a bit harder, that is all. Yes, even for a small, tiny, weenie, little mistake as most of you make it.
Let them get a job, put money away and pay for school. Let them get in with an employer that may offer tuition assistance. I don't know if they changed the application process for jobs, but it only says have you been convicted...if there is a with held of ajudication, that is not an ajudication, so you can check no unless employers changed the language.
It takes DECADES to put away enough money even for public school without federal grants and loan assistance. This effectively means they cannot achieve.
Also, in todays market, you CANT find a job that pays enough to live on (let alone save anything) without a college degree. And Im talking BA, not AA. I know countless people out there with Masters degrees who are looking for jobs.
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