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Old 10-12-2009, 05:43 PM
 
Location: between Ath,GR & Mia,FL...
2,574 posts, read 2,488,111 times
Reputation: 327

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Guys,if I can help u,try to get this...

As an...ex european,I only know it well,

Euro socialised medicine is

A DREAM on paper,

a NIGHTMARE in reality...

a DOLL on the outside

a MONSTER on the inside...

I hope some people get the message

 
Old 10-12-2009, 05:48 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
8,998 posts, read 14,787,921 times
Reputation: 3550
Quote:
Originally Posted by harrymiafl View Post
Guys,if I can help u,try to get this...

As an...ex european,I only know it well,

Euro socialised medicine is

A DREAM on paper,

a NIGHTMARE in reality...

a DOLL on the outside

a MONSTER on the inside...

I hope some people get the message
You do realize not every European country has the same health care system?
Can you be more specific about in which country you had this "nightmare" experience?
What was so bad?

No system is perfect but we have a lot to learn from other countries.

Most Patients Happy With German Health Care : NPR

Compare International Medical Bills : NPR

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/s...oryId=92102835

Health Care for All : NPR
 
Old 10-12-2009, 06:03 PM
 
Location: between Ath,GR & Mia,FL...
2,574 posts, read 2,488,111 times
Reputation: 327
The euro people are sheep,so yes,when they are milked they are happy...

They pay 22% sales tax,150 % gas tax & not only they don't revolt but they don't even complain...
 
Old 10-12-2009, 07:07 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
8,998 posts, read 14,787,921 times
Reputation: 3550
Quote:
Originally Posted by harrymiafl View Post
The euro people are sheep,so yes,when they are milked they are happy...

They pay 22% sales tax,150 % gas tax & not only they don't revolt but they don't even complain...
Maybe some people don't mind paying more for gas. Besides, their vehicles are more fuel efficient and they aren't as dependent on cars as we are.

In France the people regularly protest and the government responds.

Europe is a very large continent so please don't make it sounds like all Europeans are the same.
 
Old 10-12-2009, 07:16 PM
 
7,930 posts, read 9,154,161 times
Reputation: 9345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jill61 View Post
Oh for crying out loud. Look at the actual title of that piece.

Insurance industry assails health care bill

Of COURSE they're going to be fighting this bill.

And then the very first line: "Insurance companies aren't playing nice any more on the health care overhaul." When were they ever????

"The industry put out a report Monday concluding that the Senate's health care legislation would drive up costs to consumers. . . " And you'd rely on any report being put out by the very industry that stands to lose big time when this reform passes? Are you serious? GMAB.

How far down the article did you bother to read? This is only the 3rd full paragraph:
AARP loves this bill as it curtails Medicare advantage programs(thereby increasing out of pocket expenses and decreasing benefits), forcing seniors to buy supplemental plans which......AARP just happens to sell. Gee, think they've got a financial interest in this as well?

Common sense would tell you that a bill which will greatly reduce the number of people buying private health insurance will make the inusurance companies jack up the premiums for the next 3 years they will actually be in business. They are going to look to make as much money as possible. The big question is why didn't our leaders have enough sense to include a provision which gives the govt the right to cap the increase in premium the companies could raise each year?

Poorly written bill with many unintended consequences to follow. Huge increases in premiums for the next 3 years. Big time cuts to Medicare from next year on. No prexisting conditions means we'll ALL pay the highest premiums. Just look at NY and MA; that is EXACTLY what has happened when they eliminated preexisting conditions. They are now 2 of the worst states to purchase health insurance in.
 
Old 10-12-2009, 09:41 PM
 
Location: Illinois Delta
5,767 posts, read 5,015,185 times
Reputation: 2063
Quote:
Originally Posted by fopt65 View Post
What proof do you have that Stephen Hawking would have been instituitionalized under the American Health System? I work with the disabled. People with Mr Hawking's disability (ALS or generally Motor Neuron Disease) are quite commonly provided care at home with the same communication device and power wheelchairs he currently uses. Mr Hawking has been relatively lucky that his disease hasn't progressed as rapidly as other cases of ALS.
************************************************** *********
Stephen Hawking was born in 1942; the marvelous wheelchairs that enable him to lead as normal a life as he does weren't around. Physical rehab was
virtually unknown, and the medicines which Dr. Hawking takes were undiscovered for the greater part of his life. He would have had a wooden
wheelchair and would have been unable to communicate. It's highly possible that he would have been institutionalized in the U.S. However, by the time he was 6 England had adopted cradle-to-the-grave health care, and from that point to the present he has had quality treatment. In the U.S., in contrast, he would have had to belong to a very wealthy family indeed to receive what was routine in England.
 
Old 10-12-2009, 10:01 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,759,995 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by MotleyCrew View Post
I am wondering how many insurance related jobs will be lost when they go out of business trying to compete with the government. We have 8 million jobs lost since the beginning of the recession, why not make it 16 million.
Somebody is going to have to administer benefits under any system. Do you support buggy whip manufacturers, too?
 
Old 10-13-2009, 06:30 AM
 
7,930 posts, read 9,154,161 times
Reputation: 9345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evenstar51 View Post
************************************************** *********
Stephen Hawking was born in 1942; the marvelous wheelchairs that enable him to lead as normal a life as he does weren't around. Physical rehab was
virtually unknown, and the medicines which Dr. Hawking takes were undiscovered for the greater part of his life. He would have had a wooden
wheelchair and would have been unable to communicate. It's highly possible that he would have been institutionalized in the U.S. However, by the time he was 6 England had adopted cradle-to-the-grave health care, and from that point to the present he has had quality treatment. In the U.S., in contrast, he would have had to belong to a very wealthy family indeed to receive what was routine in England.
Have any links to substantiate your opinion?
Physical Rehab started after WWI, and while it wasn't as advanced as it is now, it was available. BTW Hawking was diagnosed with ALS in 1963 at the age of 21.
Stephen Hawking

Physical Rehab was able to provide appropriate (and similar to England )wheelchairs and other equipment for those who suffered from another motor neuron disease that was far more prevalent than ALS. Ever hear of polio?

Only 5% of people diagnosed with ALS liveup to 10 years with the disease. Prof. Hawking is clearly an positive abnormality. BTW he was getting in and out of bed independemtly 16 years after diagnosis and was talking up to 1985 when he had to undergo a tracheostomy. He has used a ventilator since then.....something many of my patients here in the US use as well.

His story is inspirational. His case is excellent to study to see why he was able to last this long with having this horrible disease. But to claim the only reason he has lasted this long is because of the NHS is disingenuous.

Stephen Hawking: how does motor neurone disease work? - Telegraph
 
Old 10-13-2009, 07:17 AM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
8,998 posts, read 14,787,921 times
Reputation: 3550
Quote:
Originally Posted by fopt65 View Post
AARP loves this bill as it curtails Medicare advantage programs(thereby increasing out of pocket expenses and decreasing benefits), forcing seniors to buy supplemental plans which......AARP just happens to sell. Gee, think they've got a financial interest in this as well?

Common sense would tell you that a bill which will greatly reduce the number of people buying private health insurance will make the inusurance companies jack up the premiums for the next 3 years they will actually be in business. They are going to look to make as much money as possible. The big question is why didn't our leaders have enough sense to include a provision which gives the govt the right to cap the increase in premium the companies could raise each year?

Poorly written bill with many unintended consequences to follow. Huge increases in premiums for the next 3 years. Big time cuts to Medicare from next year on. No prexisting conditions means we'll ALL pay the highest premiums. Just look at NY and MA; that is EXACTLY what has happened when they eliminated preexisting conditions. They are now 2 of the worst states to purchase health insurance in.
As far as I know, there is a provision in one or two of the bills that caps premium increases and there is a provision that caps out of pocket costs.
 
Old 10-13-2009, 07:23 AM
 
Location: Tampa Florida
22,229 posts, read 17,855,263 times
Reputation: 4585
Reviewing the issue leads me to simplify my opinion down to the following: Who's for a Public Option: AMA, AARP,DEMS Who's against a Public Option:PHARMA,INS COS,REPS We can throw out the Reps and Dems as we pretty much all know that their ONE, and ONLY, objective is to do whatever they think will help them keep or gain seats in the next election. As for the others, well, just think about where their respective objectives lie. In my mind, that kind of boils it down and makes it simple to form an opinion.
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