Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
To determine which "ism" is which, consider the following:
COMMUNISM - the ownership of property, or means of production, distribution and supply, by the whole of a classless society, with wealth shared on the principle of 'to each according to his need', each yielding fully 'according to his ability'.
- - - Webster's Dictionary.
SOCIALISM - A political and economic theory advocating collective ownership of the means of production and control of distribution. It is based upon the belief that all, while contributing to the good of the community, are equally entitled to the care and protection which the community can provide.
--- Webster's dictionary
Socialism and its cousin, communism, are diametrically opposed to absolute ownership by individuals. They will only tolerate qualified ownership, shared with the State, and you know who has the superior claim...
In case you weren't aware, they told us exactly what they planned.
From the Communist manifesto:
"In this sense, the theory of the Communists may be summed up in the single sentence: Abolition of private property."
Most Americans would be surprised to learn that private property rights were abolished by voluntary enrollment into national socialism (aka Socialist InSecurity).
PRIVATE PROPERTY - "As protected from being taken for public uses, is such property as belongs absolutely to an individual, and of which he has the exclusive right of disposition. Property of a specific, fixed and tangible nature, capable of being in possession and transmitted to another, such as houses, lands, and chattels."
- - - Black's Law dictionary, sixth ed., p.1217
Amendment V, US Constitution 1789
... nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
GOOD! The USCON explicitly promises to honor our private property rights, that collectivists seek to abolish.
BAD! Since 1935, most Americans surrendered their private property rights via voluntary participation in national socialism (via Socialist InSecurity Act of 1935).
What about FASCISM?
FASCISM - any political or social ideology of the extreme right which relies on a combination of pseudo-religious attitudes and the brutal use of force for getting and keeping power.
- - - Webster's Dictionary
The major characteristics of "Fascism" :
* EXTREME RIGHT
* PSEUDO-RELIGIOUS
* BRUTAL
Let's consider the wing with which people are associated with, when speaking of political partisanship.
LEFT WING - the section of a political party, government or group that holds the most left or radical views.
- - - Webster's Dictionary
RIGHT WING - the section of a political party, government or group that holding the views of the Right.
- - - Webster's Dictionary
THE RIGHT - that section of a political party ... which associates itself with traditional authority or opinion and which in legislative bodies is seated traditionally to the right of the presiding officer.
- - - Webster's Dictionary
THE LEFT - that section of a political party ... which differs most from traditional authority or opinion and which in legislative bodies is seated traditionally to the left of the presiding officer.
- - - Webster's Dictionary
Is that clear?
Left = opposition to traditional authority
Right = support of traditional authority
True "Fascism" would have to be in support of "traditional" authority, using brutality and pseudo-religious behavior.
Did Hitler and Mussolini support "Traditional authority" in their respective nations? Or did they OPPOSE it?
I believe the evidence shows that the "Fascists" of WW2 were actually LEFT WING pirates, and were opposed to the people's absolute right to own themselves, their labor and the fruits of their labor.
D'Oh!
Whatever label one contemplates for BHO, would it be accurate to say that he has not shown his staunch support for the people's right to keep their wealth and property from the tax man?
But we cannot blame him! Remember, WE all volunteered...
(Coincidentally, when I ask the government for the official procedure to volunteer out of national socialism, they will not answer.)
BHO perhaps accepts the validity of the notions of the "velocity of money," the "marginal utilitity of wealth," and the macroeconomic concept of the "multiplier effect." The first two are part of an argument in favor of progressive taxation and redistribution of wealth. The third is part of an argument in favor of stimulating demand, by the government if necessary, especially for certain key economic sectors.
Perhaps you do not accept the validity of these economic notions.
The Nazis were a RIGHT WING phenomenon both culturally and structurally. They used religion and mythic concepts to express national history and national goals and preserved private property yet at the same time were totalitarian by disenfranchising leftists, homosexuals, Jews, and other minorities. The Nazis compromised the independence of the private sector of the economy while operating under an emergency war footing and forced it to do the Nazi party's bidding.
Last edited by ParkTwain; 09-08-2009 at 02:47 AM..
BHO perhaps accepts the validity of the notions of the [1] "velocity of money," the "marginal utilitity of wealth," and the macroeconomic concept of the "multiplier effect." The first two are part of an argument in favor of [2] progressive taxation and redistribution of wealth. The third is part of an argument in favor of stimulating demand, by the government if necessary, especially for certain key economic sectors.
Perhaps you do not accept the validity of these economic notions.
The Nazis were a RIGHT WING phenomenon both culturally and structurally. They used religion and mythic concepts to express national history and national goals and [3] preserved private property yet at the same time were totalitarian by disenfranchising leftists, homosexuals, Jews, and other minorities. The Nazis compromised the independence of the private sector of the economy while operating under an emergency war footing and forced it to do the Nazi party's bidding.
[1] Velocity of money is a nice buzz word, but when you have usury gumming up things, it won't help. Usury is mathematically impossible to pay in any finite money token system. With long term usury, the flaw is immediately obvious. With short term usury, the effects are manifest by the proportion of debtors who default simply because enough money never existed with which to pay all outstanding usury.
[2] Any socialist taxation, based on taking from one to give to another, is anathema to American law, and the explicit protection of private property. Of course, since the compact with FICA (and the international totalization treaty) allows the government to ignore the constitution, it's moot.
[3] Since private property rights were not secured by the NAZIs/ Fascists, they were not in support of "Tradition" as in "Thou Shalt Not Steal". The truth was that they were collectivists, of a different flavor from the socialists of the USSR (who never achieved communism).
----------
National debt: 11.8 trillion dollars compute to a legal obligation to pay 590 billion ounces of gold stamped into coin.
World wide supply 5.5 billion ounces.
D'oh!
Gibberish. Maybe your responses are generated by a computer program. You have invented the term "socialist taxation"; there is no such thing. Taxes have existed in America, its laws, and its Constitution since America's founding.
America's progressive taxation system is thoroughly consistent with modern economic theory as regarding the velocity of money and roles of consumption versus savings in the economy. A concentration of wealth de facto slows the velocity of the economy's money supply, thereby reducing the economy's potential growth. Redistribution of wealth toward those who will tend to spend it helps the economy to grow at a faster rate for longer periods of time.
I don't think you understand the notion of the "velocity of money." The banking activity of lending *increases the money supply* but not the velocity of the money supply.
Last edited by ParkTwain; 09-08-2009 at 03:52 AM..
You know what, I voted for McCain, I was/am strongly opposed to taxpayer money going to bailouts, I have grave misgivings about the proposed health care reform. But, as a moderate Republican, I am embarrased by the rantings and ravings emanating from these so-called conservative commentators as well as by some of the drivel posted on here.
Keep it up, you are doing a nice job of driving moderates into the Obama camp.
Come on, America, which is it? To tar-and-feather a politician, you only need one bucket, not three!
Exactly. But to ignoramuses who have no clue what any of these words really mean, it is easy to use them interchangeably. Whatever term the last person they listened to used, they just repeat.
I should add that this is such an embarrassment to our whole country. They're making all of us appear like some kind of uneducated, backwoods, toothless, hicks. Thanks.
Come on, America, which is it? To tar-and-feather a politician, you only need one bucket, not three!
So all people who claim a type of political philosophy all think the same? You think in very narrow terms of black and white.
Can GW Bush be a republican, but also be in favor of some socialist programs, like prescription drugs and Head Start, or push his form of comprehensive immigration reform, or even be fiscally unsound and spend money like a drunken sailor? Do all republicans and democrats think alike, do they always agree?
If 0bama has a vision of where he wants to take the country, he can use whatever bits and pieces of socialism, capitalism, Marxism, or Fascism that he feels will help him attain his ultimate goal. Once he gets the country their, he can set about dismantling those pieces he no longer needs.
Stalin was also a fascist and Hitler was also a socialist. Stalin invaded other countries such as Poland, deriving fascist war policies. Similarly, Hitler adopted strict price controls and arrested/executed anyone who tried to publish information on just how bad deficits were or anyone who tried to conduct back alley black market transactions. When your own neighbor can rat you out for selling a loaf of bread for gold instead of Reichmarks, it would behoove you to obey.
Once you can get your little head wrapped around these consistent analogies, then you'll understand. You can be both fascist and socialist at the same time, just as Bush was a socialist and fascist depending on the policies, and just as Obama is both.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
