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Old 10-07-2009, 05:19 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
88,969 posts, read 44,780,079 times
Reputation: 13677

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Quote:
Originally Posted by padcrasher View Post
You just have no idea what your are talking about.

The cuts are not in Medicare but Medicare Advantage....a government plan that costs tax payers 14% more per patient. Those under medicare Advantage can still go to the regular Medicare plan.
Perhaps you should look into that further - yes, it would cost taxpayers less, but moving from the Medicare Advantage plans to regular Medicare IS a reduction in health care benefits for senior citizens.

Furthermore, low-income and minority senior citizens would be the most negatively impacted by reducing Medicare Advantage benefits.

The NAACP's position on Medicare Advantage here:
austin360.com (http://www.austin360.com/blogs/content/shared-blogs/washington/medicare_monitor/entries/2007/03/15/naacp_backs_medicare_advantage.html - broken link)

Study - Value of Medicare Advantage to Low-Income and Minority Medicare Beneficiaries, Emory University:
http://www.bcbs.com/issues/medicaid/research/Value-of-Medicare-Advantage-to-Low-Income-and-Minority-Medicare-Beneficiaries.pdf (broken link)
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Old 10-07-2009, 05:21 PM
 
Location: S.E. US
13,163 posts, read 1,687,867 times
Reputation: 5132
Quote:
Originally Posted by padcrasher View Post
You just have no idea what your are talking about.

The cuts are not in Medicare but Medicare Advantage....a government plan that costs tax payers 14% more per patient. Those under medicare Advantage can still go to the regular Medicare plan.

[ These haters are even against the parts of the plan that save taxpayers Money!]
Actually the cuts ARE in Medicare. $400B reduction in benefits. As it is, the number of reported claims rejected/denied by Medicare is well over 425,000 per year. What will those seniors do who have additional cuts in Medicare?
Better yet, consider this: What will YOU do if you are in a Medicare type plan (the goal is to make the public option a Medicare type plan for everyone), and the number of rejected/denied claims triples or worse as a result, and yours is among them?

About $180B are expected in "savings" by cutting out the Advantage plans.
Of course, that doesn't take into consideration that seniors will end up with higher medical costs, which effectively is a tax (plus, their premiums will also most likely go up, not down). As it is, seniors sometimes have to forego medical care or appointments due to existing costs - all of which works against the laudable goal of emphasizing preventive care.

As for " the Congressional Budget Office's report the bill would reduce the number of uninsured people in the United States by about 29 million by the year 2019." That's not possible. The projection by those who are taking a closer look at the CBO numbers reveals that the opposite will be true - the country will still have some 25 million uninsured, about a third of them illegal aliens who will continue to enter the country.

InformedConsent, you are right on!

(we were writing at the same time).
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Old 10-07-2009, 05:22 PM
 
Location: The Great State of Texas, Finally!
5,475 posts, read 12,240,734 times
Reputation: 2820
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Perhaps you should look into that further - yes, it would cost taxpayers less, but moving from the Medicare Advantage plans to regular Medicare IS a reduction in health care benefits for senior citizens.

Furthermore, low-income and minority senior citizens would be the most negatively impacted by reducing Medicare Advantage benefits.

The NAACP's position on Medicare Advantage here:
austin360.com (http://www.austin360.com/blogs/content/shared-blogs/washington/medicare_monitor/entries/2007/03/15/naacp_backs_medicare_advantage.html - broken link)

Study - Value of Medicare Advantage to Low-Income and Minority Medicare Beneficiaries, Emory University:
http://www.bcbs.com/issues/medicaid/research/Value-of-Medicare-Advantage-to-Low-Income-and-Minority-Medicare-Beneficiaries.pdf (broken link)

Don't waste your time. These people aren't able to view anything critically. They put up straw arguements like Iraq vs healthcare and want the govt to pay for everything. Just let it go. Arguing with idiots is draining.
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Old 10-07-2009, 05:23 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,052 posts, read 84,442,711 times
Reputation: 27720
Wait..those seniors took the Advantage plan because they couldn't afford medicare by itself.
Now what do they do ?
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Old 10-07-2009, 05:31 PM
 
48,502 posts, read 96,816,250 times
Reputation: 18304
It still has a long ways to go.IMO the public optio will be introduced as a amendmnet but fail and Obama will sign the bill if it gets that far.This bill came to be because the public opiton and cost is what kiled the clinto bill last time and the democratic lewadership knows that.
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Old 10-07-2009, 05:41 PM
 
13,186 posts, read 14,972,499 times
Reputation: 4555
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Perhaps you should look into that further - yes, it would cost taxpayers less, but moving from the Medicare Advantage plans to regular Medicare IS a reduction in health care benefits for senior citizens.

Furthermore, low-income and minority senior citizens would be the most negatively impacted by reducing Medicare Advantage benefits.

The NAACP's position on Medicare Advantage here:
austin360.com (http://www.austin360.com/blogs/content/shared-blogs/washington/medicare_monitor/entries/2007/03/15/naacp_backs_medicare_advantage.html - broken link)

Study - Value of Medicare Advantage to Low-Income and Minority Medicare Beneficiaries, Emory University:
http://www.bcbs.com/issues/medicaid/research/Value-of-Medicare-Advantage-to-Low-Income-and-Minority-Medicare-Beneficiaries.pdf (broken link)
Incredible! You still have no idea what you are talking about.

Medicare Advantage requires that Seniors pay more thus making it popular with only the most well off senior citizens!

77% of senior citizens have the plain old Medicare plan already.

Poor little right wingers are so concerned about well off Senior citizens having to go to plain ole Medicare which would save taxpayers money! Whaaaaaaaaaaah!
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Old 10-07-2009, 05:54 PM
 
Location: S.E. US
13,163 posts, read 1,687,867 times
Reputation: 5132
Quote:
Originally Posted by padcrasher View Post
Incredible! You still have no idea what you are talking about.

Medicare Advantage requires that Seniors pay more thus making it popular with only the most well off senior citizens!

77% of senior citizens have the plain old Medicare plan already.

Poor little right wingers are so concerned about well off Senior citizens having to go to plain ole Medicare which would save taxpayers money! Whaaaaaaaaaaah!
Incredible, indeed. You have no idea.

Medicare Advantage plans serve those citizens who CANNOT afford the supplemental plans, such as sold by AARP. AARP does not sell Adantage plans. That is why AARP is in favor of eliminating them. They are hoping to pick up some of those seniors into their Supplemental plans, which ARE for the seniors who are better off financially. Those who can't afford AARP plans, get into Advantage plans (and some plans cost as little as $20/month). Those who can't afford even that, stick with straight Medicare and hope for the best. However, just one hospitalization can wipe out their savings or emergency fund and certinly curtail their prescription purchases (thanks to the government for their support of pharmaceutical companies, some seniors have to buy their prescriptions every other month, or forego them entirely - esp. since Dems just blocked another GOP effort to give them access to the same medicines in Canada).

There are places where savings could be realized, but the Government is not looking in the right places. They're just looking out for themselves and their lobbyists.
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Old 10-07-2009, 05:55 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
88,969 posts, read 44,780,079 times
Reputation: 13677
Quote:
Originally Posted by padcrasher View Post
Incredible! You still have no idea what you are talking about.

Medicare Advantage requires that Seniors pay more thus making it popular with only the most well off senior citizens!

77% of senior citizens have the plain old Medicare plan already.

Poor little right wingers are so concerned about well off Senior citizens having to go to plain ole Medicare which would save taxpayers money! Whaaaaaaaaaaah!
You didn't read the NAACP's fax to Congress, or the Emory U study, did you? Funny how neither has anything at all to do with how cutting Medicare Advantage negatively impacts 'the most well off senior citizens.'

Whoever is giving you your talking points is deliberately misleading you. Cut the umbilical cord, and research and think for yourself.
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Old 10-07-2009, 05:59 PM
 
103 posts, read 118,417 times
Reputation: 46
Gee, another bill from congress that doesn't have solid financing, enriches big business and screws over a segment of our society without even solving the original premise for the bill. What a shocker.
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Old 10-07-2009, 06:02 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland
41,325 posts, read 44,929,215 times
Reputation: 7118
Quote:
Originally Posted by cobolt View Post
Read very carefully! It says "won't add to the DEFICIT", Not the DEBT. The DEFICIT is the shortfall that ADDS TO THE DEBT every day. So in other words, this bill will continue to add to the debt like eveything else congress does.
$829 Billion - where do they get the money?

Taxes on individuals, taxes on everybody with good insurance (the unions won't go for that), cutting Medicare and mandating Medicaid increases for the states, meaning more taxes.
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