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Well, that sort of depends on what the people were arrested for doesn't it? Let's say 10 white guys are arrested today. 2 charged with driving without a license, 4 charged with DWI, 1 charged with a bad check, and 3 charged with grand larceny. Now, out of those 10, only 3 would probably ever see any prison time because their crime doesn't warrant a prison term unless they violate the probation they will inevitably be put on.
Now, the same day, 10 black men are arrested. 2 for driving without license, 2 for DWI, 1 with bad checks, and 5 for grand larceny. Now obviously, there will be more black men going to prison for crimes today than white men. Is it because of their race? No. It's because of their crimes. I use this example for one reason only. I am sick of hearing the race card played on every issue that confronts Americans. Those men are in prison for a reason, and it isn't because of the white man's bias. It is because they committed the crime and they are doing the time. And if my hypothetical situation above were switched, then more white men would go to prison because of that day's crimes. Racism exists, and it is a blight on society. But so is crime, and if there happen to be more black men and women committing prison worthy crimes then that's just how it is. You have a right to trial by a jury of your peers if you choose. And if you did the crime, you will do the time. No matter your race, color, or creed. That is, unless you are rich enough to get out of it.
Thank you soooo much, my sentiments exactly!
It is just a fact that blacks commit FAR more crimes than any other race. That is evident by crime statistics as well as prison population.
I hate the excuses and the hypotheticals. Numbers do not lie
Furthermore there are MANY Black neighborhoods I wouldn't walk through DURING the DAY for fear of getting hurt
Many poor white neighborhoods or Trailer parks are much safer at 3 am in the morning than most black neighborhoods at 3pm in the afternoon
I dont need statistics to tell me that
Many of you and many ppl in general feel the same exact way I do. But I believe some conscious or pressures ppl have with themselves to not come off as racist tend to make people defend the notions that blacks are simply more dangerous than any other race by giving excuses (slavery, discrimination) and hypotheticals (Well maybe blacks are PUT in jail more but not commiting more crimes! OR MAYBE THE POLICE ARE TARGETING BLACKS....WHAT?!)
Anyone who disagrees with me how about we walk through some of these "Friendly" black Neighborhoods and ghettos in New Orleans, Detroit ,etc... and see if you come out alive....
This Political Correctness crap would end real quickly!
Also I work for the Department of Justice and I know alot about the law
Then you should know better before supporting a guilty before innocent attitude of the "perpetrator".. One might take your postings and send them to the head of your department to prove you should be fired.
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2flyy
I want you to show me a law that would charge or a case that has charged an individual for attempting to help a child (or any person) in distress (or what the person believed to be distressed)?
Charges have been filed all over the place for similar reactions. Some individuals shoot those who burglarize their home, and have had charges filed for protecting their own family members. To pretend it doesnt happen is rediculous. Had these individuals detained the man in question, false imprisonment is just charge that could have been filed against them. The fact that they BELIEVED the girl was in distress would be extenuating circumstances that would come into evidence during a trail as a possible defense, but prosecutors and juries could have simply discounted the "excuse" as a bs made up story and could have thought they were trying to rob the mans wallet (had that been what the man claimed)
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2flyy
You're simply dead wrong on what you have been repeating throughout this thread....if those young men would have attacked that man for believing the little girl was being kidnapped. They would have never been charged with a crime.
So now we have the I'm to stupid to know better defense. I attacked that man because I thought he was kidnapping a little girl and not considered the fact that she could have been the dauther in law, the foster child etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2flyy
Again prove me wrong by citing any case
Secondly I was asking you if you were not around (NOT if you were around of course you would help your own child) and if your child was being kidnapped. I know for a fact all the arguments you are making here (that they assumed and should have found out)
You would not hope that people acted that way to your child. You would want them to react immediately.
If I was walking down the street holding my adopted daughter while she yelled "your not my daddy", I wouldnt expect to be attacked because people thought I'm guilty before finding out the truth.
Calling the police IMO is doing nothing b/c by the time the cops showed up Little Elizabeth Smart would've been gone.
For example if I see you hanging off a cliff and about to fall, if I call the police instead of reaching out and risking myself to save you
Then I am not trying to save you
I am effectively doing nothing
Heroes react and try and save the individual
If you see me hanging off a cliff and choose to help me, and you find out afterwards that I was really standing on a ledge and not in danger, you cant go to jail and there wouldnt be an investigation as to you not saving me.
If however I'm standing on a bridge and you rush over to try to save me, and thereby pushing me off the bridge, even by accident, and it turns out that I work for the bridge inspection company and I was doing an inspection to verify its safety, you indeed could have violated the law.
There is a difference between imminent danger, and perceived danger, and in many states finding an individual you dont know in your own home, and perceiving a danger to the point that you shoot them, does indeed get you charged especially if you shoot the individual in the back. Finding out later that they were a police officer who came to the house to check and make sure you ok doesnt mean that you didnt shoot him and didnt violate laws.
Then you should know better before supporting a guilty before innocent attitude of the "perpetrator".. One might take your postings and send them to the head of your department to prove you should be fired.
Charges have been filed all over the place for similar reactions. Some individuals shoot those who burglarize their home, and have had charges filed for protecting their own family members. To pretend it doesnt happen is rediculous. Had these individuals detained the man in question, false imprisonment is just charge that could have been filed against them. The fact that they BELIEVED the girl was in distress would be extenuating circumstances that would come into evidence during a trail as a possible defense, but prosecutors and juries could have simply discounted the "excuse" as a bs made up story and could have thought they were trying to rob the mans wallet (had that been what the man claimed)
So now we have the twinking defense. I attacked that man because I thought he was kidnapping a little girl that could possibly have been his daughter.
If I was walking down the street holding my adopted daughter while she yelled "your not my daddy", I wouldnt expect to be attacked because people thought I'm guilty before finding out the truth.
Dude you are so off-base its ridiculous. Take a nice look at the Good Samaritan laws (which addresses many things) but also points out things that are relevant to our discussion. For example
"prevents a rescuer who has voluntarily helped a victim in distress from being successfully sued for 'wrongdoing'. Its purpose is to keep people from being reluctant to help a stranger in need for fear of legal repercussions if they were to make some mistake"
****Also read the last question again because you keep answering under the wrong pretense. I wasnt asking you if you were the suspect. I am asking you if if was YOUR CHILD (and you're at home or something) and ppl see YOUR CHILD potentially being kidnapped by someone else
I know for a fact you would not be hoping bystanders stand there 10 mins trying to think of whats going on or being scared of being prosecuted.
You would hope they reacted to save your child.
Right?****
Thank you soooo much, my sentiments exactly!
It is just a fact that blacks commit FAR more crimes than any other race. That is evident by crime statistics as well as prison population.
I hate the excuses and the hypotheticals. Numbers do not lie
Furthermore there are MANY Black neighborhoods I wouldn't walk through DURING the DAY for fear of getting hurt
Many poor white neighborhoods or Trailer parks are much safer at 3 am in the morning than most black neighborhoods
I dont need statistics to tell me that
Many of you and many ppl in general feel the same exact way I do. But I believe some conscious or pressures ppl have with themselves to not come off as racist tend to make people defend the notions that blacks are simply more dangerous than any other race by giving excuses (slavery, discrimination) and hypotheticals (Well maybe blacks are PUT in jail more but not commiting more crimes! WHAT?!)
Anyone who disagree how about we walk through some Friendly black Neighborhoods in New Orleans, Detroit ,etc... and see if you come out alive....
Based on the information from the FBI Crime in the United States, statically Whites are arrested for more crimes then Blacks in general Table 43 - Crime in the United States 2008 (http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2008/data/table_43.html - broken link) so I would have to disagree with the statement that I highlighted above. True Blacks are incarcerated at a higher rate but based on the arrest tables and incarceration information, it would make me think that Blacks are put in jail more or do you believe that the majority of Whites who are arrested are arrested in error and the Blacks really are the ones who did the crime?
I am not trying to get into a Black vs White crime thing here but I will not accept the conventional idea of Blacks being more prone to crime then other races since that has not been my experience.
Based on the information from the FBI Crime in the United States, statically Whites are arrested for more crimes then Blacks in general Table 43 - Crime in the United States 2008 (http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2008/data/table_43.html - broken link) so I would have to disagree with the statement that I highlighted above. True Blacks are incarcerated at a higher rate but based on the arrest tables and incarceration information, it would make me think that Blacks are put in jail more or do you believe that the majority of Whites who are arrested are arrested in error and the Blacks really are the ones who did the crime?
I am not trying to get into a Black vs White crime thing here but I will not accept the conventional idea of Blacks being more prone to crime then other races since that has not been my experience.
Thats good point drkman, thats was just some lazy arguments by myself.
I know that whites commit more crimes (simply because whites outweigh blacks by near 10:1 in population)
But what I should have said were VIOLENT , GANG and DRUG related crimes. Blacks are arrested and incarcerated highly disproportionate to any other race in America fror violent related crimes.
I could care less about some white guy being arrested for downloading child porn, but I am constantly concerned about Crimes where innocent people (gang shootings) are killed or hurt
So thats why I should have put more emphasis on VIOLENT crimes
Dude you are so off-base its ridiculous. Take a nice look at the Good Samaritan laws (which addresses many things) but also points out things that are relevant to our discussion. For example
"prevents a rescuer who has voluntarily helped a victim in distress from being successfully sued for 'wrongdoing'. Its purpose is to keep people from being reluctant to help a stranger in need for fear of legal repercussions if they were to make some mistake"
****Also read the last question again because you keep answering under the wrong pretense. I wasnt asking you if you were the suspect. I am asking you if if was YOUR CHILD (and you're at home or something) and ppl see YOUR CHILD potentially being kidnapped by someone else
I know for a fact you would not be hoping bystanders stand there 10 mins trying to think of whats going on or being scared of being prosecuted.
You would hope they reacted to save your child.
Right?****
I know all about the good samaritan laws, who protect people who are INJURED OR ILL. The girl is not injured or ill. the good samaritan law also protects an indivividual from civil liabilities, not criminal prosecutions.
Also in many jurisidictions, the protection only applies to trained individuals. For example, if you dont know how to do CPR, and you conduct CPR on an individual while trying to save them, which results in their actual death, you are not protected.
Claiming to work for the Department of Justice, and then bringing up the Good Samaritan laws might really prove that someone needs to take your postings to your boss to review for employment qualifications.
I know all about the good samaritan laws, who protect people who are INJURED OR ILL. The girl is not injured or ill. the good samaritan law also protects an indivividual from civil liabilities, not criminal prosecutions.
Also in many jurisidictions, the protection only applies to trained individuals. For example, if you dont know how to do CPR, and you conduct CPR on an individual killing them, you are not protected.
Claiming to work for the Department of Justice, and then bringing up the Good Samaritan laws might really prove that someone needs to take your postings to your boss to review for employment qualifications.
LOL everything is always extreme to you PGH lol. I should be fired for my postings on a message forum lol
Anyways like I said Please post ONE case where a person was arrested for ATTEMPTING to help someone else in a similar situation like this
I know you are wrong. Its that simple
By the way the the example you used is a horrible example (when you said father who shoots someone in home and was wrong). That is clear no imminent danger to warrant to kill someone. Thats why the father may be charged.
For example if someone is stealing my car I cant necessarily blow their head off to protect my car. This again is not relevant to our discussion
Matter of fact this week there was a shooting that made national news where a man shot his fiance and killed her, he thought she was a burglar.
Guess what he wont be charged....
Again show me one case where a person attempted to help someone is distress and was arrested for being wrong....
LOL everything is always extreme to you PGH lol. I should be fired for my postings on a message forum lol
Anyways like I said Please post ONE case where a person was arrested for ATTEMPTING to help someone else in a similar situation like this
I know you are wrong. Its that simple
By the way the the example you used is a horrible example (when you said father who shoots someone in home and was wrong). That is clear no imminent danger to warrant to kill someone. Thats why the father may be charged.
For example if someone is stealing my car I cant necessarily blow their head off to protect my car. This again is not relevant to our discussion
Matter of fact this week there was a shooting that made national news where a man shot his fiance and killed her, he thought she was a burglar.
Guess what he wont be charged....
Again show me one case where a person attempted to help someone is distress and was arrested for being wrong....
You wont be able to
Was this your way of conceeding that good samaritan law is bs in this situation? At least we are making progress.
If you dont know how to use google, here is a hint, key in GOOGLE.COM above where it says city-data.com and you can do your own research. We've all been around long enough to see how some individuals are charged while others arent, and yes, this includes shooting individuals in your home.
All of this ignores the fact that the individual in this story was walking down the street with a girl while she as yelling at him. I've been in that situation, and yes, my adopted children were at the time yelling that I wasnt their daddy. This doesnt give anyone the authority to make half asssd assumptions as to what was going on. Heck, my children are not even the same color as me, so if they were to yell "your not my daddy" and someone was to get involved, they'd have more of a reason to believe something was going on, but that doesnt give them the authority to break laws, for whatever good intent that they had.
Had the "black guys" detained the perpetrator, they would have been guilty of at least one charge "false imprisonment" comes to mind.
"When an individual, without the other person’s consent intentionally and without authority, confines or restrains another individual"
Regardless as to if the man was "kidnapping" the child or not, this does not mean that you can go and just break laws as you deem to. A real Department of Justice employee would know better, that you cant break laws because others are..
I'm leaving you to your make believe arguments because I have other things to do to educate those who should know better, i.e. employee of the Department of Justice.
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