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I don't really regret voting for Bush in 2000. Until he botched the occupation of Iraq I think his first term was mostly okay, except on environmental issues, and I couldn't have known there would be an invasion of Iraq in 2000. Plus Gore was kind of a condescending twit anyway. I'm still unconvinced he would've been all that great. To relate it to this thread 2000 was an election where both choices were Southerners so someone could have blamed the South either way.
I voted write-in in 2004 and I voted McCain in 2008. I don't feel guilty about not supporting Kerry or Obama. It's really still too soon to tell if Obama will be any good, but I'm not particularly impressed (or particularly horrified either) so far.
Liking Bachmann is a bit harder for me to understand. She seems pretty out there, but maybe what we see of her gives a biased impression. Don't know.
Anyway if the dumping on the South is because it votes conservative I think there are clearly some flaws there.
First most of the most Republican states aren't in the South. Utah, Wyoming, Idaho, Alaska, North Dakota, and Nebraska aren't Southern states.
Now the states with the most self-identified "conservatives" tend to be Southern, but even then about half of them aren't. Utah, North Dakota, Idaho, and Wyoming have some of the highest net-conservative figures. (conservatives minus liberals) Iowa is actually listed as more "net conservative" than Kentucky.
Second North Carolina and Virginia both went for Obama. In percentage conservative and percentage Republican Virginia is roughly the same as Colorado. Granted that makes it somewhat conservative, but maybe not excessively so. I'm aware much or most of that might be the DC suburbs, but I don't think Roanoke is in that region and it never went for either Bush. From 1975-1992 it had one of the more notable black Republican mayors in America so even if its conservatives may not be all lily-white Old South types.
Now for me I might add that I prefer conservatism, although I do dislike the extremist variants of it. Still I think there are plenty of sensible and reasonable Southern conservatives. Tennessee traditionally had a fair amount of those.
I'm pretty sure there were segregated waiting rooms and such in the North as well as the South. They may have gone away earlier, but they were certainly present. Also, there was more civil rights activity in the South because there was a much higher black population in the South, especially when comparing rural areas/small towns...black population in the Northeast was pretty much relegated to major cities, while in the South it was in the cities as well as the smaller towns and rural areas. Major cities (like Atlanta) weren't as segregated as rural areas.
It seems like to me that a blatant incident like the ones you described would be instant national news. It's a little hard to believe that anyone in this century would just let it go and move on without bringing it to someone's attention. I know historically, there was a certain fear factor when dealing with such things, but not so in modern times.
Agree on the population differences having an affect. Yes, there was segregation in the north, but it wasn't sanctioned by law and custom for as long as it was in the south.
"Small" incidents like not being waited on or acknowledged are usually not reported because it's in the best of health interests for the victim to just walk away and not complain, especially when no one else in the restaurant is standing up and saying, "Hey, this isn't right." The word gets out, as in the case of my coworker's friends, that you are not welcome at such-and-such a place, and the behavior is allowed to continue. In New Jersey, a person treated like that would raise holy hell and the press would be all over it. I know it happened in Pennsylvania a few years ago--people brought a black friend to a country club restaurant and were told by the host that he was not allowed to dine in the restaurant. The black guy had been to the country club before as a guest at a banquet--apparently that was OK, but not to dine in the regular restaurant. Several other customers heard what was going on and walked out of the place, and the original party with the black friend called the press.
That's the kind of thing that puts a stop to it. You can't change people's POV's or beliefs, but you can say you won't tolerate the discrimination.
Agreed--people aren't going to see everyday southerners going about their business on the news. And we all hope to god that the south is not the same at it was in 1964.
I grew up in the north, but live in the South since 8 years.
The South...
- Southerners use the 'n' word without inhibition.
- football and basketball are the most important things in the world.
- hardly any interest in the outside world.
- grown men that emotionally are like 10 year old boys. Shaved heads, buzz cuts, macho struts, behavior (all signs of immaturity and insecurity).
- not much culturally (film, art, literature, music, etc.). TV and radio lacking in anything to stimulate the mind.
- belligerent religion.
These are the stereotypes. I've also met people who are unlike the stereotypes.
I grew up in the north, but live in the South since 8 years.
The South...
- Southerners use the 'n' word without inhibition.
- football and basketball are the most important things in the world.
- hardly any interest in the outside world.
- grown men that emotionally are like 10 year old boys. Shaved heads, buzz cuts, macho struts, behavior (all signs of immaturity and insecurity).
- not much culturally (film, art, literature, music, etc.). TV and radio lacking in anything to stimulate the mind.
- belligerent religion.
These are the stereotypes. I've also met people who are unlike the stereotypes.
Where exactly do you reside? I'm sure if you lived in McKeesport, PA or Zanesville, OH you'd encounter the same thing.
This seems baited from the start when I keeps reading about the "Lily white Midwest"
Can't you just say white people in the Midwest. It makes it come off like people in the Midwest or Northeast are walking around in a garden completely uncaring or unknowing of what's going on around them. That in itself is a pretty big sterotype.
Why is the North/West Coast/Midwest so incredibly misunderstood? True, there are some unfair stereotypes about the South (just as they are for any states), but I don't think people pick on it unjustly. I think some Southerners are maybe over-sensitive about the region.
Do you know how many times I've heard Southerners describe the Northeast as a place full of unfriendly socialists. You go to many places in the South and they treat "yankees" as if we're still going through Reconstruction and they're carpet-baggers. How is that for misunderstood? Yet when anyone mentions anything negative about the South, no matter how true it may be, they're attacked from all sides. The facts are that the South is the poorest and most uneducated region of the country in general. Plus, aside from deviation in the recent presidential election, it's also blood red conservative. These are facts. Not misunderstanding.
The south does get a bad rap it does not deserve. One of the first responses to this post was from some leftist south basher from the peoples republiK of Massachusetts. He called people from the south ignorant, blamed them for the war in Iraq and claimed their states were dangerous and crime ridden. THis is typical from the arrogant northeast. First off, Massachsusetts is a little hole in the wall, dirty run down, overrun with traffic and people. Oh and your people are rude too, and anti american, anti christian, and plain immoral. So how do you get off running down the south when your own state is such a drag on this nation???
I am from the midwest (Michigan), and from my perspective the people of the south are some of the nicest youll meet. They love America, they love god, and yes they still believe in capitalism. When im in the south its like a different world, the cities are nice, things are being built, people are working, so I dont understand were people come up with these sterotypes and attacks on the south. For those from the south, I think you know were most of these attacks come from, mostly snobby northeasterners or Californians. Hollywood creates these myths about the south and everyone believes EVERYTHING they see on tv. Anyone who spends time in the south knows the truth. I also agree that the midwest is alot more racist than the south. My state of Michgian for example is very segregated, with almost all of our blacks living in Detroit, while rural michigan is extremely white. The only reason Michigan ends up going democrat is those 900000 detroiters who dominate our politics. Outside of the 3 county detroit area, most of the other 80 counties are as conservative and redneck as anywhere you will find in dixie. We have Klan, we have militia, lots of confederate flags on trucks and houses. It is not just michigan, youll find this acrost the midwest in Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Iowa, Wisconsin, etc. It is not fair that the south is constantly attacked, when most of the accusations against it are just plain not true, or exagerated to an extreme. Oh and for the record, They should keep bringing up the war of northern aggression because they were RIGHT, the north wrong. States should be able to govern themselves without federal tyranny, the constitution should be respected, goverment should be small. They stood up in 1861 in the spirit of the founding fathers to preserve liberty, god bless them for that. We need that kind of courage and determination today in order to save america from socialism and tyranny.
I agree the South is misunderstood. But those of us who are aware of its Civil Rights legacy find ot hard to set that aside when we think about the South, despite the great strides the region has mage in the past few decades. Images of the Governor of Mississippi standing in the doorway of Ole Miss with legally armed thugs trying to block the admission of the first "Negro" student... the Governor of Geogia handing out pick ax handles from his Atlanta restaurant to whites who'd help fight integration... the bodies of the white and black college student civil rights workers murdered by locals, pulled out of a Mississippi forest... the innocent faces of the little black girls killed by a bomb in a Birmingham church...the flaming bus in Alabama, torched by racists to intimidate the civil rights riders... the picture of the black Chicago boy who was tortured and thrown in a river with weights by Mississippi segregationists, the police chief of Birmingham ordering civil rights marchers to be attacked by dogs and fire hoses...the black girl being taunted and insulted by the rabid mob outside Central High in Little Rock.
These things stay with many of us even though those days and the perpetrators are long gone (thank God). Yes, the South is much different today, but to those of us who know these imiages and that history, it's hard not to think about it.
The South thinks they OWN the USA. They have an overflated sense of their own importance. They are only one small part of America. They have never gotten over losing the Civil War.
Delete the Civil War reference, and you have just described how many feel about your home State.
Speaking of the Civil War, you really seem to be obsessed with it. Why?
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