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Old 11-23-2009, 04:41 PM
 
2,087 posts, read 1,348,272 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhawkins74 View Post
And if you notice they want to argue the fact that it wasnt that the white person was stopped according to their race, but none of them disputing it, have said anything about the black person with the mercedes. I guess, deep down, they have to admit to themselves that black people do get stopped based solely off the color of their skin.

all you have to do is pay attention at the mall to see how abundant racism is. It shouldn't even be a topic unless you are blind to the ways of the world.

 
Old 11-23-2009, 05:30 PM
 
44,670 posts, read 43,186,116 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by organick View Post
all you have to do is pay attention at the mall to see how abundant racism is. It shouldn't even be a topic unless you are blind to the ways of the world.
Speaking of malls, I have my own experience with one. I was at Northpoint Mall in Alpharetta,GA(north of Atlanta). I wanted to do something to pass time before my friend could take me home. I spent half of the day in a bookstore. One of the cashiers kept following me. I just wanted to be alone and read some books, like everyone else was. There were other people in the bookstore reading. Somehow, I was considered some kind of suspect. She kept watching me. Anytime I moved, she would walk back there to "ask me if I needed help". I didn't and still don't see how I was acting suspicious. I just wanted to be alone and read. That is why I tried to get away from everyone. It was Sunday, it was crowded, and I just wanted to read. I have a suspicion it may have been race because I was the only African-American in the bookstore. To say the least, I never went back to that bookstore again. I don't want to deal with that woman again. I go to other bookstores, people are like "hello how are you doing?" and there is no suspicion behind it. I could just sit, read a book, have a cup of coffee, and not be bothered.
 
Old 11-23-2009, 06:38 PM
 
Location: 30-40N 90-100W
13,856 posts, read 22,264,183 times
Reputation: 6657
I wondered why I hadn't seen this thread for awhile. (When I posted it was in General US)

The rate of single parent families, from my own looking through City-Data, I think is generally a better predictor of crime rates. At least for cities over 50,000.

Of the 101 cities with the highest percentage of single-parent families Lawrence, Massachusetts was the only one I recall finding with a crime rate that wasn't noticeably above average. Of those with the lowest percentage Dearborn, Michigan was the only one I recall with above average.

http://www.city-data.com/top2/h7.html
http://www.city-data.com/top2/h9.html

This works pretty much regardless of racial make-up. Schenectady, New York is nearly 75% white and on the highest single family list. At 537.5 per 100,000 its crime rate is maybe not outrageously high, but it is 60% above what this site lists as average.

http://www.city-data.com/city/Schenectady-New-York.html

Missouri City, Texas is 38.3% black and 38.6% white. It is on the lowest list for single parent families. Its crime rate is less than 30% that of Schenectady with no murders for 2004 or 2007.

http://www.city-data.com/city/Missouri-City-Texas.html

In the case of smaller towns this works less well, but the exceptions don't really bolster race as a factor. Lake Providence, Louisiana is a majority black town that is among those with a high percentage of single-parent families. Its crime rate is below average.

http://www.city-data.com/city/Lake-P...Louisiana.html

Granted I'm something of a social conservative, so you may take this with a grain of salt, but I think the correlation with family-breakdown certainly seems to work no matter what one's political views. Granted this could simply mean there is a third factor causing both things and that places like Lawrence, Massachusetts don't have that factor. If so that factor does not seem to be race or, perhaps surprisingly, poverty as several of the "safest" majority black towns I've found over the last months are dirt-poor rural towns. Although possibly that means disparities of wealth and urbanity are factors. When everyone's poor and rural there's not much point in crime. Or people will not report crime or they will prevent it from happening because they all know each other. This could explain the relatively low crime rates in much of Appalachia. However if there are disparities of wealth in an urban area perhaps that encourages crime, but that's speculative.

I might look through all I've missed and hope this isn't too irrelevant.
 
Old 11-24-2009, 02:09 PM
 
Location: Washington
843 posts, read 1,105,882 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redshadowz View Post
I realize that by admitting that blacks commit more crimes on average, you would feel like you are doing a great injustice in the culture war brewing in this country. But you cannot really believe what you say, can you?

You want to make a connection between poverty and crime, education and crime, racial sentencing and crime, to try to make your point. But it fails because hispanics are just as poor or more poor, just as poorly educated or more poorly educated(many can't even speak english), they are still a minority that many Americans don't trust. Yet a Hispanic man is only 1/3rd as likely to be in prison or jail as a black man.

We can talk about statistics all day long about petty crimes and drug related crime, but the simplest statistic to look at, which cannot be interpreted is murders. People don't just "get off" of murders because they buy their way out like in the drug abuse cases. Yet Blacks are extremely overrepresented in murder cases.

"In 2005, offending rates for blacks were more than 7 times higher than the rates for whites"
Bureau of Justice Statistics Homicide trends in the U.S.: Trends by race (http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/race.htm - broken link)

Even if education actually was the cause, you have to wonder why then that Blacks are so poorly educated. Is it because they don't have access to an education? Nope. Is it because the High scool education they get is lacking? Nope. It is because almost all black youths in urban areas drop out of high school and never go to college.

Black people just don't value education as much as whites. Almost all of them glorify to some extent the "thug life", they try to "stay black" by listening to rap music and acting and dressing more black. Many successful black men are treated as traitors if they are seen as acting "white".

Its all part of the black culture that may be different from one end of the country to the other, but the whites who are supposedly subjugating them are also different from one end of the country to the other. One of the more "accepting" and multicultural states, where whites aren't even a majority in the state(California), the black crime problem is far far worse than all other areas of the country(Oakland and compton are the worst places to live in the entire country).

Stop trying to make excuses for their bad behavior, blacks have problems and by you trying to pretend that its just the white man trying to cause problems, you are doing them a great injustice. There is already plenty of hatred and resentment flowing through that community.

Way to ignore having your earlier point (that prison statistics show racial crime tendencies) utterly disproven.

Now, Organik keeps shutting down your arguments, and each time you come out with a longer and longer post, which not only flatly disregards the claim you made in the one before, but tries some 'new angle' to argue 'how all the blacks and browns are criminals'

Your arguments are statistically shown false time after time? What does it take? Is your mind made up and no fact ever presented will change them? If thats the case, what the heck are you doing here on this discussion board?

This is a board to discuss, not to rant over and over. You are borderline spamming, because you post your opinions in argumentative form, then ignore feedback and refutation once its properly given only to change your assumed 'basis'. How could anyone really believe in anything if they cant argue their point or debate facts they claim once they are disproven?


By the way, that DOJ link you posted is an error site statistic, loooooong ago proven wrong by the UCR and FBI (actual government agencies)..

The data used in it (and its questionable who created it because the DOJ itself never did use it) does not correlate with actual crime data from the U. Crime Index compiled by the FBI and United Law Enforcement.

That means either someone made that site up and accedentally launched it, or whomever launched the site made up the numbers (because the DOJ does not compile its own crime database, the FBI/UCR does). This was even shown on stormfront, so even the nazitrash have moved on from citing this statistic.
 
Old 11-24-2009, 05:29 PM
 
2,087 posts, read 1,348,272 times
Reputation: 262
Quote:
Originally Posted by tindo80 View Post
Way to ignore having your earlier point (that prison statistics show racial crime tendencies) utterly disproven.

Now, Organik keeps shutting down your arguments, and each time you come out with a longer and longer post, which not only flatly disregards the claim you made in the one before, but tries some 'new angle' to argue 'how all the blacks and browns are criminals'

Your arguments are statistically shown false time after time? What does it take? Is your mind made up and no fact ever presented will change them? If thats the case, what the heck are you doing here on this discussion board?

This is a board to discuss, not to rant over and over. You are borderline spamming, because you post your opinions in argumentative form, then ignore feedback and refutation once its properly given only to change your assumed 'basis'. How could anyone really believe in anything if they cant argue their point or debate facts they claim once they are disproven?


By the way, that DOJ link you posted is an error site statistic, loooooong ago proven wrong by the UCR and FBI (actual government agencies)..

The data used in it (and its questionable who created it because the DOJ itself never did use it) does not correlate with actual crime data from the U. Crime Index compiled by the FBI and United Law Enforcement.

That means either someone made that site up and accedentally launched it, or whomever launched the site made up the numbers (because the DOJ does not compile its own crime database, the FBI/UCR does). This was even shown on stormfront, so even the nazitrash have moved on from citing this statistic.

head meet wall....head meet wall.....it just gets old
 
Old 11-24-2009, 07:01 PM
 
Location: Washington
843 posts, read 1,105,882 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by organick View Post
head meet wall....head meet wall.....it just gets old
Yes. I mean come on. I am 100% sure, one of the far right trolls here will spew these same links and stats.

Their system = Keep saying it, even if its proven wrong, and some of the less intelligent/questionative people will believe it.

Unfortunately enough, these people tend to be successful. Best example = Iraq War.
 
Old 12-11-2009, 06:51 PM
 
44,670 posts, read 43,186,116 times
Reputation: 14419
Your race does not determine if you will be a criminal. Race and crime are just correlations, not the cause. You must ask what makes a person committ a crime.
 
Old 12-11-2009, 06:57 PM
 
44,670 posts, read 43,186,116 times
Reputation: 14419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas R. View Post
I wondered why I hadn't seen this thread for awhile. (When I posted it was in General US)

The rate of single parent families, from my own looking through City-Data, I think is generally a better predictor of crime rates. At least for cities over 50,000.

Of the 101 cities with the highest percentage of single-parent families Lawrence, Massachusetts was the only one I recall finding with a crime rate that wasn't noticeably above average. Of those with the lowest percentage Dearborn, Michigan was the only one I recall with above average.

http://www.city-data.com/top2/h7.html
http://www.city-data.com/top2/h9.html

This works pretty much regardless of racial make-up. Schenectady, New York is nearly 75% white and on the highest single family list. At 537.5 per 100,000 its crime rate is maybe not outrageously high, but it is 60% above what this site lists as average.

http://www.city-data.com/city/Schenectady-New-York.html

Missouri City, Texas is 38.3% black and 38.6% white. It is on the lowest list for single parent families. Its crime rate is less than 30% that of Schenectady with no murders for 2004 or 2007.

http://www.city-data.com/city/Missouri-City-Texas.html

In the case of smaller towns this works less well, but the exceptions don't really bolster race as a factor. Lake Providence, Louisiana is a majority black town that is among those with a high percentage of single-parent families. Its crime rate is below average.

http://www.city-data.com/city/Lake-P...Louisiana.html

Granted I'm something of a social conservative, so you may take this with a grain of salt, but I think the correlation with family-breakdown certainly seems to work no matter what one's political views. Granted this could simply mean there is a third factor causing both things and that places like Lawrence, Massachusetts don't have that factor. If so that factor does not seem to be race or, perhaps surprisingly, poverty as several of the "safest" majority black towns I've found over the last months are dirt-poor rural towns. Although possibly that means disparities of wealth and urbanity are factors. When everyone's poor and rural there's not much point in crime. Or people will not report crime or they will prevent it from happening because they all know each other. This could explain the relatively low crime rates in much of Appalachia. However if there are disparities of wealth in an urban area perhaps that encourages crime, but that's speculative.

I might look through all I've missed and hope this isn't too irrelevant.
Being in a single-parent home could have another part in committing a crime. My view is like this. Whenever a person is living in a place where the rule of living is "survival", that makes the likelihood of crime much higher. When there is very little "spirit of community" when it is the law of survival, rule of law goes away in the eyes of some people. In single parent homes, sometimes the child has no one to keep track of him/her. In my former apartment complex, there were many kids who came from single-parent homes. There was a kids club for these kids to go to after school. In a way, it kept some of the crime down. It gave many of the kids a good place to be. Perhaps it is law of survival that can make some people look the other way when it comes to crime.
 
Old 12-15-2009, 02:26 PM
 
Location: OCEAN BREEZES AND VIEWS SAN CLEMENTE
19,899 posts, read 15,307,591 times
Reputation: 6451
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeaconJ View Post
Very true...it has more to do with the economics of an area than race. There are majority black middle-class (and up) neighborhoods in Atlanta where crime is very low. The higher-crime areas are inevitably areas with rampant poverty.

dEACON isn't it true for any races, that the crime ridden areas are going to have more crime, while the upper middle class areas have less, it has always been like this in any area, and that will not change.
 
Old 12-15-2009, 03:07 PM
 
1,718 posts, read 1,992,106 times
Reputation: 613
Quote:
Originally Posted by pirate_lafitte View Post
Your race does not determine if you will be a criminal. Race and crime are just correlations, not the cause. You must ask what makes a person committ a crime.
Why do men commit much more crime than women? This is especially true of violent crime. Certainly one's sex does not determine if you will be a criminal.

You must ask what makes a person commit a crime. I think a better question is what makes men on average commit more violent crime than women. I'm sure each of these men will have a reason as to what 'made' them commit the crime. But what makes so many more men commit violent crime than women?

Even in poverty stricken areas men commit much more violent crime than woman so it's not because of poverty. Men commit much more violent crime than women at every socio-econmic level.

Why?

- Reel
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