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Yes, we all know racism exists in this country, but that is not what Ron is wanting to talk about. He is still blaming slavery which ended 150 years ago and Jim Crow laws which ended 60 years ago for all the problems Blacks are having now. If he wants to discuss racism, then that is what he should be asking about, not some perceived "legacy" which has nothing at all to do with today's problems.
But slavery and Jim Crow is directly and indirectly responsible for many of the problems that black community faces. You can't act like eleven generations of racism and prejudice doesn't have any effect on a community and culture. Now, this isn't a "blame whitey" statement, but rather pointing out that distrust of the police, skepticism of "white" institutions, and the belief that no matter how hard you try society/The Man/The White Man/The System will not let you succeed are direct consequences of racism. They might not always make sense and not saying it is justified, but it is easier said than done to merely start trusting people who historically have been the main people who made your life so s---ty.
The first record of African slavery in Colonial America was made in 1619. A British pirate ship under the Dutch flag, ...
1865 less 1619 is 246 years not 400 years. If you are going to make something completely up why not call it ten thousand years making it worth while?
Stop messing with his mind. Everyone knows the 1600s was 400 years ago. What is this? Some kind of concept? Carving 246 years out of the last 400 years? Isn't that 400 years of slavery - 2000 less 1600? Wait a minute! There wasn't slavery the whole time was there? Hang on. Let me give this some thought. There must be some way to figure this out.
PS
I've got it! With 400 years of slavery and another 100 of jim crow - that's 500 years. So it must be the year 3000. Or slavery started in 1500?
Wait a minute. It's been 60 years since jim crow. Now that 550 years. So slavery started in 1450. Didn't something happen in 1492? Wasn't that slavery?
Location: The Land Mass Between NOLA and Mobile, AL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heaveno
Those of us who will run the race and win and those of us who will give up before starting to attempt to get into the race. No one said it would be easy and I agree with you about a strong father and mother, or even one parent who is a constant in your life. A parent or parents who will plant the seeds and water them to make a huge difference regarding how you pursue your goals in this life. The ones who fascinate me the most are the people that did not have either parent-yet they overcame and met the challenges set before them and are successful, but then again what does success mean to the individual? Well for me it means being healthy in all aspects of your life and serving others to GET THERE!!!! Coming from a Civil Rights household, it is just embedded in my being to be about the rights, equality and justice for my people while I am amongst the living.. I did not have to live in poverty (far from it), but boy did I surround myself with those who did while I was a youth and am actively serving those who do today.
Good for you guys. You'll be in charge soon. When I was young and pissed off (still am, and I'm still kinda young, but older than you guys), someone said, "you'll outlive them." I didn't get it then, but it's true. Now that I'm in my thirties, things have changed since I was in my twenties. There are still the same problems, but they are different. In some ways, white eighteen year olds now--the people I work with--are far less invested in racist thinking than they were even ten years ago. There are exceptions, of course. But in general, they trust and listen to black, brown, tan, and beige people. They have grown up among them and count them as friends.
there is no use. Many will not see the light because they do not want to.
I never once said I was blaming...........also in the title I said HINDERS THIS COUNTRY..............I never HINDERS BLACKS.
Racism is not a black thing it's an issue the affects the USA. I never once blamed anyone nor am I looking for an apology. I have no idea where they're getting all of this "extra" stuff from.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank_Carbonni
But slavery and Jim Crow is directly and indirectly responsible for many of the problems that black community faces. You can't act like eleven generations of racism and prejudice doesn't have any effect on a community and culture. Now, this isn't a "blame whitey" statement, but rather pointing out that distrust of the police, skepticism of "white" institutions, and the belief that no matter how hard you try society/The Man/The White Man/The System will not let you succeed are direct consequences of racism. They might not always make sense and not saying it is justified, but it is easier said than done to merely start trusting people who historically have been the main people who made your life so s---ty.
The historical context regarding the past treatment of my people fuels my thoughts "THIS IS THE CHIP" and allows me to carefully analyze why my people may have the behaviors that are destructive and not conducive to their well-being. "This is the excuse making for failures of her people" This also identifies the self imposition of segregation in her own mind" Many peole suffered for the cause of integration and no sooner was the battle won than many blacks began the effort to segregate. It was not equality in the minds of many with regards to equality of one people. It was equality in the minds of many in a segregated state. I don't think she even realized it but she is a racist in her own right. I draw this conclusion with the statement "my people". When I think of my people, I do not exclude blacks from that thought.
Both blacks and whites and orientals if they are truly enculturated americans are my people.
So although my life has been very good-many of my people overall are still living in a very complex country with very complex problems.[/quote]
Again, one makes life complex by the choices he/she makes and one rises from the pit of racially dominated adversity by inclusiveness not exclusiveness.
I think the poster has much to learn about herself and the knowledge will flow when she turns loose of the chip on her shoulder.
Ma'am, I have met so many women like you that have a chip on their shoulders it is not funny. Michelle Obama is one just like you with that attitude.
It is a damn funny thing to me, that most every Christian conservative black that I have ever met is doing well in this country. To me doing well is paying the bills and advancing oneself at what ever level, rich or poor. Because ma'am if you are poor in this country and can meet the concept outlined by Thoreau of vital heat, food, shelter , and clothing, the you are a king or queen among kings.
The people of this country black and white are spoiled little children. If you are a citizen of this country black or white no King or Queen of old would trade places with you. We are a nation of kings and queens.
If you are carrying that hatred around wiht you and that chip on your shoulder it will shine through everything else you do no matter how masterful you become and you will make yourself irrelevant.
Where do you get these words and phrases like "hate", and "chip on shoulder" from??? Has a black person personally told you that they hate you?? Or is that what you perceive the overall mindset of blacks to be?? I hate no one, and I actually try not to even use that word. All I do is call it how I see it, and if myself and other's who do that makes you form the opinion in your head that we hate you, then I am truly sorry for that. I do feel that my people have received a raw deal, but that does not make me hate anyone for it. Truth be told I think more whites hate blacks then vice versa, most blacks are indifferent on the whole race matter quite frankly IMO. Despite my views on race, one of my best friends to this day is white, one of my ex girlfriend’s was white; she was a native Italian actually but still. And I live around a number of whites, Indians, and blacks. I firmly believe in Karmatic Principles, so for me to go around with hate on my mind all day towards other's would hamper things that I myself am trying to accomplish. And I am quite sure that most like me feel the same way.
But slavery and Jim Crow is directly and indirectly responsible for many of the problems that black community faces. You can't act like eleven generations of racism and prejudice doesn't have any effect on a community and culture. Now, this isn't a "blame whitey" statement, but rather pointing out that distrust of the police, skepticism of "white" institutions, and the belief that no matter how hard you try society/The Man/The White Man/The System will not let you succeed are direct consequences of racism. They might not always make sense and not saying it is justified, but it is easier said than done to merely start trusting people who historically have been the main people who made your life so s---ty.
But . . . with 70% of black folks making it and doing just fine in this country, wouldn't it dawn on the other 30% at some point that they can, in fact, make it themselves? Since 70% are being successful, wouldn't it dawn on these 30% that maybe there is something else going on beside slavery/jim crow legacy, racism, prejudice and discrimination? Why would society be holding these 30% back while allowing 70% to succeed and how do we go about choosing who these 30% will be that we will hold back?
Whenever I think of Jim Crow Laws - It reminds me when black people were held prisoner during The Great Flood of 1927. The Mississippi Flood of 1927 exposed the class divide in America and contributed to racial oppression in the South.
Fast forward to 2005 and Hurricane Katrina and remember how blacks of the lower 9th Ward in New Orleans were treated. The Bush White House and Congress attempted to wash their hands of responsibility for helping those affected return to normal lives. So, Yes - I think Jim Crow still hinders this country today.
You'll always here white folks say " I did not own any slaves and neither did my parents,etc........."
That's when I know "They don't get it". Just admit the legacy still exists. It's not about whether you owned a slave or not.
Why can't some of YOU admit it still exists?
Hmmmm, you are very ...prolific..on this subject. The vehemence of your posting is telling as to the possibility that you have been somehow wronged and, perhaps, now carry a seething anger toward, as you put it, "white folks"? I am one of those who does not hold myself responsible for things that happened in the past, perpetrated by people I never knew, be they kin of mine or not. This legacy you speak of ? Those injustices and wrongs of the era of Jim Crow, segregation, and the hey day of the Klan. Have you taken a good , comparitive, look at then and now? You call this a legacy. I call it history. Very few people actually cling to those days, in terms of a legacy, which, by definition, is something passed down gerationally. OK, sure, there are groups that are attemting to keep those days alive, in that fashion, and they are not all white hate groups either. You are correct that the "legacy" of those times does hinder us in many ways, but that is not, strictly, a 'white folks' issue. It cannot be stated, truthfully anyway, that the animosity and anger that clings to our country from those times is strictly kept alive by white people. As to whether white people actually 'get it' ...LMAO, I suppose that 'getting it' is a pretty relative thing. Whatever it is. I don't feel compelled, in any fashion, to feel guilt, or a sense of self loathing, about past wrongs, perpetrated by and upon people I never knew, however, I (speaking only for myself here) can learn from history, and apply the lessons so as not to repeat it. What , exactly, is your proposal? What is it that would satisfy you, in terms of this 'legacy'? Should all we 'white folks', stand up and profess our all consuming guilt about the past, perhaps self flagellate ourselves and beg for forgiveness from every person of color we see? Yea, I suppose you could say, at least, that I , personally, don't 'get it'.
Does the legacy of slavery and Jim Crow "hinder" the US?
How about just racism and the problems inherent with multi-racial/multi-cultural societies hinder this country?
Is that "the legacy of slavery?" Or "the legacy of Jim Crow"? As if slavery and Jim Crow is to blame for racist attitudes, prejudices, etc.? I think they would exist regardless if slavery never existed. It's pretty much human nature. Of course, there's probably be 1/10th the black people there are in the US today if there was never any slavery, so it would be hard to imagine what the US would be like or how they'd react to the black population.
What we DO know, however, is that one of the major problems that create poverty for ALL races (but especially AA) is absentee fatherism. If I remember correctly, the "black family unit" was stronger at the beginning decades of the 1900s than the latter half. If AA could have maintained that family structure, they would have advanced further as a group than they already have.
Instead of focusing how "slavery and Jim Crow" hinders the advancement of the AA minority, then, the effort should be in figuring out how to foster a culture of family and valuation of EDUCATION in the AA community. Slavery encouraged AA to not be educated. These days, it's many in the AA community that eschew education as "acting white."
It's not as sexy to discuss realistic solutions to problems facing the AA minority academically, however, so good luck. It's more fun to get "angry" and righteously indignant (everyone wants to be a Malcolm X that aint gonna take sh*t from nobody) .... so I guess we'll just have to keep talking about slavery.
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...LMAO, I suppose that 'getting it' is a pretty relative thing. Whatever it is. I don't feel compelled, in any fashion, to feel guilt, or a sense of self loathing, about past wrongs, perpetrated by and upon people I never knew, however, I (speaking only for myself here) can learn from history, and apply the lessons so as not to repeat it. What , exactly, is your proposal? What is it that would satisfy you, in terms of this 'legacy'? Should all we 'white folks', stand up and profess our all consuming guilt about the past, perhaps self flagellate ourselves and beg for forgiveness from every person of color we see? Yea, I suppose you could say, at least, that I , personally, don't 'get it'.