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Old 01-04-2010, 07:48 PM
 
31,385 posts, read 32,007,059 times
Reputation: 14896

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ergohead View Post
I am sure we do, but I was hoping "someone" might find and post some case law on the subject.

As your hypothetical implies, the underpants case cannot be a "first" for our law books.
No they don't!

If a crime is committed in the jurisdiction of the United States that individual will be tried in state or Federal court in the U.S, under the relevant statutes of the relevant jurisdiction and with all the protections afforded anyone under state, or Federal law, PERIOD!
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Old 01-04-2010, 08:00 PM
 
19,216 posts, read 12,941,792 times
Reputation: 2337
Quote:
Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
No they don't!

If a crime is committed in the jurisdiction of the United States that individual will be tried in state or Federal court in the U.S, under the relevant statutes of the relevant jurisdiction and with all the protections afforded anyone under state, or Federal law, PERIOD!
You are SO easy to draw out, but listen, "someone", I'd still like to see a similar case posted just to stop the bickering.

I think you are "right on the money", but at some time, this same issue HAD to have been raised and settled.
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Old 01-04-2010, 08:05 PM
 
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
7,342 posts, read 7,116,144 times
Reputation: 7523
Did you miss post #47?
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Old 01-04-2010, 08:18 PM
 
Location: Keonsha, Wisconsin
2,480 posts, read 2,868,191 times
Reputation: 575
Quote:
Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
Think is the operative word when it comes to these discussions. Thinking has little to do with the discussion.
You're about as sharp as a tack today. I can't rep you again, unfortunately.
And you could be correct, thinking itself is difficult for some, as it is clearly displayed after reading some posts.

I believe there might be a hockey or football game going on right now, can I please hear a big whoosh when the non-thinkers leave the forum please. thank you.
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Old 01-04-2010, 08:50 PM
 
19,216 posts, read 12,941,792 times
Reputation: 2337
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jill61 View Post
Did you miss post #47?
No, but I guess I am interested in the jurisdictional issue in its formative stages of case law history.

I'm sure it goes back to Revolutionary times when a british citizen or Native American Indian committed a crime on "American soil".

The British government might have said, "you can't try him, he's ours!"

"Or, half ours, anyway".

Southern blacks at one time were not U.S. citizens, or was it that they might have been 1/5 citizen with 1/5 legal protection? Never mind on that one.

Then, they came up with "diplomatic immunity", which protects certain foreigners from prosecution of ANY crime in the U.S.
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Old 01-04-2010, 08:59 PM
 
3,854 posts, read 3,730,042 times
Reputation: 557
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunny-Days90 View Post
As usual the left wing nuts club of America not only is wrong but are making American so weak we will all pay for it in time.

Sad.

And the left wing nutjobs are on the wrong side as usual of right and the majority.


Seventy-one percent (71%) of all voters think the attempt by the Nigerian Muslim to blow up the airliner as it landed in Detroit should be investigated by military authorities as a terrorist act. Only 22% say it should be handled by civilian authorities as a criminal act, as is currently the case.

And the majority want his butt water boarded or any aggressive manner needed to extract info.

Fifty-eight percent (58%) of U.S. voters say waterboarding and other aggressive interrogation techniques should be used to gain information from the terrorist who attempted to bomb an airliner on Christmas Day.

Thanks to the candy ass Obama and commi friend Holder.

In the wake of the Christmas Day incident, belief that the terrorists are winning the War on Terror is at its highest level in over two years, and nearly half of U.S. voters say America is not safer than it was before 9/11.

Most voters also said the massacre at Fort Hood, Texas by a Muslim Army officer should be investigated by military authorities as a terrorist act rather than by civilian authorities as a criminal act.

This admin and the dem party is making us less safe every single day and many of us are getting very sick of the left wing nuts defending terrorist with laws that DO NOT PROTECT THEM.

The dem party will cause us great harm with your cowardly ways.

58% Favor Waterboarding of Plane Terrorist To Get Information - Rasmussen Reports™


Time to wake up America and get these left wing anti American nuts out of control of our country before they cause many of us to be harmed.
AMAZINGLY articulate ........not the usual style.
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Old 01-05-2010, 09:09 AM
 
Location: SARASOTA, FLORIDA
11,501 posts, read 13,391,089 times
Reputation: 4876
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jill61 View Post
Holy F*@%! It's like wanting us to go back in history to the time of lynch mobs. Totally f^@%*&% disgusting.

Shows you have no idea of what is going on and accept the facts.

Get up with the times lady.

What does going back to lynching mobs have to do with terrorist.

So now you are comparing those who were lynched terrorist who want to kill Americans???

You really are joking right?
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Old 01-05-2010, 09:24 AM
 
Location: SARASOTA, FLORIDA
11,501 posts, read 13,391,089 times
Reputation: 4876
Quote:
Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
Before your little Jack Bauer wet dreams get your undies all bunched up, perhaps folks screaming for military tribunals should take the time to see that most of their objections to rights provided to defendants in civil criminal court are to a great degree rights extended to defendants in military tribunals.

Under the Military Tribunal Act of 2009

DEFENDANTS ARE PROVIDED WITH AN ATTORNEY!!!

Further:

‘‘§ 948r. Exclusion of statements obtained by torture or cruel,
inhuman, or degrading treatment; prohibition of
self-incrimination; admission of other statements
of the accused
‘‘(a) EXCLUSION OF STATEMENTS OBTAIN BY TORTURE OR CRUEL,
INHUMAN, OR DEGRADING TREATMENT.—No statement obtained by
the use of torture or by cruel, inhuman, or degrading treatment
(as defined by section 1003 of the Detainee Treatment Act of 2005
(42 U.S.C. 2000dd)), whether or not under color of law, shall be
admissible in a military commission under this chapter, except
against a person accused of torture or such treatment as evidence
that the statement was made.
‘‘(b) SELF-INCRIMINATION PROHIBITED.—No person shall be
required to testify against himself or herself at a proceeding of
a military commission under this chapter.
‘‘(c) OTHER STATEMENTS OF THE ACCUSED.—A statement of
the accused may be admitted in evidence in a military commission
under this chapter only if the military judge finds—
‘‘(1) that the totality of the circumstances renders the statement
reliable and possessing sufficient probative value; and
‘‘(2) that—
‘‘(A) the statement was made incident to lawful conduct
during military operations at the point of capture or during
closely related active combat engagement, and the interests
of justice would best be served by admission of the statement
into evidence; or
‘‘(B) the statement was voluntarily given.
‘‘(d) DETERMINATION OF VOLUNTARINESS.—In determining for
purposes of subsection (c)(2)(B) whether a statement was voluntarily
given, the military judge shall consider the totality of the circumstances,
including, as appropriate, the following:
‘‘(1) The details of the taking of the statement, accounting
for the circumstances of the conduct of military and intelligence
operations during hostilities.
‘‘(2) The characteristics of the accused, such as military
training, age, and education level.
‘‘(3) The lapse of time, change of place, or change in identity
of the questioners between the statement sought to be admitted
and any prior questioning of the accused.

Folks might also take the time to review the record of successful convictions in Federal Court as opposed to the abysmal record compiled by the military.
I think what most people want is to make sure a terrorist is NOT given rights as a US citizen. ( KSM is getting these rights and it is wrong )

We are ALL learning how to deal with a terrorist, some believe he has rights the same as you and I do, others like me believe he has no rights and he should be handed over to a government agency.

They are trained to extract information from a terrorist and not some cop who does not know what to do with a terrorist.

If you have all this military knowledge you surely do not expect the rest of us to have the vast experience you might have. But we are all learning how to deal with terrorist and not a street criminal anymore.

Even our AG is having a hard time knowing what to do with terrorist. What does that tell you?

Guess we can all sit back and watch how the KSM trial unfolds.

I am sure all of us with learn something new.
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Old 01-05-2010, 10:28 AM
 
Location: Redondo Beach, CA
7,342 posts, read 7,116,144 times
Reputation: 7523
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunny-Days90 View Post

I think what most people want is to make sure a terrorist is NOT given rights as a US citizen. ( KSM is getting these rights and it is wrong )
You think wrong. Most people fully understand how our nation of laws, that was set up by our Founding Fathers that you people are always crowing about, works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SD90

We are ALL learning how to deal with a terrorist, some believe he has rights the same as you and I do, others like me believe he has no rights and he should be handed over to a government agency.
Since when isn't the Federal Justice Department a "government agency"? Did you mean to say that they shouldn't be handed over to a "government agency"? If so, I'd still ask, since when is the military not a "government agency"? And since when are people who attempt or commit crimes not entitled to any rights? You people disgustingly compare our president, Barack Obama, to Hitler, and yet you advocate Hitler-style "justice" to suit your sick bent for revenge. Advocates of this kind of "justice" are no Patriots of this great nation of ours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SD90

They are trained to extract information from a terrorist and not some cop who does not know what to do with a terrorist.
Who is this "they" that you speak of? Are you really so ignorant that you think the Federal Justice Department hands over alleged criminals to the local police for interrogation? Srsly?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SD90

If you have all this military knowledge you surely do not expect the rest of us to have the vast experience you might have. But we are all learning how to deal with terrorist and not a street criminal anymore.
Since you admit to not knowing what you're talking about, instead of going off half-cocked with hysterical rantings, how about you actually take the knowledge that's being imparted to you and learn something from it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SD90

Even our AG is having a hard time knowing what to do with terrorist. What does that tell you?
Absurd allegation. Next. . .
Quote:
Originally Posted by SD90

Guess we can all sit back and watch how the KSM trial unfolds.

I am sure all of us with learn something new.
No, most of us know that prosecuting terrorists in this country is nothing new. We know that, as a matter of fact, we have SUCCESSFULLY prosecuted over 195 terrorists since 2001 in this country. Most of us already know and recognize that our system of justice works just fine, and prefer that our government not become like that of Communist China, thankyouverymuch.
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Old 01-05-2010, 10:50 AM
 
Location: Gone
25,235 posts, read 13,997,486 times
Reputation: 5916
Quote:
Originally Posted by milliebfit View Post
Why would the President give a lawyer to the christmas day terrorist???
They will not be able to get any information from him!!

Do you think the president will change his mind???
The President does not have anything to do with it, it is the law and applies to anyone arrested here, don't you know that?
Casper
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