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Old 05-01-2010, 11:56 AM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,676,689 times
Reputation: 3949

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Quote:
Originally Posted by red red rose View Post
No need for payoffs, coverups, or well bribed officials.

Use of this Hawaii statute would do the trick.

Quote:
http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/hrscur..._0338-0006.htm338-6 Local agent to prepare birth certificate. (a) If neither parent of the newborn child whose birth is unattended as provided in section 338-5 is able to prepare a birth certificate, the local agent of the department of health shall secure the necessary information from any person having knowledge of the birth and prepare and file the certificate.
(b) The department shall prescribe the time within which a supplementary report furnishing information omitted on the original certificate may be returned for the purpose of completing the certificate. Certificates of birth completed by a supplementary report shall not be considered as “delayed” or “altered.” [L 1949, c 327, 10; RL 1955, 57-9; am L Sp 1959 2d, c 1, 19; HRS 338-6]
1. You will find essentially this same law on the books in every state in the union. Babies are actually born unattended every day, and they are still issued birth certificates every day based on "information from any person having knowledge of the birth," and those birth certificates are still absolute legal proof of citizenship.

2. There is no Constitutional requirement for an attended birth. This is a good thing because most of our Presidents have had unattended births. Jimmy Carter was the first to have even been born in a hospital. And of our 44 Presidents, only eight are known to have birth certificates at all. Most recently neither Harry Truman nor Ike Eisenhower had them, and Ronald Reagan did not get one until he was in his 30s.
Quote:
Originally Posted by red red rose
If grandma wanted to make sure her grandson was a US citizen (which he wouldn't have been if he was born outside of the country) she could simply have gone to the local agent of the Dept. of Health and given them the necessary information (fudging on the place of birth a little, maybe) and have the birth certificate filed.
If Obama had only one eye he would be a cyclops.

But more to the point, if this is what happened, tough. You still need to present evidence that the information on the birth certificate is not true. And we all know that, still, after two years of rabid frothing and searching, you have none.

So... even a long form certificate that said his birth was unattended is of exactly no help to you. It would still be considered legal proof that he was born in Hawaii.

Quote:
Originally Posted by red red rose
I tend to think that knowing if the President was actually born a citizen at all is rather important.
Except when the president is somebody other than Obama. Than (apparently) not so much.

 
Old 05-01-2010, 12:01 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,676,689 times
Reputation: 3949
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
No. I do know, but reading Vattel would help her understand much better than me just giving a shorthand explanation, no?
No.

Unless the founding fathers had access to time travel, De Vattel can have had exactly zero influence on the Article 2 definition of natural born citizen.

So reading him would offer her no understanding whatsoever of the issue under discussion.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 12:10 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,676,689 times
Reputation: 3949
Quote:
Originally Posted by deturmind View Post
Too bad it is not a birth certificate. I posted links explaining the difference and the fact that in Hawaii in 1961, there was only the long form that the director of Hawaii's Vital Records has said he has viewed. I provided the link to his official press release.
There is essentially nothing in that comment that it true.

By definition and by law, the COLB that Obama released two years ago is a birth certificate. Furthermore, according to the United States Department of State it is absolute legal proof of Obama's citizenship status. I am not just speaking generally here. In their response to the case of Strunk vs. the United States Department of State, the DoS explicitly affirmed that Obama's COLB is genuine and that it constitutes proof of his citizenship. It settles a handful of other Birther theories as well, such as whether Obama had ever been adopted or ever been a citizen of Indonesia.

No to both.

Quote:
Originally Posted by deturmind
Just like the rest of the left wing hacks on here, you continuosly provide opion with out fact where I post links to the facts that I have assertained.
Left wing hack? LOL

Pulleeeze!!
 
Old 05-01-2010, 12:14 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,676,689 times
Reputation: 3949
Quote:
Originally Posted by deturmind View Post
Right , I heard the whole thing, read several different transcripts when the story FIRST broke. I listened to it just the other day.

He clearly stated SHE WAS PRESENT ... then the rest of the tape was all the back pedalling to correct the statement.
"He" can say anything he wants. "He" is not Sarah Obama.

But as for Sarah Obama herself, nowhere on that tape or in the transcript is there any statement by her that she was present at Obama's birth, or that Obama was born in Kenya.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 12:16 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,676,689 times
Reputation: 3949
Quote:
Originally Posted by deturmind View Post
All true, the professor was clearly trying to then say what he wanted them to say but the statement "I WAS PRESENT" was before all the twisting.
No such statement exist anywhere in the tape or the transcript.

You really have to stop making stuff up.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 12:19 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,676,689 times
Reputation: 3949
Quote:
Originally Posted by red red rose View Post
Seeing the long form birth certificate/Certificate of Live Birth would confirm if he was born a citizen at all.
The COLB already does that.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 12:24 PM
 
Location: NW Houston
229 posts, read 214,934 times
Reputation: 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayland Woman View Post
How far back do you want to make this retroactive requirement for presidential candidates? The short form is all the legal proof necessary for citizenship in the U.S.A, but if you want work to change the law, knock yourself out but most of us won't be able to get one from our birth states. Nor do most of us care to see Obama's long form.
The short form could easily be a fraud. How do you think the illegals get driver licenses?

I have got a copy of my original. It is on file at the town hall. My mother, who still lives in that town, got it for me in 2007. I needed it when I had to surrender my out of state drivers lic. and get one for state I lived in.

It was the long form complete with signatures from the doctor that delivered me and the town clerk.

So don't sit there and tell me you can't get it. If you go to the state offices you will not get the original, you will simply get the record of birth. In Mass., you go to the town hall where your parents lived at the time of your birth. My children where born in Boston but we lived in a small town. In order to registrer my children for school we had to provide thier birth certificates. Well, when we moved those forms where buried in storage. I went to the town hall when I was up there visiting relatives and easily retrieved both certs for a $5.00 fee each.

Don't speak for most of "us". Cause when you mean US you mean LIBERAL LEFTIST. Many of us do want to see it because having an unconstitutional president will cause many legal issues down the road and I don't want to see the country go through that. Every law he signed would be null and void... or would it.... how would existing administration deal with it.

The long form exists, show it! The short form does not matter.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 12:24 PM
 
122 posts, read 93,234 times
Reputation: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayland Woman View Post
And officials of the state have seen it and confirmed he is a citizen. Are you calling them all liars?
If the person who supplied the information for the birth certificate was lying about the place of birth, then he may not have been born a citizen at all. If the information was given by the Hospital and attending physician, then we know for sure that he was born a native citizen in the State of Hawaii.

I'm not saying that the officials of the state are lying, they are simply going by the information they have had supplied to them.

The truth of the information is suspect if the information did not come from the Hospital and attending Physician.

Seeing the original birth certificate would tell us where the information came from.


His place of birth is a legitimate question.


Nigerian Observer Online Edition
"The Kenyan-born Senator will, however, face a stiff competition from his Republican counterpart, John McCain who has taken the presidential battle to the finishing line with vigorous campaign strategies."

http://allafrica.com/stories/200802180051.html (broken link)
"Kampala Ugandans have formed a group to mobilise support for Kenyan born-senator, Barack Obama for the US presidency."


http://www.parliament.go.ke/parliament/index.php?option=com_docman&task=doc_download&gid= 127&Itemid= (broken link)
Kenyan Parliament
NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
OFFICIAL REPORT
Thursday, 25th March, 2010
"If America was living in a situation where they feared ethnicity and did not see itself as a multiparty state or nation, how could a young man born here in Kenya, who is not even a native American, become the President of America?" Page 31


http://www.usafricaonline.com/barackbama08usafrica.gif




I would like to know if the president was born a US citizen or not.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 12:31 PM
 
Location: NW Houston
229 posts, read 214,934 times
Reputation: 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Like h*** you supplied the link. I read it ages ago, just read it again recently. No one says they were present at Obama's birth. The US "pastor" was leading all the parties to say what he wanted them to say. He also used Sarah Obama, who thought she was going to get a Bible. What a piece of trash that guy is!
Go back and read it!!!! I certainly did !!! Don't tell me what I did and did not do!!!

I even stated it appeared he was trying to twist it around.

http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/wp-co...iptlulu109.pdf

[SIZE=4][SIZE=4][LEFT]MCRAE: Was she present when he was born in Kenya?
BROTHER TOM: I think, uh, uh I think--
VOICE (in background): (unintelligible)

BROTHER TOM (in background): He is asking her that, uh, he wants to know something that uh, was uh you, was they, was she present when, ah,[/LEFT]
he was born. Were they they there then?[/SIZE]
[/SIZE]
[SIZE=1][SIZE=1]21
[/SIZE]
[/SIZE]
[SIZE=4][SIZE=4]
[LEFT]TRANSLATOR OGOMBE: Yes, they say that yes she was.[/SIZE]
[/SIZE]
[SIZE=1][SIZE=1]22 [/SIZE][/SIZE][SIZE=4][SIZE=4]She was present when Obama was born.[/SIZE][/SIZE][SIZE=1][SIZE=1]23[/LEFT]
[/SIZE]
[/SIZE]
[SIZE=4][SIZE=4][LEFT](McRae catches breath)

MCRAE: OK.[/SIZE]
[/SIZE]
[SIZE=1][SIZE=1]24 [/SIZE][/SIZE][SIZE=4][SIZE=4]Uh, when I come in December I would like to go by the, the
place, the hospital where he is born. Uh, could you tell me where he was born? Was he born in Mombasa?
(Long pause. Puzzled sound from Translator Ogombe in background:[/LEFT]
"naah?")[/SIZE]
[/SIZE]
[SIZE=1][SIZE=1]25
[/SIZE]
[/SIZE]
 
Old 05-01-2010, 12:32 PM
 
Location: On Top
12,388 posts, read 11,645,012 times
Reputation: 4027
Quote:
Originally Posted by red red rose View Post
<snip>I would like to know if the president was born a US citizen or not.
Yes he was, just as his Hawaiian COLB states...
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