U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 05-01-2010, 03:31 PM
 
1,503 posts, read 929,233 times
Reputation: 321

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by deturmind View Post
True but you need a birth certificate if you were born here. If not we all know already how easy it is to get one. The only state in the union that does not presently require you to be a resident of the state is Maine.

It depends on what state. Most require a SSN, so only non-citizens that hold work visa's can get them. It is safe to say, it is almost impossible to get a drivers lic. if you are ILLEGAL or LEGAL visitor to the US.

.
Not true, for example foreign students can get drivers licenses.

 
Old 05-01-2010, 03:33 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,651,546 times
Reputation: 3949
Quote:
Originally Posted by red red rose View Post
Prima facie evidence is that evidence which is sufficient to establish a fact or sustain a judgment unless it is rebutted or contradictory evidence is produced. The prima facie evidence rule does not shut out evidence; instead it declares that a particular conduct shall be enough as evidence until and unless the opposing party produces contradictory evidence.
Exactly.... and since you have no evidence with which to rebut or contradict it, the COLB is "sufficient to establish a fact or sustain a judgment."

Your real problem here is that you are confusing "evidence" with "legal proof."

Legal proof is established by a formal evidentiary standard. And the standards have been carefully defined so that people like you who want to keep moving the goal posts when things are not going your way cannot do so.

In a civil proceeding, the standard of proof is "the preponderance of evidence." The COLB all by itself constitutes the preponderance of evidence on this issue. It does not even need corroborating evidence such as the birth announcements, or the statements of Obama, his sister, his aunt, or the Director of the Hawaii Department of Health.

All by itself, alone and unembellished, the COLB establishes that the preponderance of evidence is in favor of Obama's Hawaiian birth. Hence it is absolute legal proof.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 03:35 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,651,546 times
Reputation: 3949
Quote:
Originally Posted by deturmind View Post
That long form cert. would halt the investigation in its tracks.
Oh... so you reject the "two citizen parent" theory?

Good for you.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 03:36 PM
 
7,541 posts, read 5,348,352 times
Reputation: 1833
Quote:
Originally Posted by red red rose View Post
From Hawaii statute §338-6
"If neither parent of the newborn child whose birth is unattended"

"unattended" means a doctor was not there, OK?
dude, I didn't say the doctor HAD TO BE THERE at time of birth; they need a DOCTOR to sign off that a BIRTH happened.

Get it?

No you dont.


Quote:
OK, I say Long Form, you say Certificate of Live Birth. We mean the same thing.
No you dont. The term "Long form" doesn't exist in any legal language nor is it a correct description of what various birth certificates will contain. The "Long form" contains WAY more information than you think it does.


Quote:
Like these, the birth certificates of twins born in Hawaii the day after Obama.


That is from an article in the Honolulu Advertiser titled "Hawaii officials confirm Obama’s original birth certificate still exists"
Hawaii officials confirm Obama’s original birth certificate still exists | The Honolulu Advertiser | Hawaii's Newspaper
Note the box that says "Signature of parent or other informant."

Seeing the long form birth certificate/Certificate of Live Birth would confirm if he was born a citizen at all.
Those aren't even "long forms". I'll tell you right now, there are a ton of missing information from the Nordyke Twins COLB's that you dont even know about.

That is a version of the COLB that is provided to the children's parents that they can easily keep. And over the years that COLB has changed to ask for LESS information. By the 80's a lot of that information was not needed and by the 90's the short form is all that is needed.


If you want to know how long the "long form" really is, its over 10 pages printed.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 03:42 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,651,546 times
Reputation: 3949
Quote:
Originally Posted by deturmind View Post
So what is your point? Do you really think anyone would have questioned Andrew Jackson? Old Hickory would have never put up with that. I guess I should have gone a step further and asked for parents born in a forgiegn land and then returned.
See? What did I say about moving the goal posts?

You guys just can't help yourselves.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 03:43 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
20,894 posts, read 13,651,546 times
Reputation: 3949
Quote:
Originally Posted by deturmind View Post
Prove it. Long form cert would prove it.
A long form would prove nothing that the short form doesn't already prove.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 03:44 PM
 
7,541 posts, read 5,348,352 times
Reputation: 1833
Quote:
Originally Posted by deturmind View Post
Prove it. Long form cert would prove it.
there is no such thing as a long form. Get that through your thick skull.

He has provided his COLB, which is the only form that Hawaii gives to its residents when requesting a copy.

I cannot even get a copy of my "Long form", even if I SUE the Dept of Health in Hawaii to do so.

as I stated earlier in this thread; the Certificate of Live Birth (like the Nordyke Twins) is no longer a VALID certificate because it doesn't meet the requirements of being valid. Today, if the Nordyke twins would like to use their COLB to prove citizenship, they'd be ask to get a copy that is VALID.
 
Old 05-01-2010, 03:45 PM
 
Location: On Top
12,388 posts, read 11,631,450 times
Reputation: 4027
Quote:
Originally Posted by deturmind View Post
<snip>Oh yeah, he will be a two termer ... Can you say worst ever. Jimmy Carter has never been happier since he will lose that crown.

Once the senate and house are back in order Bama will be a lame duck for next 2 years.

Say bye to health care ... the senate finance committee won't be funding that after Jan. 2011. Ha Ha Ha then Obama's opion won't matter !!! HA HA HA

YouTube - Supertramp - Dreamer
 
Old 05-01-2010, 03:47 PM
 
7,541 posts, read 5,348,352 times
Reputation: 1833
Quote:
Originally Posted by HistorianDude View Post
See? What did I say about moving the goal posts?

You guys just can't help yourselves.

Yes,
 
Old 05-01-2010, 03:47 PM
 
Location: NW Houston
229 posts, read 214,611 times
Reputation: 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by rhinestone View Post
I doubt you have much in the bank now. My portfolio is up substantially since 1/20/09.

When Bush was in office I moved all my money to European stocks. It's back in the USA now and I'm doing fine. Just like under Clinton.

Yeah sure you did ... I left mine alone and it doubled from 2002 till now.

The market collapsed completely in 2001 due to the internet bubble burst.

I am sure having Bush in office for 6 months caused that. It nothing to do with all the tech spending in preparation for Y2K that evaporated once we passed the date. I move most of it into Bonds just at the end of 1999. I never lost more than 3% of my total.

The market did great till 2008 when the mortgage banking industry collapsed.

More banks closed in Bama's first year then in Bush's entire term.

Get over it, the market downturn was due to the sub-prime mortgage market. That was caused by "Barney Frankly I don't care what you think".

The Dem congress forced these banks to lend to these people who could not afford it. The smart banks sold thier mortgage businesses (IE PNC in 2001).

I expect the next downturn to be when the commercial mortgage business crashes. The difference now is I can no longer use the bond market to hedge again stock market drops. OK, I can't spell but I know where put my money. I assure you it is not Europe. If you think the US deficit is bad check out any European country. We may owe the most but due to extremely large number of taxpayers (albeit down to 47% of working adults) we each owe around $45K ... compare that to socialist Europe and it is scary.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top