Does anybody really celebrate Martin Luther King Day? (Brown, state, religion)
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Why should it be illegal? Do you not have the right to pick and choose who you associate with and allow into your own home? And rightfully so. Why should your private business be any different?
As I have said many times on this thread, to deliberatly discriminate may be morally wrong. And I happen to think it is. But should NOT be illegal.
Ok...here we go again.
No, the federal government should have stayed out of it as it just made things worse. What the government can give can also be taken away.
As an aside here, are you familiar with Shelby Steele? I may be misquoting, but as I recall, there was once a panel discussion among black "leaders" which included both left and right. The topic was "affirmative action". Steele asked aloud (again, as I recall) why so much stock is put into something that "white people" could revoke at any time. And made the correct notation that white guilt is not an ever renewable resource. To bring that down to a more personal level, I don't feel the SLIGHTEST bit of "guilt" over anything my ancestors may have done. And nothing to feel guilty about, anyway. They were products of their time just like we are of ours.
It is worth pondering, don't you think? It is a damn shame that black conservatives such as Steele (and Walter Williams and Thomas Sowell, etc) are not being listened to. They see clearly that, ultimately, it depends on black people empowering themselves and to quit listening to race-baiters like the reverend Jackson and Sharpton.
That is to say...what if all of a sudden (and I have done it long ago), the worm turns and it was decided to abolish affirmative action upon the (correct) grounds no white person living owes anyone a damn thing in terms of historical guilt?
Unfortunately, as Steele pointed out, all too much of the black community would be without resources because they depend upon it...thanks to the Jacksons and Sharptons of the world. Sad and pathetic...
The idea that it should be legal for business's to discriminate is absolutely repugnant. What do you do if virtually all business's in a community collude to discriminate against blacks or any other group for that matter as an effort to keep them out of their community? Then what? You have more legalized segregation. Its sick.
The idea that it should be legal for business's to discriminate is absolutely repugnant.
Let's be honest. All of us -- everyday -- discriminate in some form or fashion. You pick your friends and associates just as I do mine. Discrimination has taken on a negative connotation...but the fact of discrimination is simply intrinsic to human nature.
Smart people tend to bond with likeminded. Low life criminals seek each other out. Blacks tend to associate with blacks and Asians with Asians and whites with white. And ect. etc. What is wrong with that? So long as it is not forced, who gives a damn...or should?
Would you not agree that a person has every right to pick and choose who they allow into their own home? If so, why should it be different for a business owner to do the same?
Personally, if business excluded me from patronizing it? I wouldn't care one way or another. Wouldn't hurt my feelings in the least.
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What do you do if virtually all business's in a community collude to discriminate against blacks or any other group for that matter as an effort to keep them out of their community? Then what? You have more legalized segregation. Its sick.
No...what you would have is a situation that may be morally repugnant, but should not be mandated nor forced otherwise. You cannot change attitudes with a law. And no, it would not be legalized segregation. It would simply be one business owner - or a collective of them -- making bigoted choices...but that is their problem just as it should be their right.
As I said earler, any joint which -- in this day and age -- put up Jim Crow signs (black or white) would not last very long.
Let's be honest. All of us -- everyday -- discriminate in some form or fashion. You pick your friends and associates just as I do mine. Discrimination has taken on a negative connotation...but the fact is simply intrinsic to human nature.
Smart people tend to bond with likeminded. Low life criminals seek each other out. Blacks tend to associate with blacks and Asians with Asians and whites with white. And ect. etc. What is wrong with that? So long as it is not forced, who gives a damn...or should?
Would you not agree that a person has every right to pick and choose who they allow into their own home? If so, why should it be different for a business owner to do the same.
Personally, if business excluded me from patronizing it? I wouldn't care one way or another. Wouldn't hurt my feelings in the least.
No...what you would have is a situation that may be morally repugnant, but should not be mandated nor forced otherwise. You cannot change attitudes with a law. And no, it would not be legalized segregation. It would simply be one business owner - or a collective of them -- making bigoted choices...but that is their problem just as it should be their right.
As I said earler, any joint which -- in this day and age -- put up Jim Crow signs (black or white) would not last very long.
A place of business is a bit different than someones home not to mention one group would be excluded much more than others. This was even truer during this time period when it would have been fairly commonplace if it was legal. Its just utterly despicable to think it should be legal for business's to discriminate. As far as your whole people associate with their own race line of thinking, I have friends of different backgrounds, races, religion, etc.
A place of business is a bit different than someones home not to mention one group would be excluded much more than others.
How so? In a free society, how so?
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Thiis was even truer during this time period when it would have been fairly commonplace if it was legal. Its just utterly despicable to think it should be legal for business's to discriminate.
It might be utterly despicable for a business owner to practice discrimination based on race (or whatever), but it should not be illegal. The owner takes the risk, invests the money, and it must be presumed they know what is best for how it to make a profit.
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As far as your whole people associate with their own race line of thinking, I have friends of different backgrounds, races, religion, etc.
So do I. And the point is...? Still, I am betting the cotton crop, those of the different races, religions, backgrounds, etc, you choose to associate with still have some sort of common denominator in terms of lifestyle, intelligence, mutual interests, etc, which makes you pick them as your friends over others you choose to have nothing to do with, right?
If so, then THAT is discriminating. And nothing wrong with it...
It might be utterly despicable for a business owner to practice discrimination based on race (or whatever), but it should not be illegal. The owner takes the risk, invests the money, and it must be presumed they know what is best for how it to make a profit.
So do I. And the point is...? Still, I am betting the cotton crop, those of the different races, religions, backgrounds, etc, you choose to associate with still have some sort of common denominator in terms of lifestyle, intelligence, mutual interests, etc, which makes you pick them as your friends over others you choose to have nothing to do with, right?
If so, then THAT is discriminating. And nothing wrong with it...
Because you are directly infringing on the rights of others by refusing to hire them, serve them, etc on the basis of race, religion, or whatever. Everyone should have equal rights to be able to shop where they want to shop, eat where they want to eat, someone should not have that right taken away from them because of some bigot and that is why we need those laws. This was even more true during the Civil Rights Era, as you would have likely had many more business owners, etc that practiced in legal discrimination if they were allowed to
It might be utterly despicable for a business owner to practice discrimination based on race (or whatever), but it should not be illegal. The owner takes the risk, invests the money, and it must be presumed they know what is best for how it to make a profit.
So do I. And the point is...? Still, I am betting the cotton crop, those of the different races, religions, backgrounds, etc, you choose to associate with still have some sort of common denominator in terms of lifestyle, intelligence, mutual interests, etc, which makes you pick them as your friends over others you choose to have nothing to do with, right?
If so, then THAT is discriminating. And nothing wrong with it...
OK, so what happens if you are traveling, running out of gas in a remote area and you happen to come across a gas station (the only one within miles) BUT you happen to be the WRONG color to be served? Yet this happened to many ppl in this country for many years. I'm proud that ppl like MLK and LBJ stood for common decency in this land.
Because you are directly infringing on the rights of others by refusing to hire them, serve them, etc on the basis of race, religion, or whatever.
Are you implying there exists a "right" to be hired? The business owner is the best judge of that, don't you think? Not the government.
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Everyone should have equal rights to be able to shop where they want to shop, eat where they want to eat, someone should not have that right taken away from them because of some bigot and that is why we need those laws. This was even more true during the Civil Rights Era, as you would have likely had many more business owners, etc that practiced in legal discrimination if they were allowed to
Sure, ideally, I might agree and said as much. But you seem to be missing the point that, ultimately, a business belongs to the owner, not the government. A private business offers a commodity, take it or leave it. One has no "rights" beyond that. A trade off of money for service.
If the business practices morally repugnant policies? Then boycott it. Refuse to patronize it. Organize and run it out of business. No problem there.
It is not the same thing as a government entity which does not and should not discriminate.
OK, so what happens if you are traveling, running out of gas in a remote area and you happen to come across a gas station (the only one within miles) BUT you happen to be the WRONG color to be served? Yet this happened to many ppl in this country for many years. I'm proud that ppl like MLK and LBJ stood for common decency in this land.
Those days are long over, wehotex. Things changed and well they should have. But the feds getting involved in it made it all worse, in many ways (which have been mentioned, earlier).
One of the things I keep trying to get across is that ANY TIME government gets into it, it invariably messes up. Makes the situation worse -- in lots of ways -- than existed to begin with.
Are you implying there exists a "right" to be hired? The business owner is the best judge of that, don't you think? Not the government.
Sure, ideally, I might agree and said as much. But you seem to be missing the point that, ultimately, a business belongs to the owner, not the government. A private business offers a commodity, take it or leave it. One has no "rights" beyond that. A trade off of money for service.
If the business practices morally repugnant policies? Then boycott it. Refuse to patronize it. Organize and run it out of business. No problem there.
It is not the same thing as a government entity which does not and should not discriminate.
No, I'm not saying there exists a right to be hired. What I am saying is everyone should be afforded equal rights, and that discrimination whether it be something governmental, in the workplace or something along the lines of a place to shop or eat should not be legal.
Those days are long over, wehotex. Things changed and well they should have. But the feds getting involved in it made it all worse, in many ways (which have been mentioned, earlier).
One of the things I keep trying to get across is that ANY TIME government gets into it, it invariably messes up. Makes the situation worse -- in lots of ways -- than existed to begin with.
The only people the feds made it worse for were racists.
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