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I personally find that to be a fairly flawed concept. Especially since statistics have proven that more diverse areas tend to be less tolerant than areas with very little diversity.
A good example of this is in the North prior to the Civil War, there was almost zero diversity in the North, and where there was diversity(usually because of large Italian or Irish populations) there was the least tolerance.
I see absolutely no benefits at all to diversity, nor has there even been proven to be any benefits at all to society as a result of diversity. But, I will still give you that fact that, I still don't have the right to tell you what you should believe. If you want to believe diversity is good, by all means, do it. But I get tired of the burdens of diversity being passed on to me. This includes crime, bad schools, bad laws, and bad social programs(such as affirmative action and others of their ilk). Imagine how many problems of our society today would disappear if there was no diversity. I wouldn't even be having this conversation with you right now.
So please, stop imposing your beliefs and feelings on me. And go back to where you came from if you don't like where you are.
The demographics are much different where there are high populations of diversity. Bigger cities have more comfort zones for a broader range of ethnicities. These areas were developed first and offer more imported goods than surrounding areas. The higher the population the higher the crime. If you look at prisons, by default they have high crime because they have no where to go. This amplifies ignorance and a more caged like animal behavior.
The biggest benefit of diversity imo is obtaining a level of exterior acceptance so one can not be distracted with trivial issues and can be of better use to society. This alleviates people from outside pressure and in a sense breaks the mold of what most know as acceptance.
I both agree and disagree. I think race should be just another factor that affects your decision when you are out looking for a mate. While race doesn't present any definites. Neither does dating a professional, or a druggie, or an eco-freak, or an athlete, yet you can tell a lot about a person that is a professional or a druggie or an eco-freak or an athlete. To trivialize race as if it is a non-factor is only done for political reasons. The people who oppose discriminating by race are the ones who want race to disappear, or at least they oppose discrimination. But do they really oppose discrimination? Or do they just want to choose on what basis we should be allowed to discriminate?
When I go to a dating website, race is on the list of compatibility traits, as well as height, weight, smoking or non-smoking, religion, etc. All these "compatibility" traits are nothing but voluntary discrimination. So, why is it acceptable to discriminate based on religion? Or even height? But you believe it should be unacceptable to discriminate based on race? Why the inconsistency? Possibly politically motivated? Are you possibly trying to push your beliefs and ideals on everyone else?
The extent of this war on racial discrimination has actually made people into criminals(through governments use of force, detainment, and fines), and at the very least anyone who disagrees is constantly painted as ignorant and intollerant. Yet, these constant attacks by the politically-correct establishment are hardly any form of "tolerance" themselves, it is quite the opposite. I'll make a deal with you, if you stop making forum posts such as this one we are in, which only has the intention of belittling anyone you people disagree with. Then I'll keep my opinions to myself. Because ultimately I believe in freedom. You have the freedom to marry anyone you want, and I have the freedom to not like anyone I don't want to like for any reason I decide to not like them. Deal?
Or at least make a forum post with a scientific or other rational/logical basis for your argument, not just verbal assaults like a 12-year old.
That is you. That is your prerogative.
My first question is:
A)Why do people want to commit acts of racial discrimination in the first place?
B)How I am belittling anyone?
C)How are my opinions "verbal assaults like that of a 12 year-old"?
I find it interesting that someone who seems to champion the notion that race doesn't exist, or race is merely a social construct, would be so eager to get out of Portugal because in your opinion it is "too white".
From seeing what you have to say you are either a fairly recent Indian immigrant to Portugal, you are an Indian who was born to Indian immigrants to portugal, or you are just a dark-skinned ethnicity that lives in Portugal.
In my opinion this whole tolerance/racial freedom crap really boils down to one thing. Many many people move across the country and even across the world, usually because of jobs, but sometimes because of fear(refugees). And when they get to where they end up, they want things to be the same in their new home as it was in their old home(at least the things they see positively).
This causes two reactions. The immigrants and the descendants of the immigrants whose way-of-life is so much different than the people around them, are rejected from society. And the original inhabitants become resistant to what they see as the undermining of their own culture or way-of-life.
Because this country is founded on freedom, there is a general attitude(especially from the people that are completely unaffected by the stream of immigrants) to want to protect these minorities from being oppressed, harrassed, or intimidated by the majority. And while the minority groups may create an alliance to protect themselves from the tyranny of the majority, the minority groups have no more sympathy for other minorities as the majority group had sympathy for the minority groups(hence why you have asian vs hispanics vs blacks here in America).
So the question in my mind is, what is the problem? And then what is the solution to this problem?
An interesting thing I have found is the irony of the whole situation. The problem with intolerance comes from one thing, diversity. And the proposed solution to fix the problem of intolerance? More diversity.
I personally find that to be a fairly flawed concept. Especially since statistics have proven that more diverse areas tend to be less tolerant than areas with very little diversity.
A good example of this is in the North prior to the Civil War, there was almost zero diversity in the North, and where there was diversity(usually because of large Italian or Irish populations) there was the least tolerance.
I see absolutely no benefits at all to diversity, nor has there even been proven to be any benefits at all to society as a result of diversity. But, I will still give you that fact that, I still don't have the right to tell you what you should believe. If you want to believe diversity is good, by all means, do it. But I get tired of the burdens of diversity being passed on to me. This includes crime, bad schools, bad laws, and bad social programs(such as affirmative action and others of their ilk). Imagine how many problems of our society today would disappear if there was no diversity. I wouldn't even be having this conversation with you right now.
So please, stop imposing your beliefs and feelings on me. And go back to where you came from if you don't like where you are.
Sorry to disappoint you, I am German (no immigrant background whatsoever), which is why I don't like Germany, it is even more boring than Portugal. There are lots of Turks, yes, but they live in their own subculture, which I am not interested in anyway. My dream is NE Brazil, but I can not move there because of immigration restrictions. If I had to choose between boredom and problems, I guess I would go for the problems, especially in the long term.
I guess if one never gets out of one's own culture, one does not miss diversity, but once one has traveled the world and lived in different countries, the idea of returning to the original place is a bit depressing.
I am not imposing my beliefs or feelings on you. You don't like what I write, which is why you react that way If you don't want to discuss this topic, why are you here?
In your country many regions are not diverse anyway, even in the Midwest outside the big cities towns are almost all white. So if someone feels so uncomfortable with diversity, they should just move to Iowa or Dakota or wherever.
The demographics are much different where there are high populations of diversity. Bigger cities have more comfort zones for a broader range of ethnicities. These areas were developed first and offer more imported goods than surrounding areas. The higher the population the higher the crime. If you look at prisons, by default they have high crime because they have no where to go. This amplifies ignorance and a more caged like animal behavior.
The biggest benefit of diversity imo is obtaining a level of exterior acceptance so one can not be distracted with trivial issues and can be of better use to society. This alleviates people from outside pressure and in a sense breaks the mold of what most know as acceptance.
I have no idea wtf you just said. Does that make sense to anyone else?
You just said demographics are different where there is diversity? Do you even know what the word "demographics" means? That whole line seems absolutely unnecessary.
Secondly, if people don't feel accepted here, why do they even come? Why should we be forced to accept people that we dislike/disagree with to come live next door? Should an orthodox jew and radical muslim really like next to each other? Is that really a good idea?
Lets pretend you had a housing developement that was 90% jews and someone moved. Should the seller be forced to allow a muslim to buy the house by the government? Do you really think thats a good idea? Do you think that will foster some sort of magical acceptance out of the two groups? Or do you think that will just **** a lot of people off and make them feel uncomfortable?
This general attitude is why our streets and communities have become so divided. A great deal of the people in this country don't even know their neighbors. This is especially true in areas of the greatest diversity. Diversity is driving us apart not together. Can you not open your eyes and see that?
I don't know what kind of bull**** liberal radio you listen to to get your information on the subject. But they could make anything up they wanted to, it doesn't make it the truth.
Did you know there were more black/white marriages before the civil rights movement than there are today? Did you know that schools are more segregated today than they were before the civil rights movement?
There are absolutely no benefits to diversity at all. Anyone with a brain and two eyes to see can understand it.
That doesn't mean that we should prohibit diversity, it just means we need to have a rational outlook on diversity. We need to drop the policy of shoving diversity down everyones throats. If diversity is a good thing, it will just happen on its own.
Here is my favorite line from that article.
"If diversity were a strength people would practice it spontaneously. It wouldn't require constant cheer-leading or expensive lawsuits. If diversity were enriching, people would seek it out. It is in private gatherings not governed by some kind of "civil-rights" law that Americans show just how much strength and enrichment they find in diversity. Such gatherings are usually the very opposite of diverse."
Quote:
Originally Posted by pirate_lafitte
That is you. That is your prerogative.
My first question is:
A)Why do people want to commit acts of racial discrimination in the first place?
B)How I am belittling anyone?
C)How are my opinions "verbal assaults like that of a 12 year-old"?
A) There are many reasons why people would discriminate by race. The question for me is, why wouldn't anyone want to discriminate by race? But you have to understand what discriminate really means.
Lets take a quick example of dogs for a second. If you were walking down the street and a golden retriever flanked you on one side, and a pit bull flanked you on the other. Which one would do you think you would be more frightened of? Would you be right all of the time? No. Would you be right most of the time? Yes.
Now, if you were walking down the same street and a white guy flanked you on one side and a black guy flanked you on the other. Which one would you be more frightened of? I know you'll answer both, but why? African-Americans are about seven times more likely to commit murder than a white guy. And they are several times more likely to commit a violent act.
If you have two employees with the exact credentials and equal in all other aspects, why would you choose the black guy over the white guy? Or even the white guy over the Asian guy? That is, unless you believed that the color of his skin would be relevant to your business. Either by the types of customers of your business responding better to one over the other. Or by the environment being more comfortable for other employees if you chose one race over the other. And if you make that decision based on race, then are you not racially discriminating?
The truth is, blacks tend to be more comfortable around other blacks. Black customers tend to prefer black staffing for assistance. And it goes that way for everyone. It is just a natural human tendency. I don't get bothered by an all-black store. But if I did, I just wouldn't shop there. I wouldn't insist that a soul shop(or whatever) had to hire white people. That is just stupid.
B) I really meant this post and the condescending people who make comments about anyone who racially discrimates being somehow ignorant or right-wing or some other belittling comment to brand anyone who disagrees with you as somehow being beneath you or just crazy.
The basis of this post was that it is 2010, and times have changed. Basically that what is and isn't acceptable in society has changed and that the people who don't conform to this new view of the world need to conform to it. Which is obviously a ridiculous assertion to make. How can the world change unless there are people who don't conform to the status quo putting pressure on society to change to begin with.
C) I really should have explained more that I wasn't really talking to you directly. It was more an open-ended statement to anyone and everyone in this thread, who tend to want to throw out verbal assaults on me in an attempt to marginalize what I am saying.
Basically, if you ever read my posts. I don't like to call people names. I try to be as respectful as possible. I merely come here to present facts to express my views, especially by providing links to information so people can understand where my views originate from.
One thing I thought was funny the other day was about how politics can distort words to mean something they really don't. Lets take the word "pro-choice", it means you support the ability to have an abortion. Well many people will instead refer to this word as "pro-abortion", which means you are for abortion. If you take this distortion of the meaning of the word. It could appear as if you like to kill babies, that you believe killing babies is good. People who are pro-choice don't think abortion is good, just that abortion sometimes is the best option.
I am personally a libertarian, which means I am about as pro-choice, on every single issue. I wouldn't consider myself pro-racial discrimination, I would call myself pro-choice on racial discrimination.
If you saw the way Rand Paul was treated recently about his comments about private companies being stripped of their rights to free speech by the Civil Rights act. Then you might understand why I get so irritated by these holier than thou people who say they believe in freedom, but only when it's convenient.
In the States color does not even mean diversity. Black Americans are not Masai and white Americans are not Dutch. In the US both groups speak the same language, eat the same food, watch the same TV programs, listen to each other's music, at least to a certain extent etc.
Except for superficial aspects such as color or eye shape, music probably is the one aspect where Americans are most diverse, but not necessarily along color lines. There are a lot of whites who like Jazz and RnB, and there are blacks who like Metal, Pop or whatever.
I guess diversity is only a problem until mixing does away with it. Supporting diversity means trying to maintain differences, as if people were museum objects. I know a family in Chicago, very mixed, the children look as if they did not even belong to the same family (but they do). But they don't have a problem with that, they are very close. The only problem are some outsiders who don't want to take people as what they are, individual beings.
I have no idea wtf you just said. Does that make sense to anyone else?
You just said demographics are different where there is diversity? Do you even know what the word "demographics" means? That whole line seems absolutely unnecessary.
Secondly, if people don't feel accepted here, why do they even come? Why should we be forced to accept people that we dislike/disagree with to come live next door? Should an orthodox jew and radical muslim really like next to each other? Is that really a good idea?
Lets pretend you had a housing developement that was 90% jews and someone moved. Should the seller be forced to allow a muslim to buy the house by the government? Do you really think thats a good idea? Do you think that will foster some sort of magical acceptance out of the two groups? Or do you think that will just **** a lot of people off and make them feel uncomfortable?
This general attitude is why our streets and communities have become so divided. A great deal of the people in this country don't even know their neighbors. This is especially true in areas of the greatest diversity. Diversity is driving us apart not together. Can you not open your eyes and see that?
I don't know what kind of bull**** liberal radio you listen to to get your information on the subject. But they could make anything up they wanted to, it doesn't make it the truth.
Did you know there were more black/white marriages before the civil rights movement than there are today? Did you know that schools are more segregated today than they were before the civil rights movement?
There are absolutely no benefits to diversity at all. Anyone with a brain and two eyes to see can understand it.
That doesn't mean that we should prohibit diversity, it just means we need to have a rational outlook on diversity. We need to drop the policy of shoving diversity down everyones throats. If diversity is a good thing, it will just happen on its own.
Here is my favorite line from that article.
"If diversity were a strength people would practice it spontaneously. It wouldn't require constant cheer-leading or expensive lawsuits. If diversity were enriching, people would seek it out. It is in private gatherings not governed by some kind of "civil-rights" law that Americans show just how much strength and enrichment they find in diversity. Such gatherings are usually the very opposite of diverse."
A) There are many reasons why people would discriminate by race. The question for me is, why wouldn't anyone want to discriminate by race? But you have to understand what discriminate really means.
Lets take a quick example of dogs for a second. If you were walking down the street and a golden retriever flanked you on one side, and a pit bull flanked you on the other. Which one would do you think you would be more frightened of? Would you be right all of the time? No. Would you be right most of the time? Yes.
Now, if you were walking down the same street and a white guy flanked you on one side and a black guy flanked you on the other. Which one would you be more frightened of? I know you'll answer both, but why? African-Americans are about seven times more likely to commit murder than a white guy. And they are several times more likely to commit a violent act.
If you have two employees with the exact credentials and equal in all other aspects, why would you choose the black guy over the white guy? Or even the white guy over the Asian guy? That is, unless you believed that the color of his skin would be relevant to your business. Either by the types of customers of your business responding better to one over the other. Or by the environment being more comfortable for other employees if you chose one race over the other. And if you make that decision based on race, then are you not racially discriminating?
The truth is, blacks tend to be more comfortable around other blacks. Black customers tend to prefer black staffing for assistance. And it goes that way for everyone. It is just a natural human tendency. I don't get bothered by an all-black store. But if I did, I just wouldn't shop there. I wouldn't insist that a soul shop(or whatever) had to hire white people. That is just stupid.
B) I really meant this post and the condescending people who make comments about anyone who racially discrimates being somehow ignorant or right-wing or some other belittling comment to brand anyone who disagrees with you as somehow being beneath you or just crazy.
The basis of this post was that it is 2010, and times have changed. Basically that what is and isn't acceptable in society has changed and that the people who don't conform to this new view of the world need to conform to it. Which is obviously a ridiculous assertion to make. How can the world change unless there are people who don't conform to the status quo putting pressure on society to change to begin with.
C) I really should have explained more that I wasn't really talking to you directly. It was more an open-ended statement to anyone and everyone in this thread, who tend to want to throw out verbal assaults on me in an attempt to marginalize what I am saying.
Basically, if you ever read my posts. I don't like to call people names. I try to be as respectful as possible. I merely come here to present facts to express my views, especially by providing links to information so people can understand where my views originate from.
One thing I thought was funny the other day was about how politics can distort words to mean something they really don't. Lets take the word "pro-choice", it means you support the ability to have an abortion. Well many people will instead refer to this word as "pro-abortion", which means you are for abortion. If you take this distortion of the meaning of the word. It could appear as if you like to kill babies, that you believe killing babies is good. People who are pro-choice don't think abortion is good, just that abortion sometimes is the best option.
I am personally a libertarian, which means I am about as pro-choice, on every single issue. I wouldn't consider myself pro-racial discrimination, I would call myself pro-choice on racial discrimination.
If you saw the way Rand Paul was treated recently about his comments about private companies being stripped of their rights to free speech by the Civil Rights act. Then you might understand why I get so irritated by these holier than thou people who say they believe in freedom, but only when it's convenient.
A)This is why I wouldn't discriminate. If a person is applying for a job and has the qualifications necessary, why shouldn't I hire that person? Why should that person's race be an issue? if he or she can do the work and has the qualifications necessary, why not let that person work? I look at also from the perspective of someone who does belong to a historically oppressed minority. I ask "How does it help me if someone denies me a job because of my skin color? If I am being denied a job, I can't work, I can't make money, it will be tougher for me to survive." That is how I would look at the situation. That person might need the job and I will have a person good enough for the job that in the long run, I make money too. That is just one example of why I wouldn't discriminate. In this nation's history, racial discrimination has been about denying people opportunities because of their race, therefore, their lives end up harder.
B)Well, I won't lie to you, anyone who thinks racial discrimination is okay, I think of those persons in a less than nice view. It is those persons I am afraid of. The USA I am living in today is because people from my grandfather's generation stood up and fought to have better things, so no one would have to put up with racial discrimination, so when someone feels like it should be okay to discriminate, naturally, I will be upset. I look back on the times when that kind of stuff was legal and how hard life was back in those days and then I think about my life now and what I have.
C) I don't call anyone names either.
Judging from some posts it seems necessary to point out nobody is urging anyone to enter an interracial relationship, that would be absurd.
If I am not mistaken this thread is merely about dealing with interracial couples when you see them or have to do with them for whatever reason, just like some people have a problem seeing gay couples.
Judging from some posts it seems necessary to point out nobody is urging anyone to enter an interracial relationship, that would be absurd.
If I am not mistaken this thread is merely about dealing with interracial couples when you see them or have to do with them for whatever reason, just like some people have a problem seeing gay couples.
That is part of why I was trying to say. I am trying to "make" anyone enter an interracial relationship. I am just offering my view on interracial relationships.
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