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View Poll Results: What should be done about Social Security?
Abolish it. 58 28.16%
Change it. 58 28.16%
Keep it. Leave the current system in place. 90 43.69%
Voters: 206. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-10-2008, 12:26 PM
 
764 posts, read 1,453,748 times
Reputation: 254

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Quote:
Originally Posted by SarahSal View Post
One news show this morning said the trend is that a vast majority of Americans are saving much less for retirement than ever before. So, why then do some posting here maintain they *will* save given the opportunity to exchange SS for a personal retirement savings account?

Besides everyone should know by now Social Security is a committment from one generation to the next. That's why it has worked! My parents paid in so I'd receive retirement security and I'm paying in so my children someday will receive the same benefits. I guess some might call it a ponzi scheme. I prefer to view it as America's families and workers helping one another to feel secure in their old age.
I view SS as an annuity. I like it. I don't think I'll need it unless I suffer a calamity of monumental proportion that destroys my financial base, but it's certainly comforting knowing that SS won't be opened up for the taking by those oh-so-honest titans of Wall Street to play with.
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Old 11-10-2008, 12:32 PM
 
Location: long island , ny
1,229 posts, read 2,907,160 times
Reputation: 397
They can not abolish it ! they would have to settle up...they cant stop stealing from us ....because The younger folks will be paying into it 10 years longer than baby boomers did and collecting for half as long!!!
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Old 11-10-2008, 12:33 PM
 
Location: The ends DO NOT justify the means!!!
4,783 posts, read 3,728,364 times
Reputation: 1336
No, it will only be squandered by the socialist elite on their evil programs of social experimentation.
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Old 11-10-2008, 01:03 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 39,163,544 times
Reputation: 4937
I voted to change the system - and give the American worker the option of what do to with their money

I would propose allowing the American worker to take up to 25% of what would normally be going into Social Security, and allow the worker to have another tax free investment program (similar to the 401K type programs). This contribution would not be mandatory - if someone does not want to go into the 401K type program - they would not have to. The entire amount would go to SS.

Much like changing insurance programs once a year, the worker would have the right to get in, or out, of these types of programs.
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Old 11-10-2008, 04:46 PM
 
Location: The ends DO NOT justify the means!!!
4,783 posts, read 3,728,364 times
Reputation: 1336
Why not allow them to do whatever they want with the 15% of their earnings? I do not understand how it is the godvernment's job to protect people from their own stupidity.

I commend you for trying to make a change, by why do you fail short of freedom?
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Old 11-10-2008, 05:11 PM
 
Location: Earth
20 posts, read 24,334 times
Reputation: 12
Loans are secured by collateral. Federal Debt is secured by U.S. citizens with Social Security numbers a.k.a. "human resources."

Social Security is a program that fuels investment in the United States, secured by the labor of U.S. citizens/human resources.

Beyond all warm-and-fuzzy talk about helping people and providing for the general welfare (the seduction), the real focus is money and profit.

Social Security is not insurance. Social Security is not an annuity.

Social Security is a compulsory excise tax for the privilege of operating as a business entity called a taxpayer.

'(4) "taxpayer" means any natural person, corporation, partnership, firm, association, or governmental unit or agency acting as a business entity in this state.' -- SOURCE: Alaska Statutes: 19.900. -- Definitions -- 15 AAC 19.900. Definitions

On a Social Security application one is always required to state if one is a U.S. citizen.

The 14th Amendment, which uses the term "citizens of the United States," states in Section 4., "The validity of the public debt of the United States, ... shall not be questioned."

Exercise the privilege of operating in a state as a business entity known as a taxpayer, then pay the compulsory income taxes associated with that privilege.

That is the essence of Social Security.
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Old 11-10-2008, 06:13 PM
 
Location: somewhere in the woods
16,880 posts, read 15,152,974 times
Reputation: 5239
Quote:
Originally Posted by jefferson99 View Post
Loans are secured by collateral. Federal Debt is secured by U.S. citizens with Social Security numbers a.k.a. "human resources."

Social Security is a program that fuels investment in the United States, secured by the labor of U.S. citizens/human resources.

Beyond all warm-and-fuzzy talk about helping people and providing for the general welfare (the seduction), the real focus is money and profit.

Social Security is not insurance. Social Security is not an annuity.

Social Security is a compulsory excise tax for the privilege of operating as a business entity called a taxpayer.

'(4) "taxpayer" means any natural person, corporation, partnership, firm, association, or governmental unit or agency acting as a business entity in this state.' -- SOURCE: Alaska Statutes: 19.900. -- Definitions -- 15 AAC 19.900. Definitions

On a Social Security application one is always required to state if one is a U.S. citizen.

The 14th Amendment, which uses the term "citizens of the United States," states in Section 4., "The validity of the public debt of the United States, ... shall not be questioned."

Exercise the privilege of operating in a state as a business entity known as a taxpayer, then pay the compulsory income taxes associated with that privilege.

That is the essence of Social Security.


you forgot to add in that social security was voted in by the liberals to be used in the general fund and all the goverment has to show is a bunch of IOU's.
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Old 11-10-2008, 06:30 PM
 
2,141 posts, read 7,849,739 times
Reputation: 1273
Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeywrenching View Post
it is not my duty to pay for other americans stupidity. if they are not willing to stick money aside for their future, then they have no one to blame but themselves.
Well at the time being it is your duty, and mine and all working citizens. Perhaps it will be abolished or restructured some day but they're going to have to give people ample notice and start educating people on investing early in life and really press the issue that if they don't start saving while they're young, it'll come back to haunt them when they retire. I don't know how we'll deal with those who become severely mentally or physically disabled and can't work. There will always be families who won't be able to make enough money to have years worth of savings. And as we've all seen, people can be wiped out in the market when they're in their 50's, 60's etc. They always say that when you invest, you have to be be able to afford to lose the money, if that should happen. I don't know if a 100% privatized system is the answer. Commissioned brokers are out to sell the investment product of the day and don't necessarily have the long term investment goals of their clients' as their first priority. They're salespeople at the end of the day.
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Old 11-10-2008, 06:32 PM
 
764 posts, read 1,453,748 times
Reputation: 254
Quote:
Originally Posted by irspow View Post
Why not allow them to do whatever they want with the 15% of their earnings? I do not understand how it is the godvernment's job to protect people from their own stupidity.

I commend you for trying to make a change, by why do you fail short of freedom?
You forgot to use the words "evil" and "socialist" in your comment. You don't want to appear weak, do you?

I'm free and I like the system and I'm neither evil nor socialist. I think you have issues that will not be solved by your methods. There must be some way in which you can find peace within yourself so that you don't look at everything as evil and/or socialist.
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Old 11-10-2008, 08:21 PM
 
Location: Earth
20 posts, read 24,334 times
Reputation: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeywrenching View Post
you forgot to add in that social security was voted in by the liberals to be used in the general fund and all the goverment has to show is a bunch of IOU's.
The so-called "reserve funds" of the Social Security program are an accumulation of US Bonds, a government Bond being nothing more than a claim against American taxpayers/human resources for taxes not yet paid. This is true of the interest to be paid on the Bond, also. Social Security/human resources serving as collateral for the mounting Federal debt.

The Federal Reserve would admit to as much, human resources/taxpayers being a permanent revenue base.

All funds collected purportedly for Social Security are never earmarked for any special use, but are intermingled with and spent each year like any other funds. During 1935 to 1945 the billions of dollars collected were used to help finance the military during World War II, and have since been used to fund all the miscellaneous appropriations of the US government: foreign aid, federal salaries, funding regulatory agencies.

From the Grace Commission Report

QUOTE:

"With two-thirds of everyone's personal income taxes wasted or not collected, 100 percent of what is collected is absorbed solely by interest on the Federal debt and by Federal Government contributions to transfer payments. In other words, all individual income tax revenues are gone before one nickel is spent on the services which taxpayers expect from their Government."

Grace Commission Report (PPSS)
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