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Old 03-05-2010, 07:35 AM
938 posts, read 1,084,861 times
Reputation: 184


What are some of the things that you don't understand about the IRS and it's role in American life?
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Old 03-05-2010, 10:59 AM
4,270 posts, read 13,996,842 times
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We're hardworking Americans like everyone else. What boils my brain is my husband gets a bonus, and his company only gives us half of the amount. The other half goes to paying taxes. Okay, I get it. Come time for taxes every friggin' year, guess what happens? WE STILL OWE!! I file as "single" on my W-4 so more taxes are taken out than if I were to file as married. What else are we supposed to do?! We've maxed out our 401K contributions. It's really annoying to see how much we pay every year. I believe in hard work and responsibilty to my country but it's almost not worth it to make more money. The quality of our life now compared to two years ago when we were making less really hasn't improved (we're savers not spenders and we're not saving anymore now than we were then). If anything, it's gotten worse b'c we're so afraid of owing money that we save more just to make sure we can cover the taxes. We live in fear of April 15th every year!

Now, I know in the grand scheme of things, we're just lucky to have jobs so I'm not complaining but here we are, hardworking citizens doing what we're supposed to be doing. So why the heck can't Washington get it right? I don't care if you are a democrat or republican; I don't care if you are pro-gay or anti-gay; I don't care if you are pro-choice or pro-life but we as voters tend to focus on things like this at the voting booth. Washington needs to buck up and use tax money wisely! Okay, my rant.
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Old 03-05-2010, 11:03 AM
938 posts, read 1,084,861 times
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And why did Obama Stimulus have tax on it?
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Old 03-05-2010, 12:26 PM
938 posts, read 1,084,861 times
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found this article interesting. written by an ex-IRS agent so please don't say he was "crazy or "not well in the head" or "he was just insane"

The truth about the IRS

'Let's settle this once and for all,' says former special agent

[SIZE=-1]Posted: June 29, 1999[/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]1:00 am Eastern[/SIZE]

By Sarah Foster
[SIZE=-1]© 2010 WorldNetDaily.com [/SIZE]

Former IRS special agent Joe Banister had a couple of questions he hoped his congressman could answer.
"If the IRS and the 16th Amendment are not legal -- and I've discovered they aren't -- should I file a 1040 form?" he wondered.
Banister has been wondering about that ever since he was ousted from his high-level, well-paid [COLOR=blue! important][COLOR=blue! important]job[/color][/color] with the IRS last February. In March WorldNetDaily broke the news nationwide of his forced resignation.
Uncertain of what he should do, Banister posed the question to Tom Campbell, R-Calif., who was [COLOR=blue! important][COLOR=blue! important]hosting[/color][/color] a public town hall meeting in Santa Clara, Calif., earlier this month.

Speaking with WorldNetDaily, Banister recalled that during the question-and-answer session he told Campbell and the audience that he had been a special agent since 1993 with the IRS Criminal Investigation Division, one of the service's "accountants with a gun and a badge," as they're called. Two years ago he began investigating the allegations made by so-called tax-protesters and concluded their arguments were true. Specifically:
  • The filing of federal income tax returns is voluntary, and the filing of federal income tax returns is not required.
  • That the 16th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution was never ratified.
  • That income [COLOR=blue! important][COLOR=blue! important]taxes[/color][/color] are not used to pay for daily government operations, but to pay the interest on the national debt.
"I explained to Congressman Campbell and the folks there that I faced a real dilemma. I could either stay in my job -- even though I knew it was illegal and immoral -- or I'd have to resign," Banister said. "I explained how I had asked the IRS if my findings were correct, because if they were I would have to resign."
Should his findings prove false, the question became whether the agency would show him where he was off track. "They never answered my inquiry, but said they had accepted my resignation.
"So what should I do about the 1040? What about my discoveries -- are they right?" he asked Campbell. "Should I still be carrying a gun and a wearing a badge for the IRS?"
Banister said Campbell replied he could not answer the questions since it was an area he admitted knowing little about, but he promised to look over Banister's material.
To date, Banister has not received an answer.
Rather than wait, the six-year IRS gun-slinger is taking his questions to Washington as one of several speakers that are carrying the debate to the nation's capital itself. Rep. Campbell and, indeed, all members of Congress will be able to find out directly what the "anti-tax" arguments really are.
On July 1 and 2, Banister and other experts on the 16th Amendment will be speaking at a special symposium at the National Press Club. The one-and-a-half day event will begin at 9 a.m.
The sponsors are calling it an "IRS Showdown."
Speaking with Banister will be William Benson, author of the two-volume magnum opus "The [COLOR=blue! important][COLOR=blue! important]Law[/color][/color] that Never Was"; Devvy Kidd, whose appearances on the Geoff Metcalf radio talk show inspired Banister to begin his investigations; William Conklin, author of "Why Nobody is Required to File Tax Returns," another of Banister's mentors; and constitutional attorney Larry Becraft.
Holding a symposium of this kind -- a first for the nation's capital -- was the brainchild of Bob Schulz, a talk-show host in Albany, N.Y., and chairman of the We the People Foundation for Constitutional Education, a non-profit [COLOR=blue! important][COLOR=blue! important]corporation[/color][/color].
"The federal income tax and Social [COLOR=blue! important][COLOR=blue! important]Security[/color][/color] tax are unconstitutional and illegal," says Schulz. "Those are the conclusions of a substantial body of knowledge that has been mounting for several years -- but Congress and the courts have ignored it.
"It has reached the point that we must have an organized public debate on the whole matter. People are having [COLOR=blue! important][COLOR=blue! important]assets[/color][/color] seized and going to jail for not complying with laws that may not exist. That's why we're bringing these speakers here."
Schulz has sent certified letters to the White House and the IRS, including one to Commissioner Rossotti, inviting them to send their experts on the subject.
"They've been asked to bring definite evidence that the 16th Amendment was, in fact, properly ratified, that there is a law requiring citizens to file and pay federal income taxes, and to give an unambiguous explanation as to how one can file a federal income tax return without surrendering one's Fifth Amendment Rights," says Schulz.
All members of the Senate and the House of Representatives have been sent [COLOR=blue! important][COLOR=blue! important]invitations[/color][/color] -- and some have agreed to be speakers.
"James Traficant, D-Ohio, is going to be the luncheon speaker on Thursday," said Schulz. And Billy Tauzin, R-La., is the dinner speaker that evening.
"I don't know who else will be coming," says Schulz. "Perhaps if the members of Congress hear from their constituents, they'll be more interested."
Schulz points to Banister's report -- Investigating the IRS -- as being the most recent in a long line of studies done by researchers like Benson, Kidd and Conklin.
"Their arguments are very compelling," Schulz observes, "But Congress and the courts have ignored them. That's why we're doing this. We'd really like to settle the matter."
Meanwhile, in lieu of any response from his congressman, Banister said his wife contacted Campbell's office, explained how the family would be visiting Washington and was promised a personal guided [COLOR=blue! important][COLOR=blue! important]tour[/color][/color] of Congress. "We had no trouble getting that," said Banister. "I had hoped that the aide would immediately say he had the answers to my questions -- but he didn't. Maybe Campbell will come to hear the [COLOR=blue! important][COLOR=blue! important]presentations[/color][/color]

," he added hopefully.
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Old 03-05-2010, 12:42 PM
Location: Portland, Oregon
7,090 posts, read 10,789,929 times
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LoL, WorldNutDaily as a reference? The fundamentalist ultra libertarian nuthouse that still clings to the birth certificate theories and posts the Chuck Norris rants about people stealing our gold?

WorldNetDaily - RationalWiki
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Old 03-05-2010, 12:43 PM
377 posts, read 284,616 times
Reputation: 90
A hearing was held before an Administrative Law Judge, and Banister was disbarred from IRS practice, the ALJ finding that Banister had violated the rules for practice before the IRS by his “absolutely wrong” advice to his clients and by failing to file personal tax returns for 1999 through 2002. See IR-2004-5 (1/12/2004).

He's also had his CPA license revoked.

The questions he posed above are standard Tax Protester questions and they all have answers. He may not like those answers but that's another thing.
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Old 03-05-2010, 01:17 PM
5,733 posts, read 4,659,265 times
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In fact it does not really matter at this point if the 16th Amendment was properly ratified or not (although it would be nice to get a proper hearing on it - but no court will touch it now), the Supreme Court has said that it stands. The real problem is in its application to - pay for the labor of private individuals. 16th Amendement 'income' was not meant to be applied to that type of pay.

Also, if you have signed a W-2 and / or a W-9 you must file a return - those documents are prima facia evidence in a court of law and they create a presumption of liability that your work and pay are under the jurisdiction of the federal goverment.

To many tax protester go about fighting the IRS the wrong way around the wrong issues.
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Old 03-05-2010, 01:26 PM
19,216 posts, read 13,045,864 times
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Originally Posted by 4Horsemen View Post
What are some of the things that you don't understand about the IRS and it's role in American life?
How can the IRS force States and their political subdivisions to collect and pay over to the SSA and IRS monies taken from wages and salaries of State employees?
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Old 03-05-2010, 01:46 PM
Location: California
30,788 posts, read 33,638,140 times
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I don't understand why it has to be so complicated. There should be a line that says "Total Income" one that says "Tax %" and one another that says "Total Amount". If you paid more you get a refund, if you paid less you send in a check for the difference.
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Old 03-05-2010, 01:53 PM
Location: Raleigh, NC
20,028 posts, read 15,788,023 times
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The latest scare is barter income. People on forbes make a big deal about making sure you report all income from bartering. Stupid idea, unless you're dealing in high profile stuff. Just don't exchange 1099s and you're fine.
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