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View Poll Results: Which Would You Save?
The women 9 90.00%
The bastocycts 1 10.00%
Neither - I'm a bastard who'd let both burn 0 0%
I'd rather stay and die in the fire myself that have to decide 0 0%
Voters: 10. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-07-2010, 03:02 PM
 
971 posts, read 1,128,746 times
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When does human life begin?

Is all human life equal?


After answering those, consider this:

You find yourself in a burning fertility clinic confronted with an immobile, injured woman and a cart of tubes containing millions of blastocycts (fertilized human eggs). You only have time to get one of them, either the women or the cart, out of the building. Which do you save, and which do you allow to burn?
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Old 03-07-2010, 03:12 PM
 
Location: Missouri
3,751 posts, read 3,096,011 times
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First, I don't know when human life begins; but if you eliminate abortion, you eliminate any reason why you need to know.

Second, do you mean equal in value? importance? wit? number of fingers?

Third, I would rescue the woman, of course. No question about it.
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Old 03-07-2010, 03:16 PM
 
971 posts, read 1,128,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geofra View Post
First, I don't know when human life begins; but if you eliminate abortion, you eliminate any reason why you need to know.
I appreciate that answer. For this forum, I find it refreshingly honest. Although I will disagree and say there are ramifications beyond abortion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by geofra View Post
Second, do you mean equal in value? importance? wit? number of fingers?
I mean intrinsic value. For instance, if you consider an embryo human life, does it posses the same intrinsic value that I do? Should its fundamental human rights be protected in the same manner mine are?
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Old 03-07-2010, 03:22 PM
 
Location: Georgia, on the Florida line, right above Tallahassee
10,475 posts, read 13,831,232 times
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Then ask yourself, would you adopt those millions of blastocysts, if they could not find homes for every last one. Or would you let them go homeless, or be sold into child slavery? Would you weep for one if it became a murderer and blame all the deaths it caused on your choice? Would you bask in the glow of their accomplishments, if one became a leader of a great country?

Ask yourself...Are you personally responsible for each life you save? And what if the choice was between you, the woman, and the million blastocysts, each in its own little tube. Would you save yourself first? What if the woman had just had an aboartion? Would you save her first? And finally ask yourself, how do 1 million tubes fit on one little cart?

Then ask yourself and be honest with yourself.

Why is the life of a fetus conceived through natural means, failure of BC...etc, any more valuable than a fetus conceived by rape, incest...etc? What if your sister was raped by your dad and was going to have your brother? And she's 12.

Good to go? Or um, heck no?

It's still gonna be a baby.
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Old 03-07-2010, 03:32 PM
 
971 posts, read 1,128,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 70Ford View Post
Then ask yourself, would you adopt those millions of blastocysts, if they could not find homes for every last one. Or would you let them go homeless, or be sold into child slavery? Would you weep for one if it became a murderer and blame all the deaths it caused on your choice? Would you bask in the glow of their accomplishments, if one became a leader of a great country?

Ask yourself...Are you personally responsible for each life you save? And what if the choice was between you, the woman, and the million blastocysts, each in its own little tube. Would you save yourself first? What if the woman had just had an aboartion? Would you save her first? And finally ask yourself, how do 1 million tubes fit on one little cart?

Then ask yourself and be honest with yourself.

Why is the life of a fetus conceived through natural means, failure of BC...etc, any more valuable than a fetus conceived by rape, incest...etc? What if your sister was raped by your dad and was going to have your brother? And she's 12.

Good to go? Or um, heck no?

It's still gonna be a baby.
Those are all fantastic questions. I think I get the gist of what you'd say, but I'm curious how you'd answer them.

And I guess to be more realistic I should have said thousands or hundreds, not millions. A bunch will be stored together however, not just one per tube. But all that's beside the point - what are the odds of someone actually being presented with this situation?
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Old 03-07-2010, 03:49 PM
 
3,651 posts, read 8,303,122 times
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So small as to be a statistical zero. So why bother asking/answering it in the first place? ie why not just come out and ask the question(s) directly vs an extremely unlikely scenario...
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Old 03-07-2010, 03:56 PM
 
Location: Arlington, VA
5,412 posts, read 3,472,251 times
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how many abortions are to save the mother vs abortion out of convenience


followup: whats it like being a sociopath?
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Old 03-07-2010, 04:01 PM
 
971 posts, read 1,128,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joey2000 View Post
So small as to be a statistical zero. So why bother asking/answering it in the first place?
Because most pro-life (against abortion) people I've talked to say that all human life is intrinsically equal, and that all human life deserves the same protection of fundamental rights (primarily among them the right to exist). Nearly all of them have also told me that life begins, unequivocally, at the moment of conception.

My question is an obvious moral dilemma I'd like to use to probe and question these beliefs.

The way I see it, if you believe human life begins the moment an egg is fertilized by a sperm and you also believe that all human life is intrinsically equal, how could you possibly choose to save the women instead of the tray of fertilized eggs? How could someone with such beliefs justify saving one life at the expense of so many others when the opportunity exists to save the many lives at the expense of one?


There. Is that asked better?
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Old 03-07-2010, 04:54 PM
 
971 posts, read 1,128,746 times
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I guess I should move this to the great debates section.

It seems the "Politics and Other Controversies" section should really be called the "Baiting With Asinine Arguments So As To Allow For Yelling, Screaming, And Otherwise Venting" section.
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Old 03-07-2010, 07:48 PM
 
Location: Georgia, on the Florida line, right above Tallahassee
10,475 posts, read 13,831,232 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by denverkid View Post
I guess I should move this to the great debates section.

It seems the "Politics and Other Controversies" section should really be called the "Baiting With Asinine Arguments So As To Allow For Yelling, Screaming, And Otherwise Venting" section.
This forum isn't for debating, that's for sure. It is chock full of wack jobs and nuts, though. It's great for a laugh, but - and huge but, here - I've seen some posters who actually are intelligent and reasoned here. Too much chaff, sometimes.

Personally, I believe I have about as much right to tell a woman to cut or not cut something out of her body as she has to tell me as to whether I should have a vasectomy. Or have any part of my body cut off, for that matter. Abortion, and the right to deny someone the ability to make decisions about their body - is a form of control.

People argue "rights of the child" while trampling all over "the rights of the mother". Which is so redonkulos, it's hard to even conceive. (Pun intended.)

If it was me, I'd save the woman and let those clumps of cells burn.
Of course, it's hypothetical.

Someone asked me this one time, since we're talking about it and all. He asked me which of my two children was my favorite. I told him I loved them the same. He asked me, You are in a boat. The boat flips. You are equidistant from each child. Both can not swim. One is going to die.

Choose.
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