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Old 04-03-2010, 04:51 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
75,255 posts, read 36,424,032 times
Reputation: 18300

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Seems like power is slowly being taken away from Congress; the items in this health bill are just pieces of a bigger picture.

I wonder why Congress isn't balking at this ?
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Old 04-03-2010, 05:10 PM
 
Location: New York (liberal cesspool)
918 posts, read 418,906 times
Reputation: 222
Default Happy Texan

The demonRATs control it and the Repubs are gutless. So it's up to all of us in November.
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Old 04-03-2010, 05:31 PM
 
Location: Tampa Florida
20,359 posts, read 7,486,195 times
Reputation: 3913
The fact that the Law specifies it's applicability is "Limited to Citizens and Lawful Residents". (Pg 159, line 17), notwithstanding.
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Old 04-03-2010, 07:24 PM
 
Location: New York (liberal cesspool)
918 posts, read 418,906 times
Reputation: 222
Default Good evening florida.bob

Quote:
Originally Posted by florida.bob View Post
The fact that the Law specifies it's applicability is "Limited to Citizens and Lawful Residents". (Pg 159, line 17), notwithstanding.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
In my opinion...YES. I'll make my case. Page 159, line 17, 18 is titled...
17 (f) QUALIFIED INDIVIDUALS AND EMPLOYERS; A
18 LIMITED TO CITIZENS AND LAWFUL RESIDENTS.—

and it continues on into page 160 as follows:

19 (1) QUALIFIED INDIVIDUALS.—In this title:
20 (A) IN GENERAL.—The term ‘‘qualified in
21 dividual’’ means, with respect to an Exchange,
22 an individual who—
23 (i) is seeking to enroll in a qualified
24 health plan in the individual market offered
25 through the Exchange; and

160
HR 3590 EAS/PP
1 (ii) resides in the State that established
2 the Exchange (except with respect to territorial agreements under section 1312(f)).

all fine and dandy, until you skip down to here:

16 (B) EXTENSION TO LARGE GROUPS.—
17 (i) IN GENERAL.—Beginning in 2017,
18 each State may allow issuers of health in

19 surance coverage in the large group market
20 in the State to offer qualified health plans
21 in such market through an Exchange. Noth
22 ing in this subparagraph shall be construed
23 as requiring the issuer to offer such plans
24 through an Exchange.

Another sneaky potential loophole. I originally mentioned that the real danger in the ObaCare plan was the wide latitude of discretion in authority it grants to the H&HS Secy and the Health Choices Commissioner. The Secy controls the Exchange and at anytime can issue any directive that has the force of law w/out Advice and Consent of the Senate. These "large group" references obviously refer to people like a large union group, fraternal organization or something similar. HOWEVER..., there is NOTHING stopping her from defining "illegals" as another "large group" that she directs have entitlement. That is the point. The built-in vagueness and unlimited authority of those two positions who serve at the direct behest of who, Obama...the President.

Now you may disagree as to whether they'd do what I warn of, but you can't deny they've placed the wording where it's needed to enable that.
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Old 04-03-2010, 07:45 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
75,255 posts, read 36,424,032 times
Reputation: 18300
Illegals can buy from the pool. That was known. They just cannot apply for the subsidies from the government.
Maybe that was the House Bill, the Baucus bill ? Maybe it got removed ?

Maybe I'm just confused
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Old 04-03-2010, 08:22 PM
 
Location: New York (liberal cesspool)
918 posts, read 418,906 times
Reputation: 222
Default HappyTexan

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
Illegals can buy from the pool. That was known. They just cannot apply for the subsidies from the government.
Maybe that was the House Bill, the Baucus bill ? Maybe it got removed ?

Maybe I'm just confused
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think you're a bit confused. One of the big disputes has been the Oba-maniacs keep saying that iilegals are NOT covered. They aren't; specifically, a named group, but there are as I've shown loopholes to allow them to become covered.
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Old 04-03-2010, 08:33 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
75,255 posts, read 36,424,032 times
Reputation: 18300
Well doctorhugo, then the bill won't need to be amended when the Immigration Reform bill is passed.
Obama promised the illegals when they were in DC marching that he would get it done this year.
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Old 04-04-2010, 04:29 AM
 
Location: New York (liberal cesspool)
918 posts, read 418,906 times
Reputation: 222
Default Nappy Texan

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTexan View Post
Well doctorhugo, then the bill won't need to be amended when the Immigration Reform bill is passed.
Obama promised the illegals when they were in DC marching that he would get it done this year.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
An Obama promise is akin to a fart in a windstorm. Unleashed with great momentum and then lost in the din of the environment about him.

You are right about eventually getting a second version of Shamnesty through though. The same allies that Little Georgie-boy Bush had with his attempt at Shamnesty I, McCain and Graham, the RINOs, will be in the lead positions again. I believe that they've already made a back-door wink and a nod concession to Obama wherein they've stated that they'll make some political 'noise' against the 'passed' healthcare law now just to establish themselves out front as the spokesmen for the Republican Party. Don't let his tough talk posturing now fool you. Then they'll both willingly cave in to Shamnesty II in their quest for power-player leader positions in that party.


McCain(RINO-AZ) has the 'pattern of behavior' established as a phony POW "hero" in Nam wherein for his own selfish interest he 'voluntarily' capitulated to his N. Vietnamese captors for personal medical attention, in violation of the then Code of Conduct, after only his fourth day in captivity(validated in his own memoirs) and; subsequently, collaborated with the enemy in making broadcasts on Communist radio in Nam (validated by DOD transcripts available on the 'net and which I've posted numerous times). No other prisoner, despite all you've heard, can ever or has ever sworn to an affidavit to having seen McCain being tortured, but some have alleged suspicions of 'special' treatment for the periods when he 'disappeared', including legit living and deceased real heroes. You see McCain's father was a bigtime fleet admiral then and it is suspected that McCain himself revealed that to his captors to negotiate his "special" treatment. Just a little "true background" on the Capitulator in Compromise who ONLY looks out for Numero Uno also as a politician and who many vets who know his true background despise. The dirtbag barely weaselled out of the S&L debacle of years gone by with a slap on the wrist.


Lindsey 'Linseed Oily' Graham(RINO-SC) is his political protege. Neither is to be trusted to go around the corner and return without having sold you out. Two rotten peas in the same pod. Believe it!
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Old 04-04-2010, 04:40 AM
 
Location: New York (liberal cesspool)
918 posts, read 418,906 times
Reputation: 222
Default WebMemo On Health Care Reform

Top 10 Disasters of Obamacare

Published on March 30, 2010 by Kathryn Nix
President Obama recently signed gargantuan health care legislation into law that will have major ramifications for every man, woman, and child in the United States. This newly enacted law originates from the Senate health care bill (the “Patients Protection and Affordability Act”) and a sidecar reconciliation bill that originated in the House. Between these two bills are countless provisions that grow federal spending, increase burdensome taxes, and put federal rules and regulations between Americans and control over their health care.
Outlined here are the 10 major ways in which the Left’s so-called health care reform will hurt Americans.
1. New Spending Grows the Federal Deficit
The Congressional Budget Office (CBO), the official scorekeeper for Congress, sets the projected cost of the health care package from 2010 to 2019 at $940 billion, reducing the deficit by $138 billion.[1] Unfortunately, the true cost of the new law will be far greater.
The CBO is proficient at its work, but it is required to score legislative proposals based on assumptions about the future behavior of Congress—not according to its more likely behavior. The authors of this legislation took advantage of this in crafting the language of the bill, employing several budgetary gimmicks to make it appear cheaper.
These include omitting cuts to Medicare provider payment rates, known as the “doc fix,” double-counting savings from Medicare and the CLASS Act, indexing benefits to general inflation rather than medical inflation, and delaying the expensive provisions of the bill. When these costs are accounted for, the new law is more likely to cost closer to $2.5 trillion.[2] Such levels of spending will not only negate any projected deficit reduction but increase the federal deficit further than would prior law.
2. Bending the Cost Curve in the Wrong Direction
The provisions of the legislation aimed at reducing health care spending are reactionary, addressing the symptoms rather than the root causes of growth in spending.[3] Instead of reducing spending in health care, the bill will increase overall health spending in the U.S. by $222 billion between now and 2019.[4]
In addition, CBO reports that premiums in the non-group market will increase by 10–13 percent as a result of the bill.[5]
Sources:
[1] Congressional Budget Office, “H.R. 4872, Reconciliation Act of 2010,” March 18, 2010, at http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/113xx/doc11355/hr4872.pdf (March 29, 2010).

[2] James C. Capretta, “Obamacare Will Break the Bank, Not Reduce the Deficit,” The Foundry, March 18, 2010, at http://blog.heritage.org/2010/03/18/obamacare-will-break-the-bank-not-cut-the-deficit/.

[3] Jason Fodeman and Robert A. Book, “‘Bending the Curve’: What Really Drives Health Care Spending,” Heritage Foundation Backgrounder No. 2369, February 17, 2010, at http://www.heritage.org/Research/Reports/2010/02/Bending-the-Curve-What-Really-Drives-Health-Care-Spending.


[4]Richard S. Foster, Chief Actuary, Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, “Estimated Financial Effects of the ‘Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act,’ as Passed by the Senate on December 24, 2009,” January 8, 2010, at http://www.cms.hhs.gov/ActuarialStudies/Downloads/S_PPACA_2010-01-08.pdf (March 29, 2010).



[5] Congressional Budget Office, “An Analysis of Health Insurance Premiums Under the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act,” November 30, 2009, at http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/107xx/doc10781/11-30-Premiums.pdf (March 29, 2010).

continues here:
Top Ten Disasters of the Health Care Reform Overhaul | The Heritage Foundation
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Just to further validate my prior comment regarding Obama promises.
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Old 04-04-2010, 04:55 AM
 
Location: New York (liberal cesspool)
918 posts, read 418,906 times
Reputation: 222
Default Oba-vasectomy in progress

http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh283/doctorhugo/ObaCare_vasectomy.jpg (broken link)
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