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Old 04-14-2010, 07:33 PM
 
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I'm trying to get a hold on what appears to me to be two completely contradictory sentiments running through the conservative movements. On one hand there is this tremendous and traditional support for unfettered capitalism while at the same time demonstrating anger over the disproportionate influence of large corporations on the body politic. It would be my contention that it should be fairly apparent that the latter is an unavoidable product of the former, I am puzzled by this state of conservative angst.
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Old 04-14-2010, 07:37 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
I'm trying to get a hold on what appears to me to be two completely contradictory sentiments running through the conservative movements. On one hand there is this tremendous and traditional support for unfettered capitalism while at the same time demonstrating anger over the disproportionate influence of large corporations on the body politic. It would be my contention that it should be fairly apparent that the latter is an unavoidable product of the former, I am puzzled by this state of conservative angst.
I am puzzled by your puzzlement.

Why is it a contradiction to believe in capitalism while not liking the extreme influence by corporations on our politicians? (both left and right)
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Old 04-14-2010, 07:57 PM
 
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Originally Posted by alphamale View Post
I am puzzled by your puzzlement.

Why is it a contradiction to believe in capitalism while not liking the extreme influence by corporations on our politicians? (both left and right)
Because one is a natural product of the other. Unfettered capitalism naturally leads to high concentrations of wealth, high concentrations of wealth lead to disproportionate power in the hands of those who control such wealth. It was true in 18th Century, was absolutely true in the latter part of the 19th Century so I am confused as to why the astonishment now after such a long period of deregulation?
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Old 04-14-2010, 08:00 PM
 
Location: The Woods
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Jefferson was pro-free market and anti-corporation. It's not exactly a contradiction.
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Old 04-14-2010, 08:14 PM
 
Location: NC
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Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
Jefferson was pro-free market and anti-corporation. It's not exactly a contradiction.
Jefferson was also a product of his time. His idea of the ideal society was based on Yeoman farmers making up the majority of the population which is something that does not, and really cannot exist in America anymore.
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Old 04-14-2010, 08:16 PM
 
Location: The Woods
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Originally Posted by Randomstudent View Post
Jefferson was also a product of his time. His idea of the ideal society was based on Yeoman farmers making up the majority of the population which is something that does not, and really cannot exist in America anymore.
Most of the country is still rural, though not the population. Jefferson saw firsthand what big corporations, banks, etc., did to people in Europe.

In any case, corporations are not necessary for capitalism. Arguably, having more, smaller, businesses, is more in line with what capitalism was intended to be, than these big corporations we have today.
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Old 04-14-2010, 08:23 PM
 
Location: NC
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Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
Most of the country is still rural, though not the population. Jefferson saw firsthand what big corporations, banks, etc., did to people in Europe.

In any case, corporations are not necessary for capitalism. Arguably, having more, smaller, businesses, is more in line with what capitalism was intended to be, than these big corporations we have today.
The thing about free markets without regulation is that while a system may start out as many small businesses it will not stay that way. At first, through competition, stronger businesses will at first weed out weaker ones through market efficiency, which is positive. After a while however the stronger businesses will start practicing vertical and horizontal integration which will lead to big corporations and market inefficiency. The rewards that come from destroying the competition and salting the proverbial fields is the central flaw in unfettered free markets.
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Old 04-14-2010, 08:27 PM
 
Location: The Woods
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Originally Posted by Randomstudent View Post
The thing about free markets without regulation is that while a system may start out as many small businesses it will not stay that way. At first, through competition, stronger businesses will at first weed out weaker ones through market efficiency, which is positive. After a while however the stronger businesses will start practicing vertical and horizontal integration which will lead to big corporations and market inefficiency. The rewards that come from destroying the competition and salting the proverbial fields is the central flaw in unfettered free markets.
Simply take corporations out of the equation.
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Old 04-14-2010, 08:32 PM
 
Location: NC
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Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
Simply take corporations out of the equation.
Almost all small and large businesses are corporations. Sole proprietorship, and partnerships with limitless liabilities are very, very rare.
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Old 04-14-2010, 08:33 PM
 
Location: The Woods
16,936 posts, read 22,206,840 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randomstudent View Post
Almost all small and large businesses are corporations. Sole proprietorship, and partnerships with limitless liabilities are very, very rare.
Well, what I'm saying: eliminate corporations.
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