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I've checked with no less than 10 surgeons because I have a genetic disorder and would rather not have a child and possibly pass that on. The lowest age I got was 32. If I had two children, they would do it immediately regardless of age. I think it would be counterproductive to have two children just so I can get my tubes tied and have no children
Yup! most doctors will not perform a tubal ligation UNTIL you have at least one child (I know cause I checked as well; doctors here will do it as young as 31, but that's if you have an underlying medical condition because of hitting the 30's that a pregnancy will cause life threatening complications)
and forget removing the ovaries or even the womb; doctors won't do that unless your going through menopause
Well the woman can have control over her fertility but she shouldn't be surprised when she wants a baby and the doctor tells her she can't have one because of the scar tissue left over from her abortion. This does happen, are women warned? What kind of control is that?
Because men do not have consequence from sexual activity while women do. Men and women can equally engage in sexual activity--and it's no ones business who, what, or why they do. Illegalizing abortion doesn't solve anything, and at the least, it sexually oppresses women because it makes sex only for procreation--again--archaic.
Who said anything about making abortion illegal? Abortion sexually FREES women? That's pathetic.
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I have never met a women who has been pro-life.
You haven't gotten out much, have ya? And I didn't say I was pro-life. I'm pro-responsibility and pro-stop making excuses for why you got knocked up.
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Why overburden adoption centers? The problem is notably not abortion. When the highest rate of abortions occur in the states with poor sexual education classes, something is amiss.
Which adoption agencies are over-burdened? I have no idea what you are talking about with high abortion rates and poor sex ed classes.
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Termination prevents financial problems on every front. You are deliberately hindering a person's freedom to self by enacting anti-abortion laws. This is not about responsibility because responsibility can be had with abortions. It's only about punishing those who have sex.
Who is talking about anti-abortion laws? It's about being responsible for your actions without making up ridiculous excuses. Those actions (sex) that got yourself all knocked up to BEGIN with. Stop trying to spin it.
Do you know where teen pregnancy rates are highest? Where abortion rates are highest? It is not in liberal states. It's in the south. It's in the religious states. Why? Because the religious practice abstinence only education, so the teens down there are ****-nut clueless as to sex, safe sex, and the consequences of sex. Bush's push of abstinence-only education lead to a rise in teen pregnancy and abortion.
The liberals aren't the ones with the pregnancy and abortion problems--look further south.
Huh? Knock it off.
Don't spin this into some religious/ anti-Bush debate.
Cute, and ridiculous at the same time. Pity I wasn't asking about abstinence.
Do you understand the concept of abstinence education in schools?
Yep I understand it. I went through it in my Health/Sex Ed class when I was in high school. I also remember that the primary gist of Abstinence, is abstaining from sex, you also learn about birth control (which is not abstinence education, its birth control education) and you learn about the sexual diseases (which is STD/HIV education not abstinence education). Am I missing anything else significant? (and that wasn't a sarcastic question I'm seriously wondering what else is part of abstinence education I am missing that is significant.)
sometimes people also give in to social pressures to conform even if it isn't something they really feel in their heart. you are mention god an awful lot for some one who says they are agnostic.
a good friend of mines and I've known for 10 years, was married, but very unhappy in that marriage. They were married for nearly 15 years (out of high school couple) and no children.
2 years ago, he realized why he was unhappy. He realized that he was actually gay. Since that realization, he is now a more happy individual; he has separated from his wife (and she was very understanding), and has since gone through gender re-assignment (damn he looks good now!). And is currently dating a nice gentleman he met a year ago.
Why he thought he was straight and lived like a straight person: Social pressures. Family was not understanding (currently his father will not talk to him at all), and it took his sister to open his eyes to realize that he wasn't a heterosexual (she is a guidance counselor to teenagers and saw the signs she saw in gay teens in him).
Being gay is not a choice; its a biological and natural occurrence.
a good friend of mines and I've known for 10 years, was married, but very unhappy in that marriage. They were married for nearly 15 years (out of high school couple) and no children.
2 years ago, he realized why he was unhappy. He realized that he was actually gay. Since that realization, he is now a more happy individual; he has separated from his wife (and she was very understanding), and has since gone through gender re-assignment (damn he looks good now!). And is currently dating a nice gentleman he met a year ago.
Why he thought he was straight and lived like a straight person: Social pressures. Family was not understanding (currently his father will not talk to him at all), and it took his sister to open his eyes to realize that he wasn't a heterosexual (she is a guidance counselor to teenagers and saw the signs she saw in gay teens in him).
Being gay is not a choice; its a biological and natural occurrence.
Good to know that one example is all it takes to prove being gay isn't a choice but a biological occurrence (oh and I'm sure there are more stories). I'll tell some of my stories tomorrow if you would like, but now its almost 2am so I need my sleep. Until tomorrow .
EDIT: Actually no, this is a good topic for discussion but it could involve a big discussion and that is best left for a thread that is dedicated to that, not a thread where an abortion conversation is going on. It will completely hijack this thread and kill the abortion debate, and while i'm sure some here would like to see that happen I won't be participating in it.
Last edited by JohKnip; 06-11-2010 at 12:39 AM..
Reason: added things
For those of you screaming adoption, adoption, adoption, there are over 120,000 children in the foster care system looking for homes. Here is the information, and the application forms.
Birth Control Chart (http://www.4parents.gov/sexrisky/birthcontrol/birthcontrol_chart/birthcontrol_chart.html - broken link)
Beyond IUD's, implants and sterlization; the only 100% effective birth control is abstinence, which of course is ludicrous to expect in reality, unless you're Amish or Catholic (and even some Catholic churches allow for some form of birth control - even so much as watching the calendar)
He was talking about if in the hypothetical situation abortion was made illegal, women would choose whether or not they wished to obey that law (if it was illegal) because as everyone here is saying, we would be forcing them to get "back alley abortions.
if he was, it wasn't clear in his post. context is evereything.,
abortion WAS illegal for a time (before Roe Vs Wade). And abortions were being done then with no punishment on the woman who had it performed; and many women were permanently injured and rendered infertile because they did not get it done in a safe clean environment with a doctor who can do it properly.
And it was rare that a woman was punished for having an abortion; and if there was someone who suffered for their decision, it was usually a very controlling man in that woman's life that reported it, or wanted to exact revenge on the woman for having it done.
so if it was made illegal (it wont) then we will return to women seeking out doctors with no care about the health of their patient doing abortions behind closed doors. or the woman flying to Canada or Mexico to have it done.
There is a long history that abortions were traced back to 17th century Japan. Many asian cultures viewed abortion as one of the few acts that was not taboo or condoned. Islamic regions were one of the first few cultures that had extensive lists and ways of BIRTH control, and abortion was allowed in their culture
Do you know when the "issue" of Abortion being something of a taboo subject? During the Roman Catholic / Christian influence flooding Europe and Greece.
Abortion has always been rooted to the religious zealots trying to extend their power to controlling women's rights.
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And I didn't say I was pro-life. I'm pro-responsibility and pro-stop making excuses for why you got knocked up. 
