Are blue collar whites and rural folks the MOST discriminated against group today? (employment, Congress)

[mateo45]

Originally Posted by Visvaldis

God has a special place in his heart for all the white, uneducated, blue-collar bumpkins. On the Day Of Reckoning God will smite all those educated, white collar elitists.

I doubt if anyone, "elitist" or otherwise, much cares whether or not some folks happen to be "white, uneducated, blue-collar bumpkins". But the "by-products" of their "lifestyles" that we all pay for... the teen unwed moms on welfare, the alcoholism, meth & other substance abuse problems, the "special needs" kids as a result, along with the police, court and social services to deal with all of it. That part (among others) many of us do care about.

And then when they're openly courted by a certain "opportunistic" political party, that's cynically willing to create bogus "culture wars", and erode the separation of church & state, even while economically herding these same folk into being "cannon fodder" for unnecessary wars..... yeah, I would imagine a bit of "Divine Smiting" is definitely in order here.

[Tom Lennox 70]

Seriously folks I think the liberal left like Hollywood and other liberals are in fact very prejudiced against small town folks and blue collar whites. I can not imagine them saying the same thing about illegal immigrants or inner city black communities. Liberals claim to NOT be elitist and to support the working class but they love using terms like rednecks and hillbillies, but they would never insult the inner cities, even going as far as to make excuses for them. Obama himself has that elitist attitude as evidenced by his comments about small towns in the Midwest during his speech in California. Also Hollywood is just amazingly stereotypical in most portrayals of the south, more so than against any other culture in the world. They actually go out of their way not to offend Muslims these days.

[harborlady]

Originally Posted by mateo45

I doubt if anyone, "elitist" or otherwise, much cares whether or not some folks happen to be "white, uneducated, blue-collar bumpkins". But the "by-products" of their "lifestyles" that we all pay for... the teen unwed moms on welfare, the alcoholism, meth & other substance abuse problems, the "special needs" kids as a result, along with the police, court and social services to deal with all of it. That part (among others) many of us do care about.

And then when they're openly courted by a certain "opportunistic" political party, that's cynically willing to create bogus "culture wars", and erode the separation of church & state, even while economically herding these same folk into being "cannon fodder" for unnecessary wars..... yeah, I would imagine a bit of "Divine Smiting" is definitely in order here.

Canon fodder? WHY... those are good paying jobs, and thank the lord we've got a war you ingrate!! You're so unpatriotic smearing the troops with your blasphemy. God save the Queen, errr, King George, errrr God bless America!

[ERS-One]

So are they actively being discriminated against or are they just being negatively depicted in stupid movies? There's a difference.

[mateo45]

Originally Posted by harborlady

Canon fodder? WHY... those are good paying jobs, and thank the lord we've got a war you ingrate!! You're so unpatriotic smearing the troops with your blasphemy. God save the Queen, errr, King George, errrr God bless America!

Oh great, let's change the subject to the military side and conveniently avoid the part about all the "mis-represented" poor, uneducated (& white) folks who make up the overwhelming majority of our welfare rolls, and consume most of our social services. And BTW, when their "unwise lifestyle choices" end in disability, addiction, diabetes, and emphysema, who do you think pays for all that?

But you're right, these are (relatively) good-paying jobs in the military now, especially compared to Taco Bell or Wal-Mart, which are about your only other options these days if you're young, unskilled, and just joining the workforce. Or since nearly all those decent-paying manufacturing jobs which once supported blue collar families, have now been shipped off-shore, which has further slashed wages in the low-end, translating to roughly a 6 percent loss (http://www.aflcio.org/issues/jobseconomy/exportingamerica/outsourcing_problems.cfm - broken link) for the two-thirds of workers who lack a college degree.

And yes, the military really starts looking like a way more attractive "choice", when they throw in a few enlistment "incentives", like "hey, we'll buy you a new car, or pay for your college tuition when you get back". That is if you do come back, let alone in one piece....

BTW re: "unpatriotic", I've already been in the service and served my country. How 'bout you?

[8.00 per hour]

nope, white is white...

if your poor change yourself for the better.

[trnsplntfrmNV]

Originally Posted by mateo45

No offense, but I think what you're describing is basically a "ghetto".... mono-racial/mono-cultural, clannish, largely low-income and low-education, insular, & hostile to "outsiders".... pretty much the same thing, except it's a "white" ghetto.

None taken, one could look at it that way.

[floridasandy]

Originally Posted by harborlady

First paragraph, you really need to look at the long view because blue collar workers have seen a steady decline since the 50s. Use benchmark of pay ratio between the big boss and company employees. Blue collar has had some abatements, and some false gains (artificial wealth we're paying back now), but it really has been a slide. This didn't start with Obama or Bush. I can point at symptoms, and guess a hundred reasons for the causes, but I don't know anything definitively as to root causes. Everyone knows without being able to methodically piece it together or break it down to pure logic- there's something rotten in Denmark.

2nd paragraph- your observations about the changes in bank function and how wall street retooled itself started picking up steam in the 70's reacting to inflation and malaise (attributed to carter, but had been going on for a decade). Deregulation was implemented by Reagan in dramatic steps but it was birthed during Nixon years in a think tank. Additional observations of that greater picture- corporations kept getting larger and the volume of small businesses reduced per capita. Then the number of large corporations started shrinking. Corporations were cannibalized in Reagan/ Bush Sr era, cashing out daddy's reputation, chopped up, sold off for parts, and our own manufacturing started going overseas the moment we let go of the work balancing global trade deficit and lifted the import tarrifs.

That's when walmart started taking off on it's steady ascent, but the price was american mfg and small business. Just about all legislation created has been geared towards assisting large corporations reaping larger harvests, and little to nothing for small business. Government representation has been estranged for small biz for the better part of my lifetime. Family farmers- listen to the declaration of foul by a republican plains state senator-- the farm bill benefited agrabiz 80% or better. When red and blue state citizens can agree nearly unanimously that we ought to support family farms, then watch haplessly as a big fish comes along and swallows whole what would feed a small nation all for itself--- Houston we have a problem.

One more thing about wall street in case it hasn't occurred to folks. They are hating life when prices are stable. They're going broke when shares stop selling. Their existence hinges upon prices going up and down, because every time something is bought or sold they make their money on commission. Contrast this w/ main street who would otherwise have a normal life without outrageous highs and lows. The price of milk stays reasonable. The value of their homes is steady, and so are their neighborhoods. That stability provides a basis for real equity rising as slow and steady improvements within a community compound.

False equity is playing a game of musical chairs and leaving your kid with the bill. They can't afford to live in the neighborhood they grew up in because mom and dad cashed it out to live the lifestyles of the rich and famous in costa rica. That was a real story BTW. Their own parents gave them an inheritance but they left their children with a debt. They also did it on a national scale endorsing policies to serve their short term gains to the detriment of all (including themselves!). Inflated housing prices aren't the fault of illegal immigrants. This was the greed of americans all too happy to throw the country under the bus if they could fool themselves into believing they were getting ahead. These are the very same people who hire illegals. Think about it.

Deregulation of finance industry allowed day trading in areas of bare necessity, destabilizing prices and whole neighborhoods. Deregulation also wrecked havoc on other nations buying up their water supply as commodity and holding a poor population hostage with the price tag- the inevitable revolt and destabilization of the country followed. Retrospect- care to watch the thinking of years worth of HGTV selling the ideas of ubber wealthy trading up, and goading young couples to compete for a hovel at insanely inflated prices? Have they retooled their show post meltdown?

my first point was that the bank and auto bailouts haven't gone on for generations and certainly illegal immigration in these skyrocketing numbers hasn't gone on for generations. the huge illegal boom was needed to fuel the DEMAND for housing, to fuel the demand for speculation, and to finally fuel the demand for derivatives. these are newer events, along with the deregulation, which damaged the futures of all blue collar workers.

i totally agree that deregulation was a huge part of the problem, although that was not party specific, as clinton also had a hand in deregulation. i also agree that HGTV did help to goad the reckless spending- not just HGTV but all of that conspicuous consumption advertising boom, but people are still responsible for their own behavior. i also degree about the gatekeepers of wall street hating a stable market, and i think that a lot of the instability is intentionally manipulated by the media. i think that is why every day we get a "will greece (or pick any other country) be bailed out or won't it" story.

unfortunately, the most punished in this society are the people who behaved the most prudently, and that really does include a lot of blue collar workers. they are watching diminished savings and diminished futures even though some of them did not choose to spend recklessly at all! let me add that there was no bailout for the blue collar workers, unless you count the auto bailout for the unions, but the rest of the blue collar workers were left out in the cold.

[renault]

Southern white christians are definitely the new stereotyped bad guys for the loony lefties and mainstream media.

[mateo45]

Originally Posted by renault

Southern white christians are definitely the new stereotyped bad guys for the loony lefties and mainstream media.

Well, for being "victims", they sure like to cooperate with those "stereotypes"....