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The fact is, I am more inclined to listen to the survivors of USS Liberty than the official report presented in collaboration with Israel. Clearly, you would rather go with the latter. Did you read the link I provided above? What story do you think they believe in? Then you might also be in a position to better understand why a US Navy veteran, one of the survivors off USS Liberty, would be so inclined to reject the unilateral blockade imposed by Israel. Trust me, he wasn't doing it being naive, than many of you seem to believe. Talk about disrespecting someone who should be held in high regard for serving this country, and doing so even today.
You may not be able to think of any reason, much less a good reason, I can tell you what that reason would be (although, one of the angles is covered in the USS Liberty veterans website above). Israel wants wars that it doesn't have to take responsibility for. Even the 2008 Gaza conflict was well timed, just as America was preparing for Presidential elections. It was also a time when the media was constantly pushing Iran as a rogue nation, and a serious threat and "something had to be done about it". Pretty much along the same lines, Iraq was villified as a major threat months before 9/11, and immediately after the 2000 elections. Bush appeared ready, again, fortunately, he wasn't going for another term. I'm pretty sure Israel wanted McCain to win. Obama's victory washed up their dreams, at least for now. Another good thing? USA was still burdened with two wars.
This is an old trickery. Personally, I see Israel as the next biggest threat to America. What is it that anti-Zionist Jews, like this, this and this, see around the world is happening in Israel, as a threat, that people like you (assuming non-Zionist American) choose not to?
I'm sure many of the pro-Israel folks would like to project this veteran as being another Adam Kokesh or John Murtha loony. It's probably the best way to marginalize him.
Interesting how much flak Israel is taking for this, and the source of that flak is what makes it sooooooo interesting. At this point the US is holding Israel at arms length, and trying to cozy up to the Islamowackos. Never before has the US been so denying of our closeness to Israel. We have , historically, NEVER been willing to spank them, even when they richly deserved it. In the present climate, it is no wonder Israel is getting to be a bit on the prod, and using their muscle. Their biggest ally, the US, has been tossing them under the bus, so, a show of force, and also a show of how far they are willing to go to protect their interests, is warranted. Makes sense to me, but I am not an Israeli, BUT, if I were, it would make even more sense.
That is not entirelly accurate, because we have spanked them in the past. Bush Sr even threatened to cut all aid to Israel unless they complied to his wishes.
Last edited by Finn_Jarber; 06-04-2010 at 08:55 PM..
That convoy reminds me of a guy going into a bar crying lets fight.Didn't look like those on the ship were too much peaceniks in the films.Nothing that JFK didn't threaten to do in the cuban blockade.
That is not entirelly accurate, because we have spanked them in the past. Bush Sr even threatened to cut all aid to Israel unless they complied to his wishes.
I am inclined to believe that the "threats" are in perceived need to the political situation at home--these threats are never carried out. In both the 1973 war and the 2006 Lebanon war, America rushed munitions to Israel in a matter of hours. The 1973 war is understandable as Israel had her back against the wall--the 2006 war is much more difficult to justify as Israel was not under attack, and was using munitions to target civilian infrastructure-- equally damning were the 20-30 year old cluster bombs we sent them to clear out our warehouses, with dud rates reaching 60%, all to be discovered by Lebanese civilians when the ceasefire was finally reached.
We just spent 12 hours wrangling with the Turks over how to phrase the UN statement regarding Israel's boarding of a ship in international waters--there should have been no wrangling at all. You don't attack a ship in int'l waters period. I fear the tail is again wagging the dog.
But do you condone it? OJ, too, got away with it. But I'm sure you have an opinion on the subject. Why not share it here? Here's the question again:
1- Do you condone and are supportive of Israeli action on USS Liberty?
2- Are you supportive of any medal of honor and/or promotion given to Israeli army involved in attack of USS Liberty?
Given your take so far, I take it that answer is yes to both. But I would rather hear it from you instead of assuming on your behalf.
I really don't care. How is that for an honest answer? (Your point #2 is just baiting so Im ignoring)
The reality of the situation is two sides that abuse the hell out of each other at any opportunity.
I find the desire to portray one as the victim and the other the aggresor ridiculous. One raids ships, the other sends retards strapped with bombs into bus stops....
Is the US biased in favor of Israel? Absolutely.
Is Europe and other parts of the world biased agaisnt Israel? Absolutely.
Frankly, the whole area is ridiculous since the Pak-India conflict kills 10x as many people each year and BOTH sides have nukes. So, frankly I think people with a keen eye on Israel (either way) have some personal motivation\bias or general ignorance of world events. Which is it for you?
I am inclined to believe that the "threats" are in perceived need to the political situation at home--these threats are never carried out. In both the 1973 war and the 2006 Lebanon war, America rushed munitions to Israel in a matter of hours. The 1973 war is understandable as Israel had her back against the wall--the 2006 war is much more difficult to justify as Israel was not under attack, and was using munitions to target civilian infrastructure-- equally damning were the 20-30 year old cluster bombs we sent them to clear out our warehouses, with dud rates reaching 60%, all to be discovered by Lebanese civilians when the ceasefire was finally reached.
We just spent 12 hours wrangling with the Turks over how to phrase the UN statement regarding Israel's boarding of a ship in international waters--there should have been no wrangling at all. You don't attack a ship in int'l waters period. I fear the tail is again wagging the dog.
I said we have shown 'tough love' with Israel before as in the case of Bush sr, and will probably do so in the future too.
I am inclined to believe that the "threats" are in perceived need to the political situation at home--these threats are never carried out. In both the 1973 war and the 2006 Lebanon war, America rushed munitions to Israel in a matter of hours. The 1973 war is understandable as Israel had her back against the wall--the 2006 war is much more difficult to justify as Israel was not under attack, and was using munitions to target civilian infrastructure-- equally damning were the 20-30 year old cluster bombs we sent them to clear out our warehouses, with dud rates reaching 60%, all to be discovered by Lebanese civilians when the ceasefire was finally reached.
We just spent 12 hours wrangling with the Turks over how to phrase the UN statement regarding Israel's boarding of a ship in international waters--there should have been no wrangling at all. You don't attack a ship in int'l waters period. I fear the tail is again wagging the dog.
Do you remember the Six Days War of 1967? How much did the Americans help the Israelis in that one? Help wasn't needed because they came up with all kinds of "tricky" explosives that made the Egyptians nearly helpless although they did manage to accuse the Americans for bombing their airstrips. Damned dumb Israelis flew west and attacked from the west and the Egyptians thought it was Americans who were bombing with dive bombers. I have a world of goodies from that one, but then I researched it one year after it took place before lefties had a chance to change any of the stories.
Do you remember the Six Days War of 1967? How much did the Americans help the Israelis in that one? Help wasn't needed because they came up with all kinds of "tricky" explosives that made the Egyptians nearly helpless although they did manage to accuse the Americans for bombing their airstrips. Damned dumb Israelis flew west and attacked from the west and the Egyptians thought it was Americans who were bombing with dive bombers. I have a world of goodies from that one, but then I researched it one year after it took place before lefties had a chance to change any of the stories.
Did the Israelis paint American insignia on their planes, too?
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