Are surly, uptight or obtuse co-workers common here? (Portland, Dallas: buy, schools)

[sugarsugar]

I am a native Oregonian, third generation on my dad's side of the tree. I can assure you that it has been like this since I was old enough to notice it as a child. And it wasn't coming from or directed only to the "others" like Californians who we like to blame for that attitude. It is a homegrown thing to which outsiders can add their poor attitude if they wish, but they certainly cannot take credit for creating it.

I have no idea why. I've traveled across the country and across the sea and never run into as much of this type of attitude as I find back home here. When I was young, I wanted to live anywhere else but here because of this. I am only lately hearing the term Seattle freeze, but I certainly am familiar with the concept from growing up here outside Portland. And it wasn't done just to outsiders either...my relatives were like that to each other. My classmates too and later my co-workers. Someone told me once that it was because so many people from Vermont settled here way back in the day and that they were reticent and hard to approach, but who knows? Everyone has their fav reason why, and as far as I can tell they are all myths. The reasons may be myths but the behavior is real.

I am still here decades later, primarily because I love the outdoors and wide open spaces without crowds. It has turned out to be a wonderful place to enjoy as a home base. And I am quite enjoying the influx of outsiders because things are so much more interesting the bigger the mix becomes. Despite that, every now and then I get in a mood and channel my inner native Oregonian....and am rather a private and reticent sort with people I don't know well (though am Irish crazy with the ones I trust). Maybe I stayed here too long..

[Isotope-C14]

Originally Posted by sugarsugar

I am a native Oregonian, third generation on my dad's side of the tree. I can assure you that it has been like this since I was old enough to notice it as a child. And it wasn't coming from or directed only to the "others" like Californians who we like to blame for that attitude. It is a homegrown thing to which outsiders can add their poor attitude if they wish, but they certainly cannot take credit for creating it.

I have no idea why. I've traveled across the country and across the sea and never run into as much of this type of attitude as I find back home here. When I was young, I wanted to live anywhere else but here because of this. I am only lately hearing the term Seattle freeze, but I certainly am familiar with the concept from growing up here outside Portland. And it wasn't done just to outsiders either...my relatives were like that to each other. My classmates too and later my co-workers. Someone told me once that it was because so many people from Vermont settled here way back in the day and that they were reticent and hard to approach, but who knows? Everyone has their fav reason why, and as far as I can tell they are all myths. The reasons may be myths but the behavior is real.

I am still here decades later, primarily because I love the outdoors and wide open spaces without crowds. It has turned out to be a wonderful place to enjoy as a home base. And I am quite enjoying the influx of outsiders because things are so much more interesting the bigger the mix becomes. Despite that, every now and then I get in a mood and channel my inner native Oregonian....and am rather a private and reticent sort with people I don't know well (though am Irish crazy with the ones I trust). Maybe I stayed here too long..

Thanks for your thoughtful post.

I noticed it too while working there. The Californians were generally easy going and pleasant at work, the Oregonians, the opposite. Often I'd observe a social "snarky-ness" to the people at work as well.

I think there's something in the water.

In fact, if I am ever in the position of hiring again, a Washington or Oregon history is immediately going in the trash... (most likely)

I'd be very curious if ex-pats from that area end up being non-surly co-operative employees once outside of the area?

[jjpop]

Originally Posted by Isotope-C14

In fact, if I am ever in the position of hiring again, a Washington or Oregon history is immediately going in the trash... (most likely)

Wow! Really? Just based on geography?

Originally Posted by Isotope-C14

I'd be very curious if ex-pats from that area end up being non-surly co-operative employees once outside of the area?

Well, we wouldn't know if people in the position of hiring us don't, would we?
(Speaking as a non-native Oregonian, but with most of my work history in Oregon.)

[Isotope-C14]

Originally Posted by jjpop

Wow! Really? Just based on geography?


Well, we wouldn't know if people in the position of hiring us don't, would we?
(Speaking as a non-native Oregonian, but with most of my work history in Oregon.)

I'd look specifically at education. If the school(s) were in OR/WA, I'd be very, very concerned. If the candidate had a degree from somewhere outside of OR/WA, I probably wouldn't pay it too much mind.

My Aunt warned me. She has a degree in something most people would joke about, but is from Iowa. She told me before I moved out there, that things were different. Boy was she right. She warned me about work-ethic primarily. She didn't go into the surly/obtuse line of things. Probably because she's a classic mid-western battle-axe. But if you want something done...

I have a sis in Cali, she says a bunch of job postings, whether implicitly stated, or not, have no interest in hiring products of the California school system. Nor do I after meeting and working with enough of them.

I have to wonder too, that it's not the water, but the early-education (elementary through high-school) that screws up people there, as far as working with people from east of Nevada.

[turquoise1]

Nice post sugarsugar. :-)

[Deezus]

Wow, now I truly realize why us West Coasters just aren't good enough to make in the Midwest. Why even try to get a job in Iowa? We must be inferior because of our educational system...which basically varies heavily by school district even within the same city not to mention private schools...maybe it's just in the water we drink as kids.

I feel bad for all the Midwesterners who come out here and have to deal with us. We truly are horrible and poorly educated human beings(if you'd even consider us human, we could just be some primitive simian species at this point).

[jjpop]

Well, I guess it isn't illegal to discriminate based on geography, so there you go. I would hope you would reconsider your position, and for your sister to reconsider her position about Californians, because you buy into a stereotype of what everyone is like from those states and you may be missing out on a gem of an employee.

I can't think of a single state or territory in the US whose residents I would completely rule out of consideration for hiring. For example, many Hawaiians may live with an "island time" mentality, but I wouldn't round-file a Hawaiian's resume just based on the address.

[Yankeemama]

Originally Posted by Deezus

Wow, now I truly realize why us West Coasters just aren't good enough to make in the Midwest. Why even try to get a job in Iowa? We must be inferior because of our educational system...which basically varies heavily by school district even within the same city not to mention private schools...maybe it's just in the water we drink as kids.

I feel bad for all the Midwesterners who come out here and have to deal with us. We truly are horrible and poorly educated human beings(if you'd even consider us human, we could just be some primitive simian species at this point).

This is a great post! We, West Coast kids are just so unemployable. I can't even respond it that.

[sugarsugar]

Originally Posted by Isotope-C14

Thanks for your thoughtful post.

I noticed it too while working there. The Californians were generally easy going and pleasant at work, the Oregonians, the opposite. Often I'd observe a social "snarky-ness" to the people at work as well.

I think there's something in the water.

In fact, if I am ever in the position of hiring again, a Washington or Oregon history is immediately going in the trash... (most likely)

I'd be very curious if ex-pats from that area end up being non-surly co-operative employees once outside of the area?

Just wanted to point out that all I have noticed and grown up around is the attitude part...and I would not say that the attitude problem correlates to an inability to work hard/have a work ethic. And I do know a lot of "Portland freeze" and attitude issue types who have been uber successful by anyone's standards. I know daily interactions are impacted, for sure, but I wouldn't assume equal impacts on hard work/results or depth of education. Other than the fact that in a corporate setting, working with people with that 'tude is probably more akin to herding cats than fostering a team spirit...

Despite the freeze (or social snarkiness which is another good term), I was successful here at a young age, though I did the self employment route. That said, things probably operate far more smoothly in other places where the words ”cooperative employee" aren't seen as fighting words, and people are superficially or actually more outgoing, friendly, pleasant and more open to being team members. It is definitely a nicer environment to operate in if one must be in the corporate world, though again, I see no correlation with work ethic in general. In fact, some of the nicest people I know are almost insufferably lazy. So I'd call it a mixed bag on this aspect.

[EnricoV]

It is just so insane, and bigoted, to think that everyone from anywhere is even predominantly one "type."

And enough with the "it's because they all came from X place." Just didn't happen. Oregon was settled by people from everywhere. There is no predominance of origin. That's what made it such a crazy place in the early days. Half the people were from the south, half from the north .. and the country was on the eve of the Civil War. Heck, even the vote to create the territory was almost evenly split between Canadians and Americans.

And Vermont? At the 1860 census (one year after statehood) 209 heads of households were born in Vermont. Out of 17,900 households. So no, there weren't "so many" people from Vermont.