Is all of Portland really this depressingly bad? (Beaverton, Tigard: mortgage, new home)

[ArtinUS]

Hi All,

I want to say this conversation has been riveting for me. So, thanks! I live in NYC and am desperate to get out. I've been considering Portland very heavily and am planning a trip out there next month. After reading the OP's first post I had 2nd thoughts about my trip completely. Your explanations have helped dissuade my fears. But do you suggest I look into Portland coming from NYC? I've never lived anywhere else, but I don't want to move to another place with bums, not feeling safe, and feeling forced out of the city. I love that in NY I can walk everywhere and there are a lot of young, cultural people trying to progress. I'm assuming Portland shares some of those pros, but am I going to be disappointed? Do young people (25-40) live in Portland and have social, cutlural lifestyles somewhat like in NYC?

Thank you again for all your thoughts! - ArtinUS

[oldtintype]

Portland is not an unsafe or scary city. There are small areas of the downtown section where the homeless/mental health/addict services are that you may encounter some "scary" people. The thing is, there's no real reason to HANG OUT there so it's not like it's something you have to experience every day unless you work there or something. There are homeless people in Portland just like anywhere else, but for the most part, except for parts of downtown, you probably won't really even notice them unless you're looking for them. And those you do see aren't violent. There are tons of young people here, tons of hip neighborhoods, etc. Portland is a small "big" city so it's not going to be as dynamic as NYC but there is a lot to offer. It's also not a tourist city so it's not the kind of place like San Francisco that knocks you off your feet at first glance. It's more about the quality of life you can have, what the city has to offer, etc. when you live here that makes it for me. I don't think a short trip really conveys all that. I think the OP was looking for a type of environment that just doesn't exist in an urban area, or it if does it's only affordable to a very small percentage of people. Anytime you have urban you have urban problems. To exaggerate them to the point that they were in terms of safety is just ridiculous. You will not feel unsafe here. Whether or not it's dynamic enough for you remains to be seen but you won't feel unsafe. I think it's important to point out too that what makes Portland "stand out" in terms of newspaper articles, etc. is what's starting to happen in terms of foodies, alternative things, etc. That doesn't mean that Portland is this pristine mecca of glory, which is what I think the OP thought, it means that cool things are happening here in various states. Some of the coolest things are currently happening are happening in neighborhoods that look pretty scruffy and run down. Usually that's the way it works anywhere because when places are cheaper more experimental things can happen. To judge the quality of what's happening based on what the neighborhood looks like is kind of off base as if everything was pristine and beautiful all the time no one could afford to experiment. So if you're looking for everything to be perfect and also unique it usually doesn't happen that way. That's just not reality. The Pearl is an example. It hasn't been "arty" for eons because once it got fancy most of the artists couldn't afford to live there anymore. Now it's an area generally for wealthy people (apart from the affordable housing units) and while there are some great restaurants most people can't afford them. Over on Alberta or Mississippi there are some amazing restaurants and art, and much more affordable, but the neighborhoods aren't "pristine" enough for some people to get past the way they look to see what's really there. It all depends what you're looking for and where you're at. If Portland were pristine and perfect in every way not only would it be more crowded, more expensive and more urban, most of the cool things couldn't exist anymore because the creative innovative types couldn't afford to be here.

[ArtinUS]

Originally Posted by oldtintype

Portland is not an unsafe or scary city. There are small areas of the downtown section where the homeless/mental health/addict services are that you may encounter some "scary" people. The thing is, there's no real reason to HANG OUT there so it's not like it's something you have to experience every day unless you work there or something. There are homeless people in Portland just like anywhere else, but for the most part, except for parts of downtown, you probably won't really even notice them unless you're looking for them. And those you do see aren't violent. There are tons of young people here, tons of hip neighborhoods, etc. Portland is a small "big" city so it's not going to be as dynamic as NYC but there is a lot to offer. It's also not a tourist city so it's not the kind of place like San Francisco that knocks you off your feet at first glance. It's more about the quality of life you can have, what the city has to offer, etc. when you live here that makes it for me. I don't think a short trip really conveys all that. I think the OP was looking for a type of environment that just doesn't exist in an urban area, or it if does it's only affordable to a very small percentage of people. Anytime you have urban you have urban problems. To exaggerate them to the point that they were in terms of safety is just ridiculous. You will not feel unsafe here. Whether or not it's dynamic enough for you remains to be seen but you won't feel unsafe. I think it's important to point out too that what makes Portland "stand out" in terms of newspaper articles, etc. is what's starting to happen in terms of foodies, alternative things, etc. That doesn't mean that Portland is this pristine mecca of glory, which is what I think the OP thought, it means that cool things are happening here in various states. Some of the coolest things are currently happening are happening in neighborhoods that look pretty scruffy and run down. Usually that's the way it works anywhere because when places are cheaper more experimental things can happen. To judge the quality of what's happening based on what the neighborhood looks like is kind of off base as if everything was pristine and beautiful all the time no one could afford to experiment. So if you're looking for everything to be perfect and also unique it usually doesn't happen that way. That's just not reality. The Pearl is an example. It hasn't been "arty" for eons because once it got fancy most of the artists couldn't afford to live there anymore. Now it's an area generally for wealthy people (apart from the affordable housing units) and while there are some great restaurants most people can't afford them. Over on Alberta or Mississippi there are some amazing restaurants and art, and much more affordable, but the neighborhoods aren't "pristine" enough for some people to get past the way they look to see what's really there. It all depends what you're looking for and where you're at. If Portland were pristine and perfect in every way not only would it be more crowded, more expensive and more urban, most of the cool things couldn't exist anymore because the creative innovative types couldn't afford to be here.

Hi OldTinType:

I hear you on many of your points regarding artsy cannot mean perfect otherwise no artsy people could afford to be there. An always changing environment is what I'm looking for and to hear that there is experimentation makes me feel better about putting Portland at the top of my list. Your candor is great! I will let you know how my trip goes (not until end of August). Thank you for your input.

[Tesaje]

Originally Posted by ArtinUS

Hi All,

I want to say this conversation has been riveting for me. So, thanks! I live in NYC and am desperate to get out. I've been considering Portland very heavily and am planning a trip out there next month. After reading the OP's first post I had 2nd thoughts about my trip completely. Your explanations have helped dissuade my fears. But do you suggest I look into Portland coming from NYC? I've never lived anywhere else, but I don't want to move to another place with bums, not feeling safe, and feeling forced out of the city. I love that in NY I can walk everywhere and there are a lot of young, cultural people trying to progress. I'm assuming Portland shares some of those pros, but am I going to be disappointed? Do young people (25-40) live in Portland and have social, cutlural lifestyles somewhat like in NYC?

Thank you again for all your thoughts! - ArtinUS

I don't think there is a city in the US without bums and panhandlers in some areas. How the city and police handle them makes a big difference in the relative safety as many are probably harmless but some are dangerous - criminals or strung out on drugs.

I remember when I was in college some 30+ years ago, a jaunt up to Portland was quite shocking. I think we were going thru old town which had prostitutes and bums and looked very seedy and unsafe. Getting confused with the bridges didn't help much.

But I've been having a trip or two a year to Portland for the last several years and have never encountered the OP's description. I've seen homeless and bums, but not the seediness that I remembered from so many years ago. But then again, I've seen some of the seediness described in parts of Seattle too.

Here where I work right near a metro stop just across the DC line, there is a regular cadre of panhandlers every day. Some underpasses smell like a poorly maintained outhouse. There are daytime muggings in parking lots with disturbing frequency. After 530 pm, it really isn't safe to be outside on foot. There are parts of DC I would never venture into at any part of the day but other parts that are very nice. Where I work is not a particularly bad area in this region.

I will say that when I moved to the east coast, I was shocked at how bad some of the city areas are compared to west coast cities, and that includes the San Francisco tenderloin.

[Ufoureah]

I think you should just stay in Virginia.. the roads are too crowded as it is

[ChadPettingill]

Originally Posted by oldtintype

And if you're seeing trailer parks you're WAY WAY out in the middle of nowhere in what is called Felony flats for a reason. There are no trailer parks anywhere in close in Portland. It sounds like you were in the downtown core where the homeless services are hence a lot of homeless, and then WAY out in the outer Portland areas where people don't tend to live for a reason. How you managed to miss all the other parts of Portland is pretty amazing!

Wow...can anyone say elitist?

[oldtintype]

It's not elitist--from a tourist standpoint there are no trailer parks close in. They're in far out areas, that tend to have a lot of poverty and crime. The land is too valuable for them to be close in--any that were were sold out and had homes built on them long ago. And by saying people don't live there for a reason, I'm referring the trailer parks I assumed he saw outside of Lents and along SE 82nd AVe where, no, most people would do their best not to live due to prostitution, meth, and high crime. This is again, from a tourist standpoint--I have no idea why someone would end up in these neighborhoods when trying to do a "tourist" version of Portland as there really isn't anything close by that you'd be trying to see as a tourist. I mean most tourists don't choose to go to the worst neighborhoods a city has and then declare that to be the entire city.

And as for the downtown core, yes, he was in Old Town where the majority of homeless are and that doesn't mean all of Portland is like that, but he chose to believe it was.

[scone]

There are quite a few trailer parks around the region, some are nicer than others. But you have to remember, the cost of housing here is high compared to wages, and there isn't a large housing stock, as there is "back East." There simply isn't enough affordable housing to meet the needs of people making about $40k - $50k per household,which is about the average in most areas. It affects a lot of young people and retirees, as well as the lower-wage workers--- not just homeless people.

[oldtintype]

I would highly doubt there is anyone making even $15,000 in the trailer parks near SE 82nd. In other places there are mobile home parks and some long term trailer type parks but the ones I was assuming he meant are hardly for working class people in any way or form.

[Stoney Mcgee]

[quote]

Originally Posted by DestinationSeattle

We're on vacation in Portland right now, and we are seriously underwhelmed so far. The scenery out in the countryside is some of the most beautiful I've ever seen, anywhere, but the city has so far given us the creeps.

We parked down along Naito Parkway to head to the Saturday Market, and one of the first things my wife saw as we left the parking garage is some guy crouched behind a bush, taking a dump. I smelled urine in at least three spots along the streets, and I saw one kid whip it out and take a leak at a park down by the Portland Building. There was some lunatic wandering around Pioneer Courthouse Square, wearing gloves and a winter coat on a nearly 80-degree day, stopping every few steps to look skyward, gesture, mumble something to himself, turn, take a few steps, and do the same thing all over again. There were bums everywhere, and lots of them were kids. One guy thrust his arm out at me and then another at my wife, explaining that perhaps his other arm was easier to read. He had something tattooed on his arm about giving him change for beer money. So this guy is apparently in a permanent state of begging, if he went to the trouble to get his begging mantra tattooed on his arm. And he didn't even want money for a meal, or a place to stay. He wanted BEER MONEY. Nice.

Sadly, everything you say happens everyday. I go to PSU (downtown) and at least once a day someone asks me for change, or i see someone puking, or urinating - sometimes even worse. There are many homeless kids and a lot of them are plain rude. Plus they stink the place up. Meth is HUGE here. I've had my house broken into once and my car twice. Cops said it was most likely meth-related. I don't consider myself elitist either, but there is a pervasive acceptance of these things. People aren't as ambitious as in other parts of the country, and I believe that attitude trickles down to the homeless in Portland. There are many who consider begging for change an acceptable way of life. The fact that so many do it emboldens younger people to start doing it too.

All this having been said, its kinda what makes Portland, Portland. There are certainly places that are really safe and void of any of the aforementioned negativity. But you can't escape it. I moved here 20 years ago, and there have been many great changes. One thing that hasn't changed, and I don't see changing anytime soon (ever?) is the abundance of street characters who feel its an acceptable lifestyle to beg and be a burden on society. A part of Portland seems to embrace, or at least willingly tolerate people with absolutely no ambition. These people are perfectly content to live off your charity. Sometimes I feel sad for them, mostly I wish they would just get off their butts and get to work already. Grow up and be an adult.