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Location: Still in Portland, Oregon, for some reason
890 posts, read 3,701,207 times
Reputation: 743
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If you ask me, the tactics that the City and Metro are using to discourage car use in Portland are slowly killing this city. MAX helped to revitalize the downtown area in the 1980s but now over-saturation of mass-transit and excessive bicycle and pedestrian accommodation is having the opposite of the intended effect. I have talked to a number of people who don't even go downtown anymore because it's so difficult to drive and find parking and because MAX is too inconvenient for where they live.
Some of the things the City has done include removing parking spaces and even auto lanes for bike lanes. Several major downtown streets have had a whole lane removed just for bikes and not once have I seen a bike use them. They have also empowered the pedestrians so they just strut right out in front of speeding cars because city hall has told them they always have the right of way. Now charging $1.60 an hour for parking downtown and on Sundays, people really have no reason to drive downtown to conduct their business.
You can make it bike, pedestrian and mass-transit oriented until the cows come home but when you alienate the car portion, you are eliminating a large number of people who live away from the city core. I only live seven or so miles from downtown and it takes me maybe 10 to 15 minutes to get drive down there. If I were to take mass transit (as Metro wants everybody to do), it would take me an hour to walk to the nearest bus stop, wait up to 20 minutes for the bus and then add another 30 to 45 minutes for the bus ride downtown. Why would I waste 2 hours of my time when I can get in my car and drive to Beaverton or another car-friendly part of town and conduct my business there? Well....that's what I do. Now that my hair dresser has moved to Beaverton, I have no reason to go downtown.
I believe that Portland's anti-car agenda (which they will not publicly admit as being so) will eventually drive away a great deal of downtown businesses. In 20 years or less, downtown Portland will be a shriveled, lifeless core with very little business. It will look like Detroit with bike lanes and light rail. There is something as too much of a good thing.
I asked a transportation expert about the increase in parking costs in downtown Portland, and his response was clear: the cost went up because the demand for parking downtown exceeded the supply. You can address that via several strategies (none of them mutually exclusive), such as encouraging mass transit, making it more expensive to park ones car, and adding more parking spaces.
The fact of the matter is that driving capacity in downtown is limited unless you start bulldozing streets and businesses for more car lanes. Yes, bike lanes, bus only lanes, streetcars and light rail take up space that cars could be in, but they can all carry more people than a car. Make parking cheaper and you get more cars attempting to get into the city and being unable to find parking, driving around in circles like hawks, clogging up the roads, becoming aggressive, etc. This would discourage people from coming into the city, too. Once people get into downtown, they want to be able to walk around. People are funny because they want it both ways: easy, cheap, and fast access by car into the city, but then once they get there, they want the streets to be pedestrian friendly (not too much noise, not too much pollution, and right of way).
The city needs to balance the transportation needs of downtown workers, tourists, suburban shoppers, students, and residents (don't forget them) - it's not an easy task and there are no silver bullets. Providing people with options for getting into/out of the city is key. Some people may make fewer visits into the city if the parking costs more or if it takes a little longer, but they may well be offset by others who can afford $1.60/hr parking, those on bikes, those on mass transit lines, those who choose to live in the city and forego driving ....
Personally, I've seen a few new bike lanes downtown that made me roll my eyes as they seem excessive and oddly placed. And I am more judicious in my trips to downtown because of the increased parking costs. But I still go when I need/want something. The bigger picture is: how is downtown commerce? Is downtown thriving or is it becoming a ghost town? What is the leasing occupancy rate? How many people are able to get around in the area and spend more money? Time will tell.
Sofia - Thank you for a reasonable response. I live 7 miles from the city center and take the MAX to downtown when I need to go. I walk the .7 mi to the max. Takes about an hour total. I am very glad to have it. I do not drive and manage do whatever I need without a car. Use a taxi when I need to haul stuff or get a ride. Personally, I would love to see the whole downtown area closed to private traffic. I believe the downtown area will be vibrant with or without private cars.
Last edited by abigailprettycat; 05-14-2010 at 07:10 AM..
Reason: thought about it some more
In 20 years or less, downtown Portland will be a shriveled, lifeless core with very little business. It will look like Detroit with bike lanes and light rail. There is something as too much of a good thing.
I'd like to get everybody else's opinion on this.
I'm hopeful that in 20 years people en mass will have realized how destructive cars are to the environment and it's citizens health and Portland will be viewed as a visionary city with an eye to the future.
If you ask me, the tactics that the City and Metro are using to discourage car use in Portland are slowly killing this city. MAX helped to revitalize the downtown area in the 1980s but now over-saturation of mass-transit and excessive bicycle and pedestrian accommodation is having the opposite of the intended effect. I have talked to a number of people who don't even go downtown anymore because it's so difficult to drive and find parking and because MAX is too inconvenient for where they live.....
{snip}
I'd like to get everybody else's opinion on this.
Two objectives:
- prevent urban sprawl which would kill downtown and the social fabric of the City of Portland in favor of the growth of economic / cultural / social isolation and so on, and so forth. Almost every city in Lower USA of any substantial size has experienced this stratification and isolation phenomenon. The city of Portland's urban feel is what makes it desirable for transplants like myself. (I could go on, but I will spare everyone this time.)
- Reduce Dependence on Oil. The more the anti-car political policy is, and the pro-active economic and commute-time efficiency is in favor of the Mass Transit system, then in the long run more and more individuals will choose NOT to drive by themselves to work.
My guess, and I have no Proof, that per person The Entire Portland Metro area uses much less gasoline than many other cities in the Lower 48. Not everyone, and not all the time will make this choice to use TriMet. But if numbers of TriMet don't keep the system at some level of capacity, Portland's mass transit system will wither and die. And then when the next oil shock occurs, Portland's commuters will also be left with out options.
Not to hijack this thread.....
But has anyone else concluded that some of the ultra strong proponents of the Columbia River crossing with the new 10 lane bridge are somehow in favor of the bridge because Vancouver WA does not have urban growth limits, and building a car friendly commute from Vancouver to Downtown Portland would create a boom in 'burb housing construction in Vancouver? could there be a financial interest as a second layer to some peoples enthusiastic support for 10 lanes of I-5 expressway from Vancouver all the way to Willsonville?
That by creating massive traffic and horrible commuting, is in effect limiting the 'burb growth of Vancouver WA? Thus preserving the economic stability and cultural life of the City of Portland.
Location: Still in Portland, Oregon, for some reason
890 posts, read 3,701,207 times
Reputation: 743
I guess I failed to make my point clear so I'll try to abbreviate. People don't like to be forced to do things they don't want to do and those who want to drive into town will eventually no longer choose to do so. They will go elsewhere to get their errands done. This method of pro-mass transit would work great in harmony with some automotive accommodation but when you criminalize the car, it's eventually going to start having the opposite effect (which it has). The mass transit system works great for those who live in the city but for everybody else, it's a burden and an inconvenience.
There's a reason my hairdresser moved to Beaverton. She used to work at the Bob Shop right off 5th Avenue and after the transit mall opened, her business went down 40% to 50%. Many businesses are moving out of downtown because of the difficulty in getting down there and in fact I saw a downtown intersection where EVERY business on that corner was empty and had a 'FOR LEASE' sign in the window. I've never seen that in the 'burbs.
And to those saying the downtown core would be great as a completely car-free zone. How would you like to lug that new TV or building supplies on to a MAX train, then on to a bus, and then lug them several miles home? I don't know about you but that just doesn't sound appealing to me which is probably why I will never fit in here. I will keep my evil, city-destroying car and be on time for my appointments because of it.
It is possible, and many do, to drive to a park and ride along the MAX corridor (the Sunset P&R being especially popular for this maneuver) and finish the trip into town on MAX. I wonder if the o.p. has visited New York... City. A little perspective does wonders for a POV.
Downtown Portland sounds like heaven for me, presently getting run off the road by drivers daily in Baltimore City. $1.60/hr for downtown parking doesn't seem so bad - ever been to DC, Baltimore, Philly, NY, or Boston?!?!?!
rosecitywanderer - I live in Vancouver and there are plenty of empty storefronts. I read somewhere that at least 20% of the storefronts in Vancouver are empty, unleased. Vancouver Mall (aka Westfield Shopping Center) is an island in an ocean of parking, and they have record levels of un-leased space.
So people might blame the traffic/parking/meter increase, but I find it hard to believe that it's the only reason. Their revenues may have gone down but maybe it's because we just had a recession? Maybe their leasing costs went up? Cost of doing business goes up? There are lots of reasons why there are empty storefronts. Every strip mall I pass in Vancouver has at least 1 empty space, and I've lost count of how many strip malls I've driven past with only one or two tenants instead of the 6-10 they can accommodate.
I guess I failed to make my point clear so I'll try to abbreviate. People don't like to be forced to do things they don't want to do and those who want to drive into town will eventually no longer choose to do so. They will go elsewhere to get their errands done. This method of pro-mass transit would work great in harmony with some automotive accommodation but when you criminalize the car, it's eventually going to start having the opposite effect (which it has). The mass transit system works great for those who live in the city but for everybody else, it's a burden and an inconvenience.
There's a reason my hairdresser moved to Beaverton. She used to work at the Bob Shop right off 5th Avenue and after the transit mall opened, her business went down 40% to 50%. Many businesses are moving out of downtown because of the difficulty in getting down there and in fact I saw a downtown intersection where EVERY business on that corner was empty and had a 'FOR LEASE' sign in the window. I've never seen that in the 'burbs.
And to those saying the downtown core would be great as a completely car-free zone. How would you like to lug that new TV or building supplies on to a MAX train, then on to a bus, and then lug them several miles home? I don't know about you but that just doesn't sound appealing to me which is probably why I will never fit in here. I will keep my evil, city-destroying car and be on time for my appointments because of it.
Sounds to me like you have a choice and you have made your choice so quit bitching and continue to take yourself to Beaverton to get your haircut. I appreciate it. It is possible to haul heavy stuff with some advanced planning and to get to appointments on time. I do it all the time. I did it this morning.
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