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Old 02-11-2019, 07:26 AM
 
8,577 posts, read 3,358,174 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katarina Witt View Post
That is untrue, and I'd love to know what makes you think so. Here is some research that shows it's untrue.
https://adoption.com/truth-about-get...after-adoption

Here's a very old study (1963) that says basically the same thing: https://www.fertstert.org/article/S0...16)34991-3/pdf

More with links to research: "Once You Adopt A Baby You'll Get Pregnant" and 4 Other Adoption And Infertility Myths | America Adopts
I knew I'd find "Resolve" in your links as a source. They do insist this phenomenon doesn't exist, but, in fact, it does.

Again, I have to put in the caveat that this happens when there isn't a very clear and diagnosed cause of infertility.

When the doctors are stumped as to why the couple is unable to conceive, this happens.

That's why you see so many families where the first is adopted, and the next two are biological.

And people can say it isn't true, as Resolve does, but it is true.

And here ya go: "And yet, it does seem to happen", says Dr. Ross. Regarding women who conceive through IVF or adoption, then go on to conceive without intervention for future children. Although for some reason I can't fathom, there isn't research in this area, anecdotally, the doctors agree it's a thing.

https://www.health.com/infertility/w...r-ivf-adoption
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Old 02-11-2019, 07:48 AM
 
Location: rural south west UK
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I just wonder why someone would keep trying for 7 YEARS!
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Old 02-11-2019, 10:02 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
86,039 posts, read 100,903,502 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
I knew I'd find "Resolve" in your links as a source. They do insist this phenomenon doesn't exist, but, in fact, it does.

Again, I have to put in the caveat that this happens when there isn't a very clear and diagnosed cause of infertility.

When the doctors are stumped as to why the couple is unable to conceive, this happens.

That's why you see so many families where the first is adopted, and the next two are biological.

And people can say it isn't true, as Resolve does, but it is true.

And here ya go: "And yet, it does seem to happen", says Dr. Ross. Regarding women who conceive through IVF or adoption, then go on to conceive without intervention for future children. Although for some reason I can't fathom, there isn't research in this area, anecdotally, the doctors agree it's a thing.

https://www.health.com/infertility/w...r-ivf-adoption
What's your issue with "RESOLVE"? And just what kind of expertise do you have in this field anyway?

Doctors are not immune to confirmation bias, either, and this article seems to be based on one doctor's "observation".

"And though no recent data on women who conceive after adopting exists, the phenomenon doesn’t seem to be a total myth. So how and why are couples who thought they couldn't have kids getting pregnant?"

This: "“The truth is, many of the ‘infertile’ couples are really not infertile," says Dr. Ross. "Many couples seeking fertility treatment don’t necessarily need IVF to conceive." As assisted reproductive technologies becomes more mainstream, and women have children later in life (which can cause some anxiety around being able to get pregnant), couples are less hesitant to turn to IVF or adoption sooner in their quest to be parents, says Dr. Ross.

“More and more couples resort to IVF prematurely due to the fear of being infertile,” she says. “By definition, infertility means not being able to get pregnant after one year of trying to conceive, and 1 in 8 couples will have difficulty getting pregnant. However, anxious couples will seek out fertility treatment sooner than necessary in order to become pregnant; many don’t want to wait one full year of trying to conceive to look into fertility treatment options.”"
is pure bull****! And this BS about couples choosing to adopt instead of waiting longer to conceive is just ridiculous, in the true sense of the word, worthy of ridicule. It is extremely difficult to adopt here in the US, and foreign adoption keeps getting harder and harder.

IVF is not the first step in fertility treatment, it's usually the last.

See this: https://www.arcfertility.com/patient...ime-treatment/
I note this advice hasn't changed much in 40 years, either.
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Old 02-11-2019, 12:31 PM
 
Location: Southeast Michigan
1,069 posts, read 917,630 times
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RESOLVE is a very helpful organization. I called them in tears in my mid-twenties, when the ob/gyn who was the local "infertility expert" had me on ever increasing doses of Clomid, and added a shot of HCG. Basically, he didn't kinow what he was doing in my case. I felt really, really horrible. There was a new reproductive endocrinologist in town, and they told me about her. And they listened to me and were able to sympathize. It was a tremendous relief.
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Old 02-12-2019, 05:32 PM
 
8,577 posts, read 3,358,174 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katarina Witt View Post
What's your issue with "RESOLVE"? And just what kind of expertise do you have in this field anyway?

Doctors are not immune to confirmation bias, either, and this article seems to be based on one doctor's "observation".

"And though no recent data on women who conceive after adopting exists, the phenomenon doesn’t seem to be a total myth. So how and why are couples who thought they couldn't have kids getting pregnant?"

This: "“The truth is, many of the ‘infertile’ couples are really not infertile," says Dr. Ross. "Many couples seeking fertility treatment don’t necessarily need IVF to conceive." As assisted reproductive technologies becomes more mainstream, and women have children later in life (which can cause some anxiety around being able to get pregnant), couples are less hesitant to turn to IVF or adoption sooner in their quest to be parents, says Dr. Ross.

“More and more couples resort to IVF prematurely due to the fear of being infertile,” she says. “By definition, infertility means not being able to get pregnant after one year of trying to conceive, and 1 in 8 couples will have difficulty getting pregnant. However, anxious couples will seek out fertility treatment sooner than necessary in order to become pregnant; many don’t want to wait one full year of trying to conceive to look into fertility treatment options.”"
is pure bull****! And this BS about couples choosing to adopt instead of waiting longer to conceive is just ridiculous, in the true sense of the word, worthy of ridicule. It is extremely difficult to adopt here in the US, and foreign adoption keeps getting harder and harder.

IVF is not the first step in fertility treatment, it's usually the last.

See this: https://www.arcfertility.com/patient...ime-treatment/
I note this advice hasn't changed much in 40 years, either.
I'm not sure what all the hostility is about in your post.

I have a strong background in teen pregnancy, and taught childbirth for many years. I also have had a real interest in infertility and moderate an internet health forum that deals with both infertility and teenage pregnancy.

Resolve seems to come up when ever the phenomenon of adoption and then later pregnancies are brought up, and they are vehemently on the side that insists it isn't common.

It is.

Sometimes, you just have to look around you to notice how common it is. Of the 6 families I know very well who adopted, 5 of them have younger bio kids because while they were mysteriously infertile prior to adopting, they became fertile after adopting.
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Old 02-12-2019, 05:36 PM
 
8,577 posts, read 3,358,174 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgkeith View Post
RESOLVE is a very helpful organization. I called them in tears in my mid-twenties, when the ob/gyn who was the local "infertility expert" had me on ever increasing doses of Clomid, and added a shot of HCG. Basically, he didn't kinow what he was doing in my case. I felt really, really horrible. There was a new reproductive endocrinologist in town, and they told me about her. And they listened to me and were able to sympathize. It was a tremendous relief.
They do a lot of good, especially for women who have tried about everything and are unable to become pregnant or are unable to sustain a pregnancy.

One concern I have, at least for our local chapter, is that they aren't welcoming and celebrating when long term members actually do achieve a pregnancy. They are kicked out, and I don't think the term "shunned" is too strong a word.

It just seems to me that the leaders could have a meeting, say once every six months, for those who grew to love the organization and the members to celebrate births, and those members who are not yet pregnant obviously would probably not choose to attend those specially scheduled meetings, but MAYBE they would want to.

There's a feeling in that group, that when each member gets pregnant, that reduces the chances for the others, when that's not true. Successes getting pregnant are actually a HOPEFUL sign to other infertile women - it's not like there are just so many brass rings out there, and as each one gets taken that means the others have a lesser chance.
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Old 02-12-2019, 05:56 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
86,039 posts, read 100,903,502 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
I'm not sure what all the hostility is about in your post.

I have a strong background in teen pregnancy, and taught childbirth for many years. I also have had a real interest in infertility and moderate an internet health forum that deals with both infertility and teenage pregnancy.

Resolve seems to come up when ever the phenomenon of adoption and then later pregnancies are brought up, and they are vehemently on the side that insists it isn't common.

It is.

Sometimes, you just have to look around you to notice how common it is. Of the 6 families I know very well who adopted, 5 of them have younger bio kids because while they were mysteriously infertile prior to adopting, they became fertile after adopting.
Ah, the keyboard psychologists strike again!

A strong background in teen pregnancy has nothing to do with infertility. These aren't the women who cant get pregnant. Teaching childbirth, you were working with people who did get pregnant. I'm sort of curious about your educational background.

I know a number of people who adopted and never got pregnant. I could probably find at least as many as these five that you know who did. When I was trying to get pregnant, a coworker who was adopted herself kept telling me I'd get pregnant if we adopted. One time I asked her if her mother ever got pregnant. Want to know what the answer was?
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Old 02-12-2019, 06:09 PM
 
8,577 posts, read 3,358,174 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katarina Witt View Post
Ah, the keyboard psychologists strike again!

A strong background in teen pregnancy has nothing to do with infertility. These aren't the women who cant get pregnant. Teaching childbirth, you were working with people who did get pregnant. I'm sort of curious about your educational background.

I know a number of people who adopted and never got pregnant. I could probably find at least as many as these five that you know who did. When I was trying to get pregnant, a coworker who was adopted herself kept telling me I'd get pregnant if we adopted. One time I asked her if her mother ever got pregnant. Want to know what the answer was?
Katarina, although you are accusing me, and the doctors in the article I quoted as having confirmation bias, it really seems to me you're the one who has confirmation bias, and not only that, a lot of anger/hurt/grief that's causing you to reject what is the truth. And that truth is, that often when parents adopt, they soon become pregnant.

I don't specifically know what your life story is, but it feels to me that it really hurts you, somehow, to hear that this is a thing.

My educational background is in social work with a minor in psychology, actually.

Additionally, I belonged to a midwife group for several years although I"m not a midwife - they provided labor companions to women who entered the hospital with no supportive companion/friend/family member and I did that. That group was always invited to attend Resolve meetings, because of their experience with how to/how not to conceive and midwives have a calming presence and are usually positive, hopeful people.

I also have two sisters in law who had serious infertility issues, and one got pregnant and one never did, and I walked their walk them, as well as innumerable acquaintances who knew my background and would feel free to tell me the details of their infertility issues, and their daughter's infertility issues and treatments, etc.

So there's that.
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Old 02-12-2019, 06:22 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
86,039 posts, read 100,903,502 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClaraC View Post
Katarina, although you are accusing me, and the doctors in the article I quoted as having confirmation bias, it really seems to me you're the one who has confirmation bias, and not only that, a lot of anger/hurt/grief that's causing you to reject what is the truth. And that truth is, that often when parents adopt, they soon become pregnant.

I don't specifically know what your life story is, but it feels to me that it really hurts you, somehow, to hear that this is a thing.

My educational background is in social work with a minor in psychology, actually.

Additionally, I belonged to a midwife group for several years although I"m not a midwife - they provided labor companions to women who entered the hospital with no supportive companion/friend/family member and I did that. That group was always invited to attend Resolve meetings, because of their experience with how to/how not to conceive and midwives have a calming presence and are usually positive, hopeful people.

I also have two sisters in law who had serious infertility issues, and one got pregnant and one never did, and I walked their walk them, as well as innumerable acquaintances who knew my background and would feel free to tell me the details of their infertility issues, and their daughter's infertility issues and treatments, etc.

So there's that.
What's with this keyboard psychology of yours? You're a poor example of a psychology major, diagnosing people you don't know from a cake of soap!

You and the doctor you linked are the ones with confirmation bias. What little research there is says that it is not common for women to get pregnant after adoption, and it's a slap in the face to women going through infertility to imply that they're just "hyper women".
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Old 02-12-2019, 06:25 PM
 
8,577 posts, read 3,358,174 times
Reputation: 21963
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katarina Witt View Post
What's with this keyboard psychology of yours? You're a poor example of a psychology major, diagnosing people you don't know from a cake of soap!

You and the doctor you linked are the ones with confirmation bias. What little research there is says that it is not common for women to get pregnant after adoption, and it's a slap in the face to women going through infertility to imply that they're just "hyper women".
I wish you well, Katarina. It's never my goal to get in fights with people on the internet, and I can tell this is, for whatever reason, something that makes you really hurt and angry.

No one said anything about "hyper women", and I'm not even sure what hyperactivity (?) has to do with this discussion.

I won't respond again.
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