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OP: I'm a pretty sympathetic individual. I understand that people change their minds. But, I'm starting to lose it for you. You say you love this man, yet you don't trust him because he won't change his mind. Well, he was willing to try IVF even though the thought disgusted him. If it's against his religion, then it is. Almost every intelligent religious person I know does not accept all aspects of their faith blindly and 100%. Not all religious people go to their place of worship regularly. It doesn't mean their religion is not important to them. So, be thankful he was willing to go that far for you.
I bet he was thankful to be marrying an older women with 3 children outside of his faith and culture, because then he could be sure he wouldn't have to father a child himself. Not all people subscribe to all components of their culture, either. Just because this man will not do back flip after back flip after back flip for you does not mean that he does not love you and that he is using you. It sounds like he really loves you. Four years of marriage, step-parenting your 3 children, the acquiescence (twice) to IVF even though it disgusted him, and then the refusal to give up on you by moving out speak to that. It can't be pleasant to stay.
Anyway, at this point, you are most certainly making everyone's lives miserable by your drive to have a 4th child later in life. I think you're just looking for an out at this point. I pity your entire family, as you're way too old and too blessed with positive things to be causing such strife. You are also going to do what you want and think what you want, so I don't know why I even bothered.
It is always interesting how people respond to posts.
I think this is an unusual situation and the underlying issue may be the man's attitude toward her in general. She said she regretted entering into a 'contractual marriage' and mentions the Green Card again. He doesn't sound like 'Religion/Faith' means much to him and the fact that he used that as a reason against conceiving causes me to think he is 'very cold' and controlling.
I think 'He'/and his extended family are making her life miserable and she does need to get out of this.
The contractual marriage in this case is simply the agreement to no children. That's a pretty common agreement. Anyway, I do agree that if she is miserable and can't trust him, then staying together probably isn't for the best. Without trust, a marriage isn't much of anything. OP, have there been other signs that lead you to mistrust him?
The contractual marriage in this case is simply the agreement to no children. That's a pretty common agreement. Anyway, I do agree that if she is miserable and can't trust him, then staying together probably isn't for the best. Without trust, a marriage isn't much of anything. OP, have there been other signs that lead you to mistrust him?
Perhaps you are right about the 'contractual marriage'. I inferred that the poster doesn't feel 'equal'/accepted by her husband's family and is not 'of their culture'. Beyond that--I don't really understand this situation except that this marriage seems to be more of a business arrangement than anything and that may be where the OP's frustration lies. In one of the last posts it sounded like she was saying--'I've been naieve, A Fool, if you will.' It hurts, really hurts when you assess a relationship and can no longer deny that what you want 'doesn't matter much'.
I imagine he pretty much does as he pleases --as far as 'signs that would lead to distrust'.
Qatar1, if you are really concerned he was only after the Green Card, why on earth would you want to have a baby with him? The two of you seem to be on totally different pages. I think having a baby under these conditions would be unfair to the child. Perhaps you have misdirected your focus due to unhappiness in your relationship. Having a baby does not fix anything, it only will complicate the matter.
Qatar1, if you are really concerned he was only after the Green Card, why on earth would you want to have a baby with him? The two of you seem to be on totally different pages. I think having a baby under these conditions would be unfair to the child. Perhaps you have misdirected your focus due to unhappiness in your relationship. Having a baby does not fix anything, it only will complicate the matter.
Qatar1 can speak for herself but I imagine she is too upset to explain further.
She said:
--The husband's extended family asks frequently why she doesn't give her husband a child which is humiliating and would be a source of anger to me, since in reality the husband doesn't want a child, etc, etc
Someone else said:
--That having dealt with infertility issues she could relate to the intense feelings the OP had about 'her last chance' to conceive. Mourning the loss of that segment of her life and then it sounds like her husband's family/culture would really look down on her--a woman who could not bear children might have no status?
Qatar1 can speak for herself but I imagine she is too upset to explain further.
She said:
--The husband's extended family asks frequently why she doesn't give her husband a child which is humiliating and would be a source of anger to me, since in reality the husband doesn't want a child, etc, etc
Someone else said:
--That having dealt with infertility issues she could relate to the intense feelings the OP had about 'her last chance' to conceive. Mourning the loss of that segment of her life and then it sounds like her husband's family/culture would really look down on her--a woman who could not bear children might have no status?
Thanks, but I did read what she and the others have said.
You have asked for us to be brutally honest, I will try to be honest without being brutal.
I am sorry to be the one to say this to you, but I would not trust your husband either, as I can sense that although you obviously love him very much, you distrust him.
It is very curious that he did not want children from you in the first place. That is highly unusual both in his culture and his religion. Actually it is contrary to his religion and culture. And because it is totally against his religion/culture, it is very suspicious. I can see that you agreed to it probably because a. you already had kids, and b. you were so in love with him you did not realize how suspicious it was. And any other responders, unless you are an arab muslim male or closely acquainted with one, please don't try to dispute the fact that it is basically UNACCEPTABLE to be childless when married, except for the short time while you are trying to become pregnant, or for a certain period of time, after which you will definitely have a baby. Frankly, this is probably why you are wanting to have a baby so bad, you can see that in his culture, it is the next step for a properly functioning married couple to take, and the fact that he is unwilling to take this next step has you questioning the marriage. It is not so much that you want a baby, you are sensing that NOT having a baby is signaling a much deeper problem.
(I am aware of one couple, ages and backgrounds similar to yours, where the husband insisted that the wife have his baby, even though she was much older and her other pregnancies were nearly deadly. Against the wishes of her family, she did, and made it, but it nearly killed her. She will not have any more children, but at least having one has satisfied the husband)
So if I have it straight, you want to use a donor egg and his sperm to make a baby, except that he refuses to use his sperm because he says it is haram--prohibited-in his religion. Well, just so you know, there are many people that do in fact say that would be haram. there are very strict rules islamically about adoption, rules that are very different from those in the west. Children are supposed to know who their mother and father are, adopted kids are not even given the adopted parents names lest they mistake the fact that they are in fact not the blood children of their parents. So I can see where he might have a problem with the donor egg of unknown origin IF he is religious.
However, as you describe him, he has not been very religious in the past, so why he would have a problem with this is curious as well. I would not advise forcing a pregnancy with a donor egg and donor sperm on him. I am curious to know more of your situation to understand what is going on. You are threatening to divorce him and have the baby anyway. Will you stay in his country? How will you support yourself? Are you independently wealthy or something? Is he financially supporting your children now (the one's that aren't his)? I am not sure why you are making this threat if you are not able to back it up, unless you know that his family will accept the baby even if he doesn't. It's just not a good idea.
As for the family pressure, what you need to do is sit with the family and explain what is going on. Tell them that he said he would get married to you but you couldn't have children. Tell them he has told you that he doesn't want children and insists on wearing a condom. Frankly, although I am advising honesty and openness with the family, I would be careful about the part about you not being able to have any more kids. Unless they absolutely adore you, that might only make them lean toward asking him to divorce you or take a second wife.
Don't keep this all to yourself. Marriage is handled different in that culture. Not like in the US, where problems in a marriage are usually kept secret, or only shared with girlfriends for a shoulder to cry on or relief from having someone to talk about it with. In his culture, parents are involved. If there is a problem, the wife calls her parents, the husband calls his parents and they all step in and act like referees, getting the team in line. It is a completely different approach. So a little honesty with the parents in law may a.) get them off your back about the baby thing and b.)flush out your husband's true motivations.
I would strongly suggest that you do not have a baby until you resolve the issue of WHY he does not want to have a baby. Have you ever asked him, and if so has he answered your question? and if so, what was the answer? Forget about the fact that he told you up front. He needs to say why he doesn't want children. Because that is Haram itself. (not having children without a valid reason) If he cannot come up with a plausible explanation of WHY he does not want children, I would continue to be suspicious, and would most certainly not have a child with him or while married to him. If you do, you run the risk of finding out later why he didn't want it, divorce, problems getting the baby out of the country if the family/husband has grown attached to it, support issues, etc......
It is obvious that you love him, but you are obviously suspicious, and you need to explore that before making life-altering decisions that will not only affect you but the children that you currently have.
If you wish to discuss any of this further, please contact me in a direct message....I am very concerned about your situation and can tell that there is a lot going on here.
At 46 with 3 children already, why don't you just be satisfied with what you have already? Soon, grandchildren will come along and you will be able to enjoy them. Life is a series of chapters, I think you Chapter Babytime is over and you are on to the next chapter whether you like it or not.
I have read the thread, but am confused. You say you want the baby, because you love him so much...but then you say that you will leave and do it with donor egg and sperm. So he will be out of the picture.
I smell a troll. Please don't feed the trolls. I'll give a ring to the moderator of Parenting.
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