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Old 10-26-2011, 07:49 AM
 
86 posts, read 103,205 times
Reputation: 106

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Tim Tebows story doesnt impress me. He was highly recruited and has had his asz kissed all the way through! Tom Brady was 4th on depth charts and beat out an All_pro QB after he got injured. Even with all the money they paid Bledsoe, Brady owned him!


Here is a part from the greatest sports documentary Ive ever seen Brady 6!


This skinny, beanpole of a young man walked over to me and said, 'Hi, Mr. Kraft. I wanna introduce myself. I'm Tom Brady.' I said, 'I know who you are. You're our 6th round draft choice.' And I always remember, he looked me like a laser eye-to-eye, and he said, 'That's right, and I'm the best decision this organization has ever made.'"



The Year of the Quarterback: The Brady 6 (Part 2) [HD] - YouTube

Last edited by Oildog; 10-30-2011 at 04:52 PM..
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Old 10-26-2011, 09:06 AM
 
Location: Kansas City, MO
5,763 posts, read 9,751,348 times
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I wouldnt call him the best of all-time but it is certainly a great story.
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Old 10-28-2011, 05:44 PM
 
Location: Long Island,New York
8,163 posts, read 13,191,743 times
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Not the greatest of all time but maybe top 10-20 but in todays game he is one of the top 3 and 100% better than what i've seen from Tebow.
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Old 10-28-2011, 09:12 PM
 
Location: Southern Willamette Valley, Oregon
6,839 posts, read 7,900,925 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lancet71 View Post
Not the greatest of all time but maybe top 10-20 but in todays game he is one of the top 3 and 100% better than what i've seen from Tebow.
He has what.... 3 rings and a heartbeat away from a fourth?.... If he's in the top 10-20, I'd like you to name those who you think are above him.

And that's coming from a Bills fan.
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Old 10-29-2011, 08:35 AM
 
Location: Long Island,New York
8,163 posts, read 13,191,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ditchlights View Post
He has what.... 3 rings and a heartbeat away from a fourth?.... If he's in the top 10-20, I'd like you to name those who you think are above him.

And that's coming from a Bills fan.
Are you kidding? Rings don't necessarily make you a top QB. Is Trent Dilfer better than Dan Marino? Obviously not! The guy had and has a superior team in an unbalanced league. Off the top of my head without going back to the 60's and 70's i'd say (in no order)Elway,Marino,Young,Montana,Favre(who I think padded his numbers purposely to move himself up the list), Warren Moon (never gets proper credit). Now that's 6 guys from the 80's-90's(pretty much) that are better than him when the league was a little more balanced. Now if we go back to the 60's and 70's, do you think that there aren't at least 3 guys who were better? That would make 9 better and at worst put him at #10.
Don't forget that Big Ben has 2 rings and is a heartbeat away from a 3rd. So if he wins his 3rd this year, does that make him as good as Brady? I think he is a top QB in todays game but not an elite passer. He is strong and crafty but I definitely wouldn't put him up there and i'm a Steelers fan. Brady is probably the best in the last 5 or so years but not over history. I still stand by my ranking of him and place him in the top 10-20 range.
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Old 10-29-2011, 09:47 AM
 
Location: Southern Willamette Valley, Oregon
6,839 posts, read 7,900,925 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lancet71 View Post
Are you kidding? Rings don't necessarily make you a top QB. Is Trent Dilfer better than Dan Marino? Obviously not! The guy had and has a superior team in an unbalanced league. Off the top of my head without going back to the 60's and 70's i'd say (in no order)Elway,Marino,Young,Montana,Favre(who I think padded his numbers purposely to move himself up the list), Warren Moon (never gets proper credit). Now that's 6 guys from the 80's-90's(pretty much) that are better than him when the league was a little more balanced. Now if we go back to the 60's and 70's, do you think that there aren't at least 3 guys who were better? That would make 9 better and at worst put him at #10.
Don't forget that Big Ben has 2 rings and is a heartbeat away from a 3rd. So if he wins his 3rd this year, does that make him as good as Brady? I think he is a top QB in todays game but not an elite passer. He is strong and crafty but I definitely wouldn't put him up there and i'm a Steelers fan. Brady is probably the best in the last 5 or so years but not over history. I still stand by my ranking of him and place him in the top 10-20 range.
All valid points Lancet. I guess it is all based on opinion. Brady has the luxury of being surrounded by a very talented cast of players and a relentless coach, but he truly is clutch when he needs to be, and I think that separates him from the pack. Whenever I watch that offense, I don't think "Will they make this third down?". It's more like, "How many yards will they pick up after they pass the 1st down marker". Under Brady's leadership they are a machine.

Rating the best QB of all time is kinda like rating the best rock 'n roll bands of all time. There's a lot that goes into the considerations. Oh, I also agree 100% on the Moon comment as well.
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Old 10-29-2011, 05:26 PM
 
Location: Long Island,New York
8,163 posts, read 13,191,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ditchlights View Post
All valid points Lancet. I guess it is all based on opinion. Brady has the luxury of being surrounded by a very talented cast of players and a relentless coach, but he truly is clutch when he needs to be, and I think that separates him from the pack. Whenever I watch that offense, I don't think "Will they make this third down?". It's more like, "How many yards will they pick up after they pass the 1st down marker". Under Brady's leadership they are a machine.

Rating the best QB of all time is kinda like rating the best rock 'n roll bands of all time. There's a lot that goes into the considerations. Oh, I also agree 100% on the Moon comment as well.
I agree. Honestly I put him there based on serious considerations. Truthfully I don't think it's possible to pick #1. A top 3, top 10, etc...is much easier. In the last 5-10 years he might be the best over that timeframe though. Definitely solid!!!
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Old 10-29-2011, 06:15 PM
 
Location: The canyon (with my pistols and knife)
13,222 posts, read 17,969,169 times
Reputation: 14673
No player can be "the best ever" if they're still playing, as far as I'm concerned. He's the best active QB, but let's hold off on comparing him to the all-time greats until he joins them in retirement. You don't read a book and then proclaim it "epic" without reading the last five chapters, and you can't proclaim a cookie to be the most delicious you've ever had until after you've eaten it. An active QB is essentially a cookie that's still in the oven.
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Old 10-29-2011, 08:09 PM
 
Location: Here or There
3,961 posts, read 2,514,160 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gnutella View Post
No player can be "the best ever" if they're still playing, as far as I'm concerned. He's the best active QB, but let's hold off on comparing him to the all-time greats until he joins them in retirement. You don't read a book and then proclaim it "epic" without reading the last five chapters, and you can't proclaim a cookie to be the most delicious you've ever had until after you've eaten it. An active QB is essentially a cookie that's still in the oven.
Mmmm...cookie...

Oops, I mean, I agree.
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Old 10-30-2011, 01:52 PM
 
Location: Midwestern Dystopia
2,372 posts, read 3,060,664 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ditchlights View Post
He has what.... 3 rings and a heartbeat away from a fourth?.... If he's in the top 10-20, I'd like you to name those who you think are above him.

And that's coming from a Bills fan.
and that is really ironic that you are a bills fan. If Jim Kelly had won even 2 of those SB he'd at least be mentioned as a very good all-time-type QB, instead his name never even comes up, not even in top 20 discussions.

it is the SYSTEM !!!!!!!!

take Matt Cassel, he was also a seventh rounder, just like you-know-who

from Wiki:

According to ESPN research, he is the only known quarterback in NFL history to start an NFL game at quarterback without ever starting at quarterback in college. In February 2009, the Patriots used their franchise tag on Cassel, extending him a one-year contract worth over $14 million, the largest one-year contract for an offensive player in NFL history.
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not bad for a Seventh rounder, just like you-know-who
======================================


In the 2008 season opener against the Kansas City Chiefs, Cassel came under center when Brady suffered a torn ACL and MCL in the first quarter from a hit by Chiefs safety Bernard Pollard. Cassel led the Patriots to a 1710 victory, completing 13 of 18 passes for 152 yards and one touchdown; Cassel's drives accounted for all of New England's points.
The day after the game, the Patriots confirmed that Brady's serious injuries would sideline him for the rest of the season. Although the Patriots did bring veteran quarterbacks Chris Simms and Tim Rattay to Foxborough,[18] they signed neither, and kept Cassel as the starter.
Cassel made his first-ever start on Sunday, September 14, 2008, with a winning effort over the New York Jets, completing 16 of 23 passes for 165 yards; though he threw no touchdowns, he also threw no interceptions. ((something Tom Brady is always heralded for))



The Patriots' 1910 victory was the first time in six tries that a quarterback making his first NFL start defeated a team led by Brett Favre.[19]
Cassel was voted AFC Offensive Player of the Week for his Week 7 performance against the Denver Broncos on Monday Night Football. He had 183 passing yards and three touchdowns in a 417 rout, which made it his first three touchdown pass game.[20]
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again, this guy never started a game at QB in college and was a seventh rounder!!!!!!! 7th rounder, this is something all the TB fans love to keep shouting, so we have a SECOND 7th rounder, this one who never even started a game in college, doing great in the Patriot system.
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Cassel scored the second rushing touchdown of his career on a 13-yard touchdown in Week 10 against the Buffalo Bills. Cassel had zero touchdowns, but also zero interceptions, as he led the Patriots to a 2010 win; the Patriots held the ball in the game for over 37 minutes; the final 19-play drive, which lasted over 9 minutes, tied a franchise record for most plays in a single drive.
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he didn't throw one TD, but also didn't throw an INT and they still managed to score 20 pts. and dominate possession for 37 minutes , and tied a franchise record for most plays in a single drive, hmm... a 7th rounder who never even started a game in college.
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In the Patriots' 3431 overtime loss to the New York Jets, on November 13, 2008, Cassel led the Patriots on three consecutive scoring drives to bring them back from a 246 deficit with two minutes left in the first half, and threw a 16-yard touchdown to Randy Moss on 4th-and-1 with one second remaining to send the game into overtime. He finished 30-for-51 passing, with 400 yards, 3 touchdowns (and a pass for a two-point conversion), and no interceptions for a passer rating of 103.4, and 62 yards rushing on eight attempts. Cassel became the first Patriot to throw for 300 yards and rush for 50 yards in the same game, and the first player since at least the AFL-NFL merger to have 400 passing yards and 60 rushing yards in the same game.[21

Cassel completed 30 of 43 passes for 415 yards, three touchdowns to Randy Moss, and one interception, for a passer rating of 114.0; Cassel also had 14 yards on two rushes, including an 8-yard touchdown run. The performance made Cassel the first quarterback in franchise history, and only the fifth quarterback in NFL history, to have consecutive games with 400+ yards passing. His efforts earned him the title of AFC Offensive Player of the Week for the second time.[22]
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Nope , it ain't the system, no Way!!!!!
================================================== ======
In Week 15, against the Oakland Raiders, Cassel, playing just six days after the death of his father, set a new personal best, throwing for four touchdowns in the Patriots' 4926 rout.[23]
================================================== ====

too bad the media didn't hype the $%^& out of that one like they did Favre!
================================================== =====
In Week 16, against the playoff-bound Arizona Cardinals, Cassel led the Patriots to a 477 blowout win through snow, sleet, and rain in the Patriots' last regular-season home game of 2008. Cassel, playing in snow for the first time ever,[24] nevertheless completed 20 of 36 passes for 345 yards, three touchdowns, and no interceptions,while helping the Patriots remain in the hunt for the AFC East title.
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it's the System, there can be no doubt. Why hasn't it worked for him in KC? why isn't he the same QB there? what if Tom Brady was in KC rather than NE? Do you really think Tom Brady would have 3 rings as a Chief? Even one? No flipping way!

Trent Dilfer kicks Marino's A$$ too!!!!!!!

I'm sick of the Brady love, it's ridiculous, but we all know sports didn't start until 1979 with the birth of espn. (and actually prob. a little later like 1988 when espn was in more homes)

/sarcasm.

Brady's biggest attributes to the pro-Brady people
1. seventh rounder - how impressive for him, so was Cassel
2. wasn't particularly good college QB, neither was Cassel, heck he never even started, in fact that fact that Brady wasn't special in college actually says more about the NE System
3. doesn't throw INT's, great I agree, but Cassel didn't either stating for the Patriots
4. it's a dynasty, well, once was the tuck game and they shouldn't even have made that SB, and they won all of them by what, 2 or 3 pts. each! some on game winning KICKS, that's hardly a dynasty. If this happened in the seventies when you were all (mostly) just a gleam in mom and dad's eye you all wouldn't be so high on Brady. The sports media is so big today, so hype-driven, which is all for website hits and ratings, and the media is so powerful that people really overrate him.


PS: if anybody responds, I'd love for them to actually respond to the FACTS I've laid out and not just ''well, he got like tree rings so he better" arguments.
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