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Old 12-18-2018, 12:23 PM
 
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The Pats could finish the season 11-5 and with the #2 seed and a bye and a good chance in playing in the AFC championship. That to me is a successful year. Unless your expectation is to win the SB every year. That's not going to happen in this league.



You can't expect for the Pats to dominate the league every year and every Sunday.........if they make the AFC championship this year that would be the 8th AFC championships appearance in a row....no other franchise has done that.



If you are a Pats fan, you can't get hysterical by 1 game in a 16 game season........if the Pats get the #2 seed and a bye, they will be playing in the AFC Championship on the road or at home unless Brady gets hurt.
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Old 12-18-2018, 01:21 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellion1999 View Post
The Pats could finish the season 11-5 and with the #2 seed and a bye and a good chance in playing in the AFC championship. That to me is a successful year. Unless your expectation is to win the SB every year. That's not going to happen in this league.

You can't expect for the Pats to dominate the league every year and every Sunday.........if they make the AFC championship this year that would be the 8th AFC championships appearance in a row....no other franchise has done that.

If you are a Pats fan, you can't get hysterical by 1 game in a 16 game season........if the Pats get the #2 seed and a bye, they will be playing in the AFC Championship on the road or at home unless Brady gets hurt.
Not hysterical, but the 5 losses thus far are uncharacteristic for this era of the Patriots. The Pats playing this poorly in December is pretty much uncharted territory. Coaching is off, execution is off, the team is off. Not a good sign at all. I've been through the good and bad (fan since 1971 as previously stated). Very hard to turn it around this late in the season, especially when supposedly against the Steelers was the team being the healthiest almost all season.
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Old 12-18-2018, 01:55 PM
 
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Originally Posted by metalmancpa View Post
Not hysterical, but the 5 losses thus far are uncharacteristic for this era of the Patriots. The Pats playing this poorly in December is pretty much uncharted territory. Coaching is off, execution is off, the team is off. Not a good sign at all. I've been through the good and bad (fan since 1971 as previously stated). Very hard to turn it around this late in the season, especially when supposedly against the Steelers was the team being the healthiest almost all season.
so you believe if the Pats don't win the SB every year is a fail season? You know they have been in the SB 2 years in a row and making it for the 3rd time in a row is very hard, no team has done it since the 90's Bills when the AFC was weak back then. The Pats have been to the AFC championship 7 times in a row and in my opinion if they get the #2 seed and a bye they have a good chance making the 8th AFC championship appearance in a row.

My take on the Steelers game is that it was a do or die game for the Steelers @ home and after losing 3 in a row and getting beat for years by the Patriots they were going to respond and they did. You can't beat a good team over and over and over and be surprised they respond when their season is on the line in front of their crowd. I knew when the Steelers lost their 3rd in a row against the Raiders that the Patriots chances were bad because the Steelers were going to respond to save their season at home and they did. It was a playoff game for the Steelers not for the Patriots........plus, the Patriots rather have the Steelers in the playoffs than the Ravens, in my opinion. Ravens have a better defense and running game than the Steelers.

Any team would have lost to the Steelers under the same scenario last Sunday. That's why I don't make too much out of that game.

Usually, when a team makes the SB (win or lose) they don't make the playoffs the next season and a few that do don't make it pass the 1st round. Pats made the SB the last 2 years and if they take the #2 seed and a bye, they will play in the AFC Championship game in my opinion based on the scenario that I posted before.
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Old 12-18-2018, 03:49 PM
 
Location: The State Line
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Hellion, thanks for your honest opinion. It means a lot coming from a Steelers fan, and I do agree fans shouldnít be overly surprised. I know the Patriots know the Steelers well, but I wasnít expecting the Steelers to roll over and die with much on the line.

I can understand why fans of other teams think Patriotsí fans are like teens that are used to getting everything handed to them: complaining if their new car (mom and dad paid for) doesnít have leather seats or isnít sporty enough while others are driving around in their parents older car, a cheap cash car or still donít even have a car. It puts things in perspective when they realize whatís actually reality.

Itís not really a given to make the playoffs year after year. This would be the 10th straight playoff season for the Patriots, but no one has ever done that before. Most teams are in and out and miss years in between, or can only string together a few successful seasons.

While there are fans that werenít around for the ďbadĒ years or donít remember them, and think the sky is falling, not everyone takes this run for granted.
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Old 12-18-2018, 04:13 PM
 
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Originally Posted by murksiderock View Post
Brady is losing it. I saw him overthrow his target three straight times to close that game. This is on top of watching him overthrow guys earlier in the game, and watching him attempt to throw the ball away, but not have the strength to get it outta bounds and threw the pick to Haden instead...

This entire season is on tape to show Brady is clearly slipping. Still better than most of the rest, and he isn't having the sharp drop the Manning brothers had, but this can't be denied anymore. This is an entire season worth of evidence. Never been an entire year of evidence to point to before...

I'm not focused on this year, clearly this team isn't good enough to win a championship this year. My concern for NE is they have no succession plan at QB. They need one and they need one fast. Brady showed obvious signs of slow deterioration in 2018. This is not gonna magically reverse itself in 2019. I know guys are gonna say "we've heard this before" but again, I'd say yeah, people piled on for years if Tom had a bad game or two and called it the end. This isn't a bad game or two anymore. The pocket awareness and arm have been glaringly on display as being in decline this entire season. This is a first for Tom Brady. He'll be 42 next year and going into Year 20, the organization better start preparing for the future, because next year could bring the end closer at an accelerated pace...
Brady is "off" this year and there a lot of reasons for it but you didn't see him "overthrow his target 3 straight times to close that game" because it didn't happen....there wasn't a play to be had where he threw the ball the last 3 times

The last throw had no chance where he threw but if he had stepped up in the pocket he had Patterson wide open...

He also didn't see a wide open James White the play before for a dump off that would have gotten at least a first down if not a TD....

There is nothing wrong with Brady's arm strength but his decision making has been off all year and he is starting to show a tendency at times to "chuck and duck" like that last throw...

I also did not see many overthrows early in the game....if you REALLY want to see overthrows throw in some tape of Aaron Rodgers this season....HE is losing it.

Not every QB plays great into their late 30's the way Brees and Brady and for a time Manning did....

I think it is amazing that the media is so focused on Brady "losing it" they may be missing the real story, I think Aaron Rodgers is showing more signs of decline than Brady...and much more sharply if you look at the stats

Rodgers completion percentage is historically low for him, yeah he hasn't thrown many picks but that's because he has been afraid to take chances. PFF has him rated LAST in the NFL among QB's for bad throws/missed throws.

He is also leading the league in throw aways by a LARGE margin. Yet I see the pro football experts still listing Rodgers as a top 5 QB this year when he has been anything but....

The Pats are in trouble no doubt, short and long term for sure.

I think Brady plays 1 more season, he almost has to as there is currently no QB on the roster to take his spot.

The bigger issue is how old and slow the defense has become....that run defense is historically bad right now.

All that being said to say "this team clearly isn't good enough to win a championship this year" is farcical....

There is not a single dominant team in the NFL this year, not in the AFC or NFC....

The early season darlings like the Saints, Rams and Chiefs are all showing they have warts as well and spare me "they can't beat the Chargers".....the Pats beat the Chiefs this season when KC was at full strength and DOMINATING the league...Chargers are still eking out games.

I'm not counting on the Pats winning a SB this year but stranger things have happened...they could just as easily go out in the first round.

Only thing certain in the NFL this season is that ANY team can win on any given Sunday and any team can also lose on a given Sunday
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Old 12-18-2018, 07:59 PM
 
6,446 posts, read 3,453,370 times
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Originally Posted by Hellion1999 View Post
so you believe if the Pats don't win the SB every year is a fail season? You know they have been in the SB 2 years in a row and making it for the 3rd time in a row is very hard, no team has done it since the 90's Bills when the AFC was weak back then. The Pats have been to the AFC championship 7 times in a row and in my opinion if they get the #2 seed and a bye they have a good chance making the 8th AFC championship appearance in a row.

My take on the Steelers game is that it was a do or die game for the Steelers @ home and after losing 3 in a row and getting beat for years by the Patriots they were going to respond and they did. You can't beat a good team over and over and over and be surprised they respond when their season is on the line in front of their crowd. I knew when the Steelers lost their 3rd in a row against the Raiders that the Patriots chances were bad because the Steelers were going to respond to save their season at home and they did. It was a playoff game for the Steelers not for the Patriots........plus, the Patriots rather have the Steelers in the playoffs than the Ravens, in my opinion. Ravens have a better defense and running game than the Steelers.

Any team would have lost to the Steelers under the same scenario last Sunday. That's why I don't make too much out of that game.

Usually, when a team makes the SB (win or lose) they don't make the playoffs the next season and a few that do don't make it pass the 1st round. Pats made the SB the last 2 years and if they take the #2 seed and a bye, they will play in the AFC Championship game in my opinion based on the scenario that I posted before.
I never mentioned anything about the Super Bowl. I have commented based on the 14 games played to date. You can say what you want about the Steelers game. For one, that loss followed a December loss to Miami. I suppose that excuse is the Pats always have a tough time down south.

The Steelers are not that good either. They sucked a little less this past Sunday then the Pats did. The past is simply a very high benchmark for this team until it settles down to earth and begins to rebuild, a time coming soon (who knows when). A 3-5 record on the road facing playoffs playing on the road isn't good for any team.

I will objectively say it again. This years Patriots team is mediocre together. Forget individual talent. From coaching to the players, there are lots of kinks that we simply haven't seen in a long time. It's frustrating, and nothing wrong about saying that. Problem is too many people (yourself maybe?) equate criticism to jumping off a ledge. I don't see it that way, at least from my own eyes. I will not hide my criticism.
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Old 12-19-2018, 12:39 AM
 
11,057 posts, read 3,756,162 times
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Originally Posted by metalmancpa View Post
I never mentioned anything about the Super Bowl. I have commented based on the 14 games played to date. You can say what you want about the Steelers game. For one, that loss followed a December loss to Miami. I suppose that excuse is the Pats always have a tough time down south.

The Steelers are not that good either. They sucked a little less this past Sunday then the Pats did. The past is simply a very high benchmark for this team until it settles down to earth and begins to rebuild, a time coming soon (who knows when). A 3-5 record on the road facing playoffs playing on the road isn't good for any team.

I will objectively say it again. This years Patriots team is mediocre together. Forget individual talent. From coaching to the players, there are lots of kinks that we simply haven't seen in a long time. It's frustrating, and nothing wrong about saying that. Problem is too many people (yourself maybe?) equate criticism to jumping off a ledge. I don't see it that way, at least from my own eyes. I will not hide my criticism.



so let me get this straight, if the Patriots finish 11-5, win the division for 10th in a row, get the #2 seed, gets a bye and makes it to the AFC Championship game (8th in a row) you call that a mediocre team? LOL



by the way, you know that the Pats have lost @ Miami 5 times in the last 6 years. Last year the Pats lost @ Miami 20-27 and still Pats made it to the SB . Every division is that way, every team has that team in the division that gives them a fight and generally split the season, that's why its call division rivals, they know each other well. You think if the Pats don't sweep every team in their division every year is a mediocre year? the goal of every team is to win their division which the Pats have done for the 10th year in a row......the next goal is to win their last 2 games and get a bye and a home playoff game which they have been undefeated to make it the AFC championship game.......Once they get to the AFC championship game, win or lose, I hardly call that a mediocre team.
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Old 12-19-2018, 05:29 AM
 
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In the last 6 games 3-3, .500. Playing like a mediocre team. Not sure why you are so afraid to criticise.
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Old 12-19-2018, 09:08 AM
 
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Originally Posted by metalmancpa View Post
In the last 6 games 3-3, .500. Playing like a mediocre team. Not sure why you are so afraid to criticise.
I'm afraid? LOL.....No, I think you get hysterical by just 2 games that the PATS lost on the road in very close games. Pats are fine.......if you thought the Pats were going to blow everybody this season and finish 16-0, 15-1 or 14-2 and keep beating the Steelers over and over every year and that the Steelers wouldn't respond with their season on the line at home then you are naive.


By the way, the Pats are the ONLY team undefeated at home in the NFL something you ignore......that means if they get the #2 seed and a bye, there is a strong possibility they make the AFC championship game. That means the only team they have to go on the road in the playoffs is against Kansas City if the Chiefs makes it that far and even the Chiefs are vulnerable at home.......see how is not all bad for the PATS like you put it.

you take 1 portion of the season and ignore the whole season and record as a whole and the playoff spot and then label teams "mediocre". My issue with you is not your "criticism" of the Pats, every team has their holes and are inconsistent. My issue with you it's your use of the word "mediocre"

In the last 6 games, Rams are 3-3, .500. Are they a mediocre team? won the division and have the #2 seed.


Bears were 3-3 , .500 in their first 6 games. Are they mediocre team? won the division and have the #3 seed. (Pats beat the Bears in Chicago, when no other team has) so I guess both teams according to you are mediocre.

if the Pats finish 11-5, wins the division (10th time in a row), takes the #2 seed and a bye and makes it to the AFC championship game (8th in a row) I hardly call that a "mediocre" team? I call that a historic run which the Pats have been for over 8 years.

Last edited by Hellion1999; 12-19-2018 at 09:24 AM..
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Old 12-19-2018, 03:11 PM
 
6,446 posts, read 3,453,370 times
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Originally Posted by Hellion1999 View Post
I'm afraid? LOL.....No, I think you get hysterical by just 2 games that the PATS lost on the road in very close games. Pats are fine.......if you thought the Pats were going to blow everybody this season and finish 16-0, 15-1 or 14-2 and keep beating the Steelers over and over every year and that the Steelers wouldn't respond with their season on the line at home then you are naive.


By the way, the Pats are the ONLY team undefeated at home in the NFL something you ignore......that means if they get the #2 seed and a bye, there is a strong possibility they make the AFC championship game. That means the only team they have to go on the road in the playoffs is against Kansas City if the Chiefs makes it that far and even the Chiefs are vulnerable at home.......see how is not all bad for the PATS like you put it.

you take 1 portion of the season and ignore the whole season and record as a whole and the playoff spot and then label teams "mediocre". My issue with you is not your "criticism" of the Pats, every team has their holes and are inconsistent. My issue with you it's your use of the word "mediocre"

In the last 6 games, Rams are 3-3, .500. Are they a mediocre team? won the division and have the #2 seed.


Bears were 3-3 , .500 in their first 6 games. Are they mediocre team? won the division and have the #3 seed. (Pats beat the Bears in Chicago, when no other team has) so I guess both teams according to you are mediocre.

if the Pats finish 11-5, wins the division (10th time in a row), takes the #2 seed and a bye and makes it to the AFC championship game (8th in a row) I hardly call that a "mediocre" team? I call that a historic run which the Pats have been for over 8 years.
Let's agree to disagree and move on.

On To the Bills.
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