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Old 11-06-2013, 05:52 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
13,343 posts, read 17,487,056 times
Reputation: 19655

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Anyone listen to the Philbin presser? I don't get it ... if there was no problems in the locker room and between Martin-Incognito then why was Incognito suspended? What was the conduct that was detrimental to the team?

If Riley Cooper caught flak from his African American teammates for his use of a racial slur (to a stranger, even), why are the Dolphins' African American players defending Incognito when he used the same word against one of their own teammates?
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Old 11-06-2013, 05:54 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
13,343 posts, read 17,487,056 times
Reputation: 19655
Quote:
Originally Posted by dnvrsoul View Post
When I first heard about this story I thought....god what a pu%%y Martin is...but I have had a change of heart...

As someone who has watched a coworker get sexually harrassed /bullied, it sucks...a person can't just go to his/her supervisor (or in this case coach) because of:
#1-Afraid of retaliation, once the coach talks to the player(s) involved, well it is all over..the bullying will be worse
#2-Afraid you will not have a job..once it gets out you are a rat...well you may not be able to play ever again
#3 Risk being even more alienated..

Martin may be a man but we don't know how widespread the bullying was...maybe he has never seen anyone act like this-honestly, I believe the whole organization was in on it...and Martin felt like he didn't have anyone to turn to.
I also have heard sports analysts say "well why didn't anyone help him." Trust me, when you are in a situation where your livelihood is at stake...a lot of people do not want to get involved-I've seen it once at an old job-someone was getting bullied, sexually harrassed, and down right abused-NO ONE got involved...why? Because everyone needed their jobs
I think a lot of people in Miami are going to lose their jobs.
I agree. It's similar (but obviously not exactly the same) as blaming a wife for not leaving her abusive husband.
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Old 11-06-2013, 06:31 PM
 
4,749 posts, read 3,622,547 times
Reputation: 3225
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaypee View Post
Anyone listen to the Philbin presser? I don't get it ... if there was no problems in the locker room and between Martin-Incognito then why was Incognito suspended? What was the conduct that was detrimental to the team?

If Riley Cooper caught flak from his African American teammates for his use of a racial slur (to a stranger, even), why are the Dolphins' African American players defending Incognito when he used the same word against one of their own teammates?
There could be several reasons why. Riley Cooper was never given permission to use the term by his teammates; he was drunk and threatening to kick some black guy's @ss. I think the players have moved on to some degree and the shock has probably worn off.

In the case of Incognito, it might be that some of his black teammates knew what was goin' on and just didn't see it as a racist comment. If Martin's only half black, then maybe the black players don't really identify with him, especially if they think he's an elitist child of Ivy League parents. Lots of possible ways to spin this and only the people closely involved really know all the details.

I don't think that's really material, though. The problem is that there's some serious dysfunction in that locker room, and really, it's probably an organizational problem, not just a locker room issue.

Contrary to what people might think based on previous comments, I don't think that Martin is helpless. I'm not necessarily sure he handled the situation as well as he could have. There probably is another side to it, but I'm not really all that interested in hearing it. The bottom line is, that kind of torment goes beyond just bullying; it's borderline psychotic. It crosses all kinds of boundaries. Martin could not have won in that situation other than to just roll over and become someone he obviously felt like he didn't want to become. He chose to escape the situation. Might not have been the most macho move, but I'm guessing he'd probably thought it through. Honestly, if he never plays another down, I get the feeling he'd be okay with that. He's got a brain. He can do other things. I'm sure he'd like another shot if he's offered one, though.
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Old 11-07-2013, 12:28 AM
 
Location: Houston, TX
17,032 posts, read 26,950,457 times
Reputation: 16190
Quote:
Originally Posted by dnvrsoul View Post
When I first heard about this story I thought....god what a pu%%y Martin is...but I have had a change of heart...

As someone who has watched a coworker get sexually harrassed /bullied, it sucks...a person can't just go to his/her supervisor (or in this case coach) because of:
#1-Afraid of retaliation, once the coach talks to the player(s) involved, well it is all over..the bullying will be worse
#2-Afraid you will not have a job..once it gets out you are a rat...well you may not be able to play ever again
#3 Risk being even more alienated..

Martin may be a man but we don't know how widespread the bullying was...maybe he has never seen anyone act like this-honestly, I believe the whole organization was in on it...and Martin felt like he didn't have anyone to turn to.
I also have heard sports analysts say "well why didn't anyone help him." Trust me, when you are in a situation where your livelihood is at stake...a lot of people do not want to get involved-I've seen it once at an old job-someone was getting bullied, sexually harrassed, and down right abused-NO ONE got involved...why? Because everyone needed their jobs
I think a lot of people in Miami are going to lose their jobs.
Probably right. The NFL is a huge macho league and I blame both. Do you really need to punch out teammate to get respect now? Seems that's what the Dolphins wanted. This mentality makes it seem that 'bullying' is okay. An O lineman is not a small guy and can likely handle himself... but confidence may be an issue. Unfortunately a smart soft spoken guy or any soft spoken guy is a subject to bullys UNLESS they can shut him up...which is wrong but I believe its true. Bullies have long been part of society but shutting them up (beating them down) is the most effective way to deal with it and not everyone is wired that way.
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Old 11-07-2013, 04:16 AM
 
Location: :~)
1,483 posts, read 2,924,592 times
Reputation: 1519
Default What!

We have smart people on CD so I am shocked at the responses. How much more evidence do we need to prove that bullying is bad. We have victims who go crazy shooting up schools and work places. Bullying is bad. Then requiring the victim to physically engage the bully is not the right answer. Leadership must stand up and correct the bully. The Victim, i agree is weak minded but he has god given right to accepted in society without silly bullying.
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Old 11-07-2013, 04:34 AM
 
20,976 posts, read 16,324,991 times
Reputation: 10270
Quote:
Originally Posted by redd1skng View Post
SMH, I don't understand the criticism of Martin either. HE put up with it for a year and a half. Walking away from a situation that could have turned violent and HE gets criticized. Incognito clearly went too far; which he has a history of doing.

And shame on the Dolphins organization for denying and trying to distance themselves in fear of a hefty lawsuit. Classless losers from top to bottom.

Can only imagine what's to come. Maybe the next bullied athlete will just bust a cap in all of them.
Using a gun IS being a coward.

Here's another story.....my son was being bullied by two other kids when he was in the 4th grade.

One morning, I took my son up to the two bullies and told them to drop their bags and that they were going to fight my son one on one.

They both broke down in tears.

I explained to them that I gave my son permission to hit them in the face if they ever bother him again.

It ended then and there. He never had another problem with bullying because he realized then and there that most bullies are cowards.
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Old 11-07-2013, 05:11 AM
 
10,698 posts, read 11,726,774 times
Reputation: 6048
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbub22 View Post
We have smart people on CD so I am shocked at the responses. How much more evidence do we need to prove that bullying is bad. We have victims who go crazy shooting up schools and work places. Bullying is bad. Then requiring the victim to physically engage the bully is not the right answer. Leadership must stand up and correct the bully. The Victim, i agree is weak minded but he has god given right to accepted in society without silly bullying.
Nobody needs proof that harassment is bad (I REFUSE TO USE AN INFANTILE WORD LIKE "BULLYING", WHEN TALKING ABOUT A GROWN MAN). What I have a problem with is how Martin did not deal with it. Both of these guy deserve criticism.
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Old 11-07-2013, 07:55 AM
 
880 posts, read 1,761,077 times
Reputation: 624
This is a setup by Martins mother and father both Harvard educated lawyers.They will sue the Dolphins,NFL Incognito.They planted the first seed by sending him for a mental checkup.
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Old 11-07-2013, 08:36 AM
 
922 posts, read 1,030,516 times
Reputation: 1768
Quote:
Originally Posted by redd1skng
SMH, I don't understand the criticism of Martin either. HE put up with it for a year and a half. Walking away from a situation that could have turned violent and HE gets criticized. Incognito clearly went too far; which he has a history of doing.

And shame on the Dolphins organization for denying and trying to distance themselves in fear of a hefty lawsuit. Classless losers from top to bottom.

Can only imagine what's to come. Maybe the next bullied athlete will just bust a cap in all of them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by alphamale View Post
Using a gun IS being a coward.

Here's another story.....my son was being bullied by two other kids when he was in the 4th grade.

One morning, I took my son up to the two bullies and told them to drop their bags and that they were going to fight my son one on one.

They both broke down in tears.

I explained to them that I gave my son permission to hit them in the face if they ever bother him again.

It ended then and there. He never had another problem with bullying because he realized then and there that most bullies are cowards.
This is a room full of testosterone, PH using, gun owning grown men; not 4th graders.

Bullying, harrassing, ostracizing, humiliating, terrorizing, IS the cowardly behavior.

J. Martin is not only soft spoken and non-confrontational he WAS the smartest man in the room. Instead of escalating the situation with fists he will WIN this battle in a court of law when his highly educated legally experienced family sues the heck out of the Miami Dolphins and the NFL.
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Old 11-07-2013, 08:38 AM
 
922 posts, read 1,030,516 times
Reputation: 1768
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevej64 View Post
This is a setup by Martins mother and father both Harvard educated lawyers.They will sue the Dolphins,NFL Incognito.They planted the first seed by sending him for a mental checkup.
Exactly.
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