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Old 05-19-2015, 02:15 AM
 
2,495 posts, read 3,631,252 times
Reputation: 4851

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Floorist View Post
The Broncos have cheated at least twice, the Browns have cheated, the Saints have cheated, The Steelers have cheated, these are just the ones off the top of my head that have been caught.
Yeah yeah yeah, so that makes it okay for the Patriots to cheat.
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Old 05-19-2015, 05:18 AM
 
6,438 posts, read 3,450,877 times
Reputation: 10199
Quote:
Originally Posted by Percentage View Post
Lol some teams play by the rules...that your team has a culture of cheating and getting caught, does not mean the rest of the league cheats.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Percentage View Post
Lol the good ole tactics of placing the Onus of proof on the other person. Nah, the Pats are in the news for a reason and this is not their first or second rodeo. Cheats!!!
You used a word I have before, culture. I think you are most definitely missing the bigger picture and larger issue. The culture doesn't exist within the locker room of one team - it exists in the NFL, and has for a very long time. Now the NFL want to play judge, jury, and executioner to prove a point they are bigger than the game and can control it, or to my eyes over control it. This most recent penalty is a loud message of Goodell and the NFL saying "we're the bosses", and in large part it's driven by money and the fans who pay the bills.

As other have stated, many other teams have violated the rules, but in the court of public opinion they aren't necessarily called cheaters as angrily as the Patriots are because none of those other teams have such a storied history of winning and being at the top. So those fans assume it just has to be because of cheating because they've been fined twice.

You say the Pats are in the news for a reason. Since you've already been spoon fed the reasons by the media, please re-iterate those reason for the rest of us.
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Old 05-19-2015, 06:57 AM
 
Location: Atlanta
5,628 posts, read 4,219,691 times
Reputation: 4582
Quote:
Originally Posted by metalmancpa View Post
I hear you, but this argument falls mostly on deaf ears. I'm a happy Patriots fan used to the hate and name calling. That's OK, because the last 14 years have been something to behold, the longest running dynasty in NFL history. My team, and proud.

If I am to say something to the non-Patriot fans - we win because we cheat better than your team does.
I am gonna take this in a different direction, if only to add some deflection but the Patriots do NOT have the longest running dynasty in NFL history.. Not if you simply look at sustained greatness over a period of time. The Patriots have a legitimate argument as the greatest dynasty (the Packers, Steelers, 49ers, Cowboys do as well), but they don't have the LONGEST running dynasty in NFL history.. not by my scorecard..

From 1966 until 1985, the Cowboys had ZERO losing seasons, made the playoffs 18 of those 20 seasons, played in 12 conference championship games and 5 Super Bowls. You can say the Patriots dynasty of today was greater than that Cowboys dynasty and i might be temped to agree with you but it certainly was not longer.. NOT YET anyway. Keep in mind that Tom Landry made that run with 4 different Quarterbacks..each one taking them to conference championships with only Morton and Staubach taking them to the Super Bowl and of course, only Staubach was able to win the Super Bowl.

Using my math, the Pats are 7 years shy of surpassing the Cowboys dynasty and will have to make the playoffs each of those years or at least have a winning record to eclipse the Cowboys dynasty. I don't think Brady has 6 more seasons left and that's when we get to really find out how good Belichick is. I certainly think he is the best coach in the game today but he has never won without Brady... so it will be interesting to see if he can.. i think he can but i am not sure he will be able to win consistently at this level without arguable the best QB in the game..
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Old 05-19-2015, 10:31 AM
 
9,574 posts, read 4,586,750 times
Reputation: 5444
Quote:
Originally Posted by Percentage View Post
Yeah yeah yeah, so that makes it okay for the Patriots to cheat.
It means that they are all equal cheats. And I forgot the Cowboys, Jimmy Johnson admitted that they did illegal taping but just didn't get caught.
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Old 05-19-2015, 11:16 AM
 
Location: Delray Beach
1,136 posts, read 1,438,465 times
Reputation: 2510
[quote=tjarado;39627823]....

That the management of the team does not see that their behavior in the aftermath is worse than the actual offense shows that they know football, but not much else.

If they pursue lengthy appeals it would likely only make matters worse.
Who knows what other dirt lies under the rug, or which 'deflator' has had enough and spills his guts?[/quote]

YUP.
They came to their senses.
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Old 05-19-2015, 11:17 AM
 
6,438 posts, read 3,450,877 times
Reputation: 10199
Kraft just made a speech. If anyone thinks he as an owner is anything less than a stand up and honest human being then you are a blind and hateful. He has proven his greatness as an owner bringing a franchise to the top.

Kraft believes in the NFL and how Goodell (commissioner) has the power to do what he should. As a team he is accepting the penalties. You may think he is hiding behind guilt and that I feel is entirely wrong. He just wants this craziness to stop.

So now, it's only Brady's appeal that's on the table.
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Old 05-19-2015, 03:31 PM
 
6,438 posts, read 3,450,877 times
Reputation: 10199
Quote:
Originally Posted by metalmancpa View Post
Kraft just made a speech. If anyone thinks he as an owner is anything less than a stand up and honest human being then you are a blind and hateful. He has proven his greatness as an owner bringing a franchise to the top.

Kraft believes in the NFL and how Goodell (commissioner) has the power to do what he should. As a team he is accepting the penalties. You may think he is hiding behind guilt and that I feel is entirely wrong. He just wants this craziness to stop.

So now, it's only Brady's appeal that's on the table.
I was thinking about how to respond to Bob Kraft reluctantly taking the $1mil penalty and loss of draft picks as handed down by Goodell/NFL for in essence is for the league and owners and agreeing to how the NFL is run. Above was just my initial thought.

Kraft, Tom Brady, and the New England Patriots had a chance to do something here, assuming in fact they are as they say innocent (which I believe - I do not believe malicious intent to circumvent the rules). They could have used the Wells report as fuel, and expose the NFL for it's issues. What has become the biggest issue with our beloved Patriots is they are now seen as those dreaded Evil Empire Yankees of the NFL. With winning comes the target, and what builds legacies is the Court of Public Opinion. I first though Kraft was doing the right thing for the betterment of the league. But then I had second thoughts.

The court may now see this as the Patriots not fighting because of fear of uncovering dirty laundry. The label of cheating seems now stamped in the lore of the Brady/Belichick era, and I find it totally unjustified. SpyGate was entirely overblown, and now DeflateGate.

This whole issue has been handled poorly by both sides, fueled by naive fans and hypocritical players who refuse to believe a culture exists in the NFL. That culture is now called cheating where it used to be called a competitive advantage. The NFL has assisted the fan to cry in outrage due to the recent slew of penalties doled out, this most recent one the largest in league history, for an accusation of something that is so minimal in the big picture of the game. Fans equate the penalty with the crime, so being the largest this must be the worst cheat in history. And now Kraft has allowed it to be etched in stone.

If the Patriots and Brady believe in their innocence, why back down? I am a disappointed Patriots fan.
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Old 05-20-2015, 12:50 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
1,753 posts, read 1,934,395 times
Reputation: 1875
Quote:
Originally Posted by metalmancpa View Post
Kraft just made a speech. If anyone thinks he as an owner is anything less than a stand up and honest human being then you are a blind and hateful. He has proven his greatness as an owner bringing a franchise to the top.

Kraft believes in the NFL and how Goodell (commissioner) has the power to do what he should. As a team he is accepting the penalties. You may think he is hiding behind guilt and that I feel is entirely wrong. He just wants this craziness to stop.

So now, it's only Brady's appeal that's on the table.

Well, Mr. Kraft abundantly added to the 'craziness' with his huff-puff-bluff defiance and huge 'denial report' last week (after initially saying he would accept ANY punishment).

So now, after all, Kraft folds. I have to wonder what went down behind closed doors. Perhaps there was some absolute dirt there somewhere that they didn't want to come out.
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Old 05-21-2015, 04:17 AM
 
6,438 posts, read 3,450,877 times
Reputation: 10199
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fatty MacButter View Post
Well, Mr. Kraft abundantly added to the 'craziness' with his huff-puff-bluff defiance and huge 'denial report' last week (after initially saying he would accept ANY punishment).

So now, after all, Kraft folds. I have to wonder what went down behind closed doors. Perhaps there was some absolute dirt there somewhere that they didn't want to come out.
And sadly (IMO), with what Goodell said at the owners meeting, it's like we're right back where we started from assuming he and Kraft "love" each other. All involved continue to muck this up. Now, only waiting to see what Brady says (if he says anything without his agent).
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Old 05-21-2015, 06:19 AM
 
Location: Hiding from Antifa?
6,394 posts, read 4,170,610 times
Reputation: 5695
Quote:
Originally Posted by Floorist View Post
NFL finds Patriots employees probably deflated balls


So, nothing but maybes. Everyone deserves more than that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Floorist View Post
The Broncos have cheated at least twice, the Browns have cheated, the Saints have cheated, The Steelers have cheated, these are just the ones off the top of my head that have been caught.
You not only failed to show proof, you didn't even state what the cheating was by those other teams. Like a loyal Pats fan would say, "it didn't happen, then".
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