U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Sports > Pro Football
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 01-22-2019, 05:29 AM
 
4,979 posts, read 11,042,177 times
Reputation: 11808

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by murksiderock View Post
This post makes sense and you have a convincing argument that the Patriots aren't the most dominant dynasty of all time...

However, the length of their dynasty is what puts then on another level. Since 2001, they've never gone more than four years without playing in a Super Bowl. 9 trips in 18 years. That's a different model of consistency than anyone could fathom...

But again, I do think it's a fair point to challenge how dominant they've been relative to other dynasties...
It would then be a fair point to challenge whether any of the previously stated dynasties would have even existed in a salary cap era designed to prevent dynasties from ever occurring...

What the Patriots have accomplished throughout the past 18 years with an ever changing cast of characters is far more impressive than what the Cowboys and 49ers accomplished and is unlikely to ever be duplicated

This same flawed argument that was once used to "prove" Montana was better than Brady has also already been called out.....the 49ers and Cowboys may have won their Super Bowls in more dominating fashion but they didn't make it to anywhere near as many Super Bowls either. So they get a pass for losing sooner in the playoffs during their non Super Bowl years????
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 01-22-2019, 06:35 AM
 
Location: Virginia Beach
4,209 posts, read 2,823,898 times
Reputation: 4493
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluedevilz View Post
It would then be a fair point to challenge whether any of the previously stated dynasties would have even existed in a salary cap era designed to prevent dynasties from ever occurring...

What the Patriots have accomplished throughout the past 18 years with an ever changing cast of characters is far more impressive than what the Cowboys and 49ers accomplished and is unlikely to ever be duplicated

This same flawed argument that was once used to "prove" Montana was better than Brady has also already been called out.....the 49ers and Cowboys may have won their Super Bowls in more dominating fashion but they didn't make it to anywhere near as many Super Bowls either. So they get a pass for losing sooner in the playoffs during their non Super Bowl years????
I think your counter is also fair, re: previous dynasties existing in a salary cap era...

I already said the Patriots are the standard. That's my opinion. They are the most prominent franchise in the game, and have taken a space previously occupied by the Bears, Packers, Browns, Steelers, 49ers, Cowboys, they have detonated the previous marker for "greatness" as an organization. I really believe that...

Bit I do think it is fair to challenge their dominance relative to other dynasties...

Pats are extending their lead for most Super Bowl appearances, and only the Giants, Bears, Packers, and Browns have played in more NFL championship games. And all four of those franchises are significantly older than the Patriots...

The standard will be reset again at some point. Not in the same fashion, I don't think it's possible to do this again, but the bar will be raised again. It'll probably take someone surpassing the Patriots in Super Bowl count, which is probably years away. In that sense, I could see an argument for other franchises passing New England if New England's championship reign is relegated to just one period of success, while other franchise won titles across multiple eras. But that is probably years away...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-22-2019, 07:13 AM
 
16,521 posts, read 20,964,213 times
Reputation: 47952
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluedevilz View Post

What the Patriots have accomplished throughout the past 18 years with an ever changing cast of characters is far more impressive than what the Cowboys and 49ers accomplished and is unlikely to ever be duplicated
A key phrase here-ever changing cast of characters.

The following Boston/New England Patriots are in the Pro Football Hall Of Fame:


Nick Buoniconti
John Hannah
Mike Haynes
Curtis Martin
Randy Moss
Bill Parcells
Junior Seau
Andre Tippett

Belichick is not only the best coach in the NFL but also the smartest. Randy Moss and Junior Seau are the only players signed by the Patriots by free agency to play in a Super Bowl in the Bill Belichick era. The Patriots are able to draft players that fit like a glove in the system. This type of scenario has never happened in the NFL before and I don't see it happening again.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-22-2019, 07:21 AM
 
Location: Boston, MA
11,723 posts, read 8,296,447 times
Reputation: 5785
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluedevilz View Post
It would then be a fair point to challenge whether any of the previously stated dynasties would have even existed in a salary cap era designed to prevent dynasties from ever occurring...

What the Patriots have accomplished throughout the past 18 years with an ever changing cast of characters is far more impressive than what the Cowboys and 49ers accomplished and is unlikely to ever be duplicated

This same flawed argument that was once used to "prove" Montana was better than Brady has also already been called out.....the 49ers and Cowboys may have won their Super Bowls in more dominating fashion but they didn't make it to anywhere near as many Super Bowls either. So they get a pass for losing sooner in the playoffs during their non Super Bowl years????
I'll add to that: When the 49ers, Redskins, and Cowboys won their superbowls, the NFC was far superior to the AFC so the real superbowls of that time were actually played in the NFC Championships. That's why those games are considered legendary. In fact, it would be almost fair to consider the NFC of that time was the dynasty. From 1982 to 1997 the NFC won all SBs except 1984.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-22-2019, 08:28 AM
 
6,439 posts, read 3,451,927 times
Reputation: 10199
I give up as a Patriots fan defending anything about them. It's all black & white for everyone to see the accomplishments already in the books. people want to knock them down as a team and individually just to feel better about themselves and the team they root for. Saying "cheaters", not saying Brady is the GOAT for QB's and probably the GOAT in NFL history across ll positions, saying Brady without Belichick or visa versa would make each individually mediocre, saying the Pats play in the AFC East which makes their road the easiest - the list goes on.

In my opinion it's cut and dry - to date Brady is the greatest player and Belichick the greatest coach and Kraft is the greatest owner and the Patriots are the greatest franchise and this current dynasty is the greatest in NFL history.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-22-2019, 08:40 AM
 
Location: North Carolina
3,259 posts, read 2,316,886 times
Reputation: 4431
" In my opinion it's cut and dry - to date Brady is the greatest player and Belichick the greatest coach and Kraft is the greatest owner and the Patriots are the greatest franchise and this current dynasty is the greatest in NFL history."


Just check the air pressure in the game balls that they bring.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-22-2019, 08:55 AM
 
Location: Murrica
3,138 posts, read 1,792,147 times
Reputation: 2129
Pats Super Bowl record. 5-5. Greatest, no. Great? Yes.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-22-2019, 10:17 AM
 
6,439 posts, read 3,451,927 times
Reputation: 10199
Quote:
Originally Posted by RcHydro View Post
" In my opinion it's cut and dry - to date Brady is the greatest player and Belichick the greatest coach and Kraft is the greatest owner and the Patriots are the greatest franchise and this current dynasty is the greatest in NFL history."


Just check the air pressure in the game balls that they bring.
Lame and weak

Quote:
Originally Posted by m1a1mg View Post
Pats Super Bowl record. 5-5. Greatest, no. Great? Yes.
If getting there is as hard as players say, then the fact the Pats will now have gone to 3 more than the next team in history, and one player/coach going to their 9th, outweighs an undefeated argument IMHO.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-22-2019, 10:30 AM
Status: "Beach time!" (set 18 days ago)
 
Location: Fredericksburg/Virginia Beach, VA
10,674 posts, read 11,078,829 times
Reputation: 13950
Quote:
Originally Posted by metalmancpa View Post
If getting there is as hard as players say, then the fact the Pats will now have gone to 3 more than the next team in history, and one player/coach going to their 9th, outweighs an undefeated argument IMHO.
I agree. 11 Conference titles is incredible. You can't lose 5 Super Bowls without getting to it 5 times. Throwing in a few wins makes it all even better.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-22-2019, 10:39 AM
 
Location: Murrica
3,138 posts, read 1,792,147 times
Reputation: 2129
Quote:
Originally Posted by metalmancpa View Post
If getting there is as hard as players say, then the fact the Pats will now have gone to 3 more than the next team in history, and one player/coach going to their 9th, outweighs an undefeated argument IMHO.
All perspective, I suppose. I grant that they are great, but would probably put the Steelers #1. 6-2 trumps 5-5. But again, IMHO.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Sports > Pro Football
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top