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Has anyone ever dated someone who comes from a codependent relationship with their parent and/or parents? I have read that the term emotional incest is also used. Although there isn't any sexual incest, it is like the parent uses the child to fulfill their emotional needs and lays guilt trips on them. A guy I dated broke up with me and he appears to have this relationship with his parents. He is almost 50 and they are in their early 80's. They would call him while he was on dates with me and ask him where he was, doesn't he care about them, all he cares about is himself, etc. He says he is going to have to quit his job when one them or both of them get sick to take care of them. He says he has no life. And, he does live with them. Please, no hurtful comments. I dated him because he had a job and activities like traveling that meant he wasn't staying home with them. I also really felt a connection with him. He was such a sweetheart to me and I feel that person is somewhere deep inside. We are both only children and I can understand somewhat what he is going through as I had a mother who was overprotective and would do some of the same things his mother does. Both of my parents are deceased. But I told him I understood where he was coming from and that I wanted to help him but I really don't think he "heard" me. I told him he could move out and still be able to be there for his parents and help them. It just feels like he has given up on life and I feel so bad for him. I haven't been in touch because I don't want to make things worse. Any advice?
Not a fan of the term "emotional incest." Why do we have to slap a new label on a very old relationship dynamic that was observed in the earliest human literature?
For this one, I would say "you can't teach an old dog new tricks". If he was younger and was complaining/unhappy with his relationship with his parents, I would suggest he go to counseling. (If he was happy with the situation, I would not suggest anything.)
You can suggest someone go to counseling, but if they don't, not much you can do beyond that. That is the best anyone can do.
But in this situation, being as he is 50 and lived a large portion of his life this way, I imagine it could take years of counseling to help him "cut the umbilical cord". But I think the same result will happen when his parents pass away.
I would leave it be. If after they pass away he has trouble, then I would suggest counseling.
It is painful to see other people in these situations. But in my experience, not a whole heck of a lot you can do to help them.
Guilt imposed by a parent on a child is a form of mental abuse. It is done by the parents to control and manipulate the child. In this case, the parents decided a long time ago that they wanted the son to be a caretaker for them in their old age, and that's why they periodically have felt a need to pull on his leash (those calls he received when out on dates with you) when they perceived a threat to their imagined long-term security. The possibility that you might take him away and then they might be left alone did not sit well with them. This form of manipulation is something that some parents do, and it begins when the child is young..... usually in subtle ways.
At his age, it's doubtful that he can become free of the guilt while they are still around..... possibly some day, after they are gone, if he gains some insight and understanding of how he has been used.
I wish I had've thought of it, I know exactly what you mean and that phrase encapsulates what makes me so uncomfortable about this behaviour.
I had a friend who had an extremely close enabling relationship with her two sons. They could literally do no wrong. The oldest has anger problems and was physically agressive, and is now long term unemployed. She works low paid jobs to support them both and describes him as "dependant" even though he is a smart mouthed 26. She supplies his food and phone and marijuana and alcohol, although has never clothed him.
He treats the house like his own personal punching bag, slamming doors and putting holes in walls, windows etc, when he loses his temper, which is often.
She runs around trying to please him. He has ruined all her other relationships with his bad attitude and mouth.
I've known this family since he was about 10 so I've seen it develop. It's so dysfunctional. I don't see them much these days.
Thanks to everyone who responded. I have read so much on the topic on the internet and have heard from other people that this seems to be more prevalent that one would think. Deep down, this guy has a good heart and I hate to see his life wasted.
I was in a relationship for over a year and half with a woman that was 31/32 years old at the time.
And yes, emotional incest exists. Her father was very controlling but did it in passive and subtle ways. In her adult life, almost everything she did was to make him happy and/or conform to what he wanted, which prior to her being in a relationship with me, she had boyfriends and at one point a husband that were all the type of guys that her dad wanted her with. She conformed to her father's religious views which were instilled on her when she was younger but he never gave her a choice, and she would go to her Bible study group on Wednesdays, church every Sunday and always talk about religion - however she was a total narcissist and lacked a soul.
Her mental and psychological development on some levels was trapped at about the age of 12 (which might have been due to early unresolved trauma because of her dad - sexual) and she lacked the basic tools that a mature person would need to function within the parameters of society. He dad bought all of her vehicles for her, handled and managed her finances, subsidized her lifestyle financially and she had to answer to him for things in her life - including why she was with me and there was a constant battle being waged between her dad and myself for her attention and even love. At the age of 31 she was still living at her parents house, but "moved" some things into my house to make it appear that she was living there, but 2-3 nights a week she would stay at her parents house and spend time with her father. It realy got old after a while.
When her parents were out of town for a week that first summer, we stopped by her parents house and her room there, despite her age looked just like it must have when she was a child. Plush animals surrounding it, children's wallpaper bordering the walls and it basically looked like the room of a little girl that was between ten and twelve years old. Whenever her father would call her, she would answer her phone and her voice would change when she talked to him - like change into a little girl voice and then she would go right back to talking normal again when she was off the phone with him and with me. It was really weird.
And when we were at her parents house while they were out of town, it was like she was subconsciously trying to get back at her father for any issues she couldn't deal with regarding his control over her life and indirect attempts at keeping her trapt at the level of a child. She wanted to have sex while we were there, and wow. . . in her father's office, eventually on top of his desk. I was like whatever and got the job done, but she seemed to really get into it on a whole new level.
She also went through life with alot of narcissistic characteristics and/or traits combined with pathological lying which was all deeply ingrained behavior since her parents (mainly her father) had always accepted any type of behavior from her and in her early childhood from what she mentioned of it - he idealized and overvalued her to a point where he either directly or indirectly created a monster. To this day, he still cleans up every mess she makes in her life and tolerates any and all behavior that she acts out on while trying to maintain some kind of control over her although she is a woman. When he fails at maintaining a tight grip on her life and or behavior, he resorts to making her feel guilty for not living up to his idealized view of her and she goes back to him, atones and promises to walk a straight line again. And as far as guys she has been with. He was always ok with the clowns that fit his ideal profile of the type of guy he wanted her with. Then I came along and he made it his mission in life to make sure our relationship didn't last, and in many ways it worked but I doubt I could have tolerated her past the point where we broke up anyway.
Perhaps he is an alcoholic...drug addict or both. His behavior sounds similar and she sounds like an enabler-just as sick as he....
Quote:
Originally Posted by MsAnnThrope
Woah what a term...emotional incest.
I wish I had've thought of it, I know exactly what you mean and that phrase encapsulates what makes me so uncomfortable about this behaviour.
I had a friend who had an extremely close enabling relationship with her two sons. They could literally do no wrong. The oldest has anger problems and was physically agressive, and is now long term unemployed. She works low paid jobs to support them both and describes him as "dependant" even though he is a smart mouthed 26. She supplies his food and phone and marijuana and alcohol, although has never clothed him.
He treats the house like his own personal punching bag, slamming doors and putting holes in walls, windows etc, when he loses his temper, which is often.
She runs around trying to please him. He has ruined all her other relationships with his bad attitude and mouth.
I've known this family since he was about 10 so I've seen it develop. It's so dysfunctional. I don't see them much these days.
There are so many very sad & dysfunctional family relationships... it is very hard to watch...or even hear of the details...
Better for you to have moved on... but if you are like me, as I had a brief relationship with a guy who had a miserable family, I still to this day think of him...
and it makes me sad.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skydive Outlaw
Emotional incest. . .
I was in a relationship for over a year and half with a woman that was 31/32 years old at the time.
And yes, emotional incest exists. Her father was very controlling but did it in passive and subtle ways. In her adult life, almost everything she did was to make him happy and/or conform to what he wanted, which prior to her being in a relationship with me, she had boyfriends and at one point a husband that were all the type of guys that her dad wanted her with. She conformed to her father's religious views which were instilled on her when she was younger but he never gave her a choice, and she would go to her Bible study group on Wednesdays, church every Sunday and always talk about religion - however she was a total narcissist and lacked a soul.
Her mental and psychological development on some levels was trapped at about the age of 12 (which might have been due to early unresolved trauma because of her dad - sexual) and she lacked the basic tools that a mature person would need to function within the parameters of society. He dad bought all of her vehicles for her, handled and managed her finances, subsidized her lifestyle financially and she had to answer to him for things in her life - including why she was with me and there was a constant battle being waged between her dad and myself for her attention and even love. At the age of 31 she was still living at her parents house, but "moved" some things into my house to make it appear that she was living there, but 2-3 nights a week she would stay at her parents house and spend time with her father. It realy got old after a while.
When her parents were out of town for a week that first summer, we stopped by her parents house and her room there, despite her age looked just like it must have when she was a child. Plush animals surrounding it, children's wallpaper bordering the walls and it basically looked like the room of a little girl that was between ten and twelve years old. Whenever her father would call her, she would answer her phone and her voice would change when she talked to him - like change into a little girl voice and then she would go right back to talking normal again when she was off the phone with him and with me. It was really weird.
And when we were at her parents house while they were out of town, it was like she was subconsciously trying to get back at her father for any issues she couldn't deal with regarding his control over her life and indirect attempts at keeping her trapt at the level of a child. She wanted to have sex while we were there, and wow. . . in her father's office, eventually on top of his desk. I was like whatever and got the job done, but she seemed to really get into it on a whole new level.
She also went through life with alot of narcissistic characteristics and/or traits combined with pathological lying which was all deeply ingrained behavior since her parents (mainly her father) had always accepted any type of behavior from her and in her early childhood from what she mentioned of it - he idealized and overvalued her to a point where he either directly or indirectly created a monster. To this day, he still cleans up every mess she makes in her life and tolerates any and all behavior that she acts out on while trying to maintain some kind of control over her although she is a woman. When he fails at maintaining a tight grip on her life and or behavior, he resorts to making her feel guilty for not living up to his idealized view of her and she goes back to him, atones and promises to walk a straight line again. And as far as guys she has been with. He was always ok with the clowns that fit his ideal profile of the type of guy he wanted her with. Then I came along and he made it his mission in life to make sure our relationship didn't last, and in many ways it worked but I doubt I could have tolerated her past the point where we broke up anyway.
Not a fan of the term "emotional incest." Why do we have to slap a new label on a very old relationship dynamic that was observed in the earliest human literature?
Yeah, I like the ol' "mama's boy" and "daddy's girl" labels better.
As to the OP I would say sometimes it's difficult for a parent to know where the line is between being supportive and being co-dependant or enabling. And it's easy to pass judgement on others when observing from the outside without know the whole story.
Of course it happens. Some parents are WAY to invested in their children and don't know when it's time to cut those apron strings. On the other hand, some people are just closer to their parents than others, and that isn't necessarily a bad thing. It just depends on how much that relationship is interfering with the (adult) child being able to make his own life.
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. I dated him because he had a job and activities like traveling that meant he wasn't staying home with them. I also really felt a connection with him. He was such a sweetheart to me and I feel that person is somewhere deep inside. We are both only children and I can understand somewhat what he is going through as I had a mother who was overprotective and would do some of the same things his mother does. Both of my parents are deceased. But I told him I understood where he was coming from and that I wanted to help him but I really don't think he "heard" me. I told him he could move out and still be able to be there for his parents and help them. It just feels like he has given up on life and I feel so bad for him. I haven't been in touch because I don't want to make things worse. Any advice?
