Should women start dating "kissless virgins" for the protection of society? (discrimination, men)
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How would you like to see women change style-wise? A lot of guys seem to like the Kardashian bimbo look and say traditionally pretty women are just cute, but not hot or sexy. If you are expected to look like a porn bimbo and that is what is considered feminine, maybe women who don't want that stop trying since they are not considered sexy otherwise.
Kardashian isn't actually that far from what I think would be good, provided the body parts are smaller and the clothes not as tight. Too much makeup, though. Something based on 50's style, when women often mixed sexiness with class. (Maybe I should poll men on the eras.) Many women are listening to style advice - from their peers and the (feminine) media, which tend to know less than they think they do. If women knew what men really want, some would stop trying too hard and others might feel encouraged that they could achieve attractiveness without looking more 'cheap' than their values would allow or struggling to be thinner than their bodies' natural state. I admit to having the possible typical shy guy's bias toward a look more reserved than some women's fashion today. I think the basic complaint of the average "kissless virgin" is that he rarely meets the type of woman he really wants, sometimes leaving him mad at women in general for the disappointment (for example, a CD thread about a virgin who turned down a party girl). Elliot Rodger should have been pickier in a way - sorority girls weren't going to match up well with him, but maybe he didn't grow up with examples of "good girls" to long for.
Last edited by goodheathen; 06-13-2014 at 10:20 PM..
There is an inherent danger in dating people who INSIST you change for them. Time is not kind. Our faces crack, our hair dulls and turns gray, our skin sags, we put on weight, we lose muscle tone..... If you pick a really picky partner, you're very likely to get replaced when you aren't shiny and new enough to dress up and show off.
I had one hard and fast dating rule. I would not date balding guys who had the comb over, wore a toupee or had hair transplants. Why? Because I knew they focused on looks and looks fade. I wasn't looking for flash in the pan. I was looking for a lifelong companion so I wanted someone who could look past looks because any that I had would fade in time.
My friend feels the same way, he started buzz-cutting everything left over on his head beyond a certain point.
However he also rocks a beard... I've never seen him without the beard, and he has confessed he wears it because he thinks it hides his "fat double chin". I understand but simultaneously don't understand this contention and maybe you might also call it vanity, it does sometimes inspire me to say "man, you realize if you're fat we can tell from your body, right? The chin blanket is not distracting us from this fact."
It isn't shallow or flash in the pan to want to look as attractive as possible for oneself and one's mate, this doesn't have to change as we age.
A small beard can do a lot to improve some men's looks, just as hair color and style can vastly improve some some women's looks.
There is a huge difference between doing things you want to do to make yourself look better and doing things because your partner insists you do. If you're doing them for the former reason, you are the judge of what looks good. If you do them for the latter, you may find one day that no matter what you do you don't make the cut anymore.
Any changes to you that you make should be because you wanted to make them not because someone else wanted to change you.
There is a huge difference between doing things you want to do to make yourself look better and doing things because your partner insists you do. If you're doing them for the former reason, you are the judge of what looks good. If you do them for the latter, you may find one day that no matter what you do you don't make the cut anymore.
Any changes to you that you make should be because you wanted to make them not because someone else wanted to change you.
Absolutely true! Women who change how they look because a man insists on it will only find themselves left alone when a younger version of what the man wants comes along. Looks can't be the most important thing about a person. If this is all a relationship is based on it's doomed to fail. Yes people should strive to look nice, but throughout this thread it's always the emphasis put on looks.
It isn't shallow or flash in the pan to want to look as attractive as possible for oneself and one's mate, this doesn't have to change as we age.
A small beard can do a lot to improve some men's looks, just as hair color and style can vastly improve some some women's looks.
Sure, but "some". I've seen some shave it and haven't had any bad opinion of their looks after they insisted for years they were hideous without it, and then other times because it is a symbol of masculinity, men cling to it like an acceptable crutch to avoid losing weight. I've had this response from more than one husky man, "I wear this beard because it hides my double chin." Clearly these men are saying that the double chin and extra weight makes them less sightly, perhaps even to themselves. If that man is one of the unattached, perhaps he should be shaving off his beard and looking at himself in the mirror without it. Perhaps it would spur him to lose the weight elsewhere. If one of those ladies shaped like a Weeble tells me "I wear dark clothes because they're slimming", I roll my eyes in response to that too, and it's not because I'm a little twiggy thing myself. Fat is fat. You're not hiding it. We've now even got "tanorexia" on the same principle. The human brain's capacity to delude and talk itself into things that aren't remotely true, as an excuse to avoid making changes, is legendary. It would be different, if these masking people were actually making or even trying to make changes that would fit them to drop the crutches.
I think the OP has focused on the wrong area. Society needs to stop shaming, berating and ridiculing kissless virgins. Whether women date them or not is not the key issue, it's how they feel about themselves, how they are portrayed, how their peers treat them and the messages / programming they have picked up since birth.
A few may well see beneath the facade of the shaming of those who do not conform to the sexual ideals of media and society but many do not. Many will cut short their own life or others due to a false belief that their worth as a human being is somehow linked to how much sex they are having.
Yeah, let's make movies like "The 40 year old virgin" and make more fun of them so they are pushed over the edge even farther.
Legal prostitution might be OK if idiot boys who are obsessed with their virginity can get rid of it. I've known plenty of women who would do it for the novelty ...in HS. They were girls then.
That helps explain some men from PUA Hate who aimed to players or aesthetic gods. I think it also indicates that Elliot Rodger wanted to feel like a top dog after a lifetime of being socially near the bottom and forced, ineffective therapy.
But the key point is that many men, maybe 20%, feel virtually powerless, especially with women, and attempts to 'control' women are mostly about trying to get some power back.
Maybe I'm too ambitious in pushing womankind to 'improve' some behaviors. It probably would be better just to ask women to put aside preconceived notions and try to better understand and sympathize with men. If that happened, there would be more willingness to adjust to some of men's wants.
That helps explain some men from PUA Hate who aimed to players or aesthetic gods. I think it also indicates that Elliot Rodger wanted to feel like a top dog after a lifetime of being socially near the bottom and forced, ineffective therapy.
But the key point is that many men, maybe 20%, feel virtually powerless, especially with women, and attempts to 'control' women are mostly about trying to get some power back.
Maybe I'm too ambitious in pushing womankind to 'improve' some behaviors. It probably would be better just to ask women to put aside preconceived notions and try to better understand and sympathize with men. If that happened, there would be more willingness to adjust to some of men's wants.
Why are we required to be adjust to men's wants? What are we? Some kind of prize you think you win?
How about if men start treating women like the people they are instead of objects?
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