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Old 01-27-2016, 02:59 PM
 
Location: Northern Wisconsin
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Researching another topic, I found this article from Psychology Today. I was stunned by what i read.


https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...s-shorten-life
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Old 01-28-2016, 08:30 PM
 
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Interesting. I didn't know this and would guess most others don't.
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Old 01-29-2016, 07:10 AM
 
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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Nonetheless, failure to use those medications can result in an even shorter, or much shorter life for the seriously depressed.
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Old 01-29-2016, 09:49 PM
 
Location: Northern Wisconsin
10,379 posts, read 10,857,634 times
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Is there any research to back up your claim Hemlock? Like a double blind study where one group got a placebo and one group got antidepressants, and then the group that had the antidepressants were less likely to commit suicide. You'd also have to do a parallel or similar study that the group that took the antidepressants were less likely to die from any and every cause.
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Old 02-01-2016, 07:47 AM
 
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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Measuring the likeliness of suicide requires that subjects actually attempt or succeed, so it's not a likely study to happen. I do, however, know people that have attempted suicide and failed, who have kept their depression under control for many years with medication.
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Old 02-01-2016, 10:37 AM
 
13,498 posts, read 18,112,837 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by augiedogie View Post
Researching another topic, I found this article from Psychology Today. I was stunned by what i read.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...s-shorten-life
I think that I would put on the brakes a bit before being too caught up by this single article, and I say this based mainly on the long anecdote quoting Mr. Risser's experience.

He has had a history of three heart attacks and has been taking Inderal, a beta-blocker, and then a "cocktail" of medications for his depression. Upon his commitment to a mental institution he ceases to take all of his medications.

Upon his release he learns that Inderal can cause major depression. (He was jerk not to have done his own research on his medications to begin with!)

He then moves on to assert that the cocktail of anti-depression medicines he has been taking may have been responsible for his heart problems.

WHOA!!!!

There is a very serious lack of information here, and that lack turns his anecdote into an emotional polemic. Beware!

The Inderal causes depression. OK

He has had 3 heart attacks. OK

When did he begin using Inderal? We don't know.

When did he begin using anti-depression medications? We don't know.

And where did these 3 heart attacks occur in relation to the use of these drugs? We don't know.

But the doctor who wrote the article, and who has received Mr. Risser's permission to quote his narrative seems fine with allowing him to draw the conclusion for the reader that it was his "cocktail" that may have been the source of his heart problem.

With the above serious lack of information and discussion, I see no reason to believe his assertion. The footnoted material is not immediately available to the reader, and we are left only with this article and its conclusions. Shame on the doctor who wrote such a superficial article for putting this in print, and more shame on Psychology Today for printing it.

Many years ago, the late Fifties or early Sixties, one of my mother's sisters, who was very overweight, had developed heart trouble. She was given medication. She became seriously depressed (quite frankly her home life and family relationships were such that this would have hardly been surprising), she received some anti-depessant, her behavior worsened and finally developed into full blown paranoia with her hiding in closets, etc. She was delivered to a state hospital for the mentally ill.

They were given a list of her medications. The medical doctors after some consideration withdrew her from her heart medication (I do not know what it was.) She improved remarkably in a short time, and when the anti-depressant was withdrawn she continued to be fine. The conclusion was that the particular heart medication she had been taking had led to her mental problems.

Upon release she used other heart medications - never any anti-depressants. Later she had a relapse, and after another review of her medications they were changed again, and again she had the same results. She did die from heart disease a short number of years later.

Her experience would certainly incline me to attribute her mental problems to the particular heart medications that she used. The anti-depressant (or perhaps there was more than one) clearly did not help her problem, but there was never any assertion that it was the cause - obviously not, her symptoms were what caused them to be introduced into her treatment; nor did anyone ever say that they exacerbated her mental collapse.

Therefore, I can readily accept that Risser's use of the heart medication Inderal may have caused his decline into serious depression. But without knowing about his continued use of Inderal, and the points at which various and multiple anti-depressants were introduced - plus when his heart attacks occurred in relation to his drug regimen and changes in it, I cannot buy his facile conclusion.

I am aware from personal use what the side effects of various anti-depressant medications can be, so I am not disputing that they can be negative and serious.

However, the author of the article in relying on Risser's anecdote has given entirely too sketchy a narrative for me to accept as credible. And I think Psychology Today has done little more than write a titillating scare story. This article proves absolutely NOTHING.

Given the number of Americans using heart medications alone, these are a topic that needs to be seriously explored by patients and their doctors. And in more intelligent articles than this one for the general public.

Plus, as the article's author points out, the use of various mood altering drugs has filtered down to a level of usage that is often dubious. (The same might be said for various types of prescription painkillers) And, without a doubt, doctors and patients need to be thoughtful and cautious about their use. And, again, thoughtful, intelligently written articles for the general public would certainly be helpful...but not something of this ilk.

I could never jump on any bandwagon as a result of an article as skimpy and ill-considered as this one.
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Old 02-01-2016, 10:47 AM
 
1,881 posts, read 1,477,007 times
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OP, I thought I saw somewhere that you were a counselor of some sort. Not sure how you aren't abreast of the research.

Mental Illness Linked to Shortened Life Spans

Insomnia, anxiety meds may shorten life span - Health - Mental health | NBC News

Study: Use of Antipsychotic Drugs Improves Life Expectancy for Individuals with Schizophrenia - 11/01/2012

The bottom line is that it depends on which mental illness the patient has, how severe it is, and which drug you're talking about. In other words, it's case-by-case, and it is up to each prescriber to help the patient sort through his or her own very personal risk-to-benefit ratio, when there is already risk because of the mental illness in the first place.

P.S. Three heart attacks puts someone at a higher risk for not only depression, but PTSD. Keep reading.
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Old 02-01-2016, 10:50 AM
 
1,881 posts, read 1,477,007 times
Reputation: 4533
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevxu View Post
With the above serious lack of information and discussion, I see no reason to believe his assertion. The footnoted material is not immediately available to the reader, and we are left only with this article and its conclusions. Shame on the doctor who wrote such a superficial article for putting this in print, and more shame on Psychology Today for printing it.
It's an opinion piece. But the OP's reaction to it goes to show how easy it is for many people to confuse an opinion piece with a feature article.
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Old 02-01-2016, 11:13 AM
 
Location: Ohio
24,623 posts, read 19,066,222 times
Reputation: 21733
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevxu View Post
I think that I would put on the brakes a bit before being too caught up by this single article, and I say this based mainly on the long anecdote quoting Mr. Risser's experience.

He has had a history of three heart attacks and has been taking Inderal, a beta-blocker, and then a "cocktail" of medications for his depression. Upon his commitment to a mental institution he ceases to take all of his medications.

Upon his release he learns that Inderal can cause major depression. (He was jerk not to have done his own research on his medications to begin with!)

He then moves on to assert that the cocktail of anti-depression medicines he has been taking may have been responsible for his heart problems.

WHOA!!!!

There is a very serious lack of information here, and that lack turns his anecdote into an emotional polemic. Beware!

The Inderal causes depression. OK

He has had 3 heart attacks. OK

When did he begin using Inderal? We don't know.

When did he begin using anti-depression medications? We don't know.

And where did these 3 heart attacks occur in relation to the use of these drugs? We don't know.

But the doctor who wrote the article, and who has received Mr. Risser's permission to quote his narrative seems fine with allowing him to draw the conclusion for the reader that it was his "cocktail" that may have been the source of his heart problem.

With the above serious lack of information and discussion, I see no reason to believe his assertion. The footnoted material is not immediately available to the reader, and we are left only with this article and its conclusions. Shame on the doctor who wrote such a superficial article for putting this in print, and more shame on Psychology Today for printing it.

Many years ago, the late Fifties or early Sixties, one of my mother's sisters, who was very overweight, had developed heart trouble. She was given medication. She became seriously depressed (quite frankly her home life and family relationships were such that this would have hardly been surprising), she received some anti-depessant, her behavior worsened and finally developed into full blown paranoia with her hiding in closets, etc. She was delivered to a state hospital for the mentally ill.

They were given a list of her medications. The medical doctors after some consideration withdrew her from her heart medication (I do not know what it was.) She improved remarkably in a short time, and when the anti-depressant was withdrawn she continued to be fine. The conclusion was that the particular heart medication she had been taking had led to her mental problems.

Upon release she used other heart medications - never any anti-depressants. Later she had a relapse, and after another review of her medications they were changed again, and again she had the same results. She did die from heart disease a short number of years later.

Her experience would certainly incline me to attribute her mental problems to the particular heart medications that she used. The anti-depressant (or perhaps there was more than one) clearly did not help her problem, but there was never any assertion that it was the cause - obviously not, her symptoms were what caused them to be introduced into her treatment; nor did anyone ever say that they exacerbated her mental collapse.

Therefore, I can readily accept that Risser's use of the heart medication Inderal may have caused his decline into serious depression. But without knowing about his continued use of Inderal, and the points at which various and multiple anti-depressants were introduced - plus when his heart attacks occurred in relation to his drug regimen and changes in it, I cannot buy his facile conclusion.

I am aware from personal use what the side effects of various anti-depressant medications can be, so I am not disputing that they can be negative and serious.

However, the author of the article in relying on Risser's anecdote has given entirely too sketchy a narrative for me to accept as credible. And I think Psychology Today has done little more than write a titillating scare story. This article proves absolutely NOTHING.

Given the number of Americans using heart medications alone, these are a topic that needs to be seriously explored by patients and their doctors. And in more intelligent articles than this one for the general public.

Plus, as the article's author points out, the use of various mood altering drugs has filtered down to a level of usage that is often dubious. (The same might be said for various types of prescription painkillers) And, without a doubt, doctors and patients need to be thoughtful and cautious about their use. And, again, thoughtful, intelligently written articles for the general public would certainly be helpful...but not something of this ilk.

I could never jump on any bandwagon as a result of an article as skimpy and ill-considered as this one.
Good analysis.
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