Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Just a random thought, not blaming OP at all- have you seriously checked on yourself to see if your behavior could be contributing to the group not caring for you? Honestly. Are you correcting, interjecting constantly etc?
I do, but not constantly. Imagine Habitat for Humanity with one carpenter and a bunch of guys who've never held a hammer. I'm the carpenter, and I'm watching this person try to build houses out of straw. She gets mad if I tell her anything, and gets mad when her houses fall down. In any case, I don't deny I'm not "popular," but I've never said anything cruel, and have always been very careful (and private) with my "advice." I stopped giving it entirely within a month of her arrival. So regardless of whether or not they like me, I don't think the vicious attacks - which are very personal - are warranted. Just because you don't care for someone's personality isn't a reason to be cruel to them.
Just because you don't care for someone's personality isn't a reason to be cruel to them.
I agree. Personality differences are a huge issue in the workplace. I'm glad I work from home now because the interpersonal conflicts seem to be relentless in the business environments of today, as I've read on the "work" forum here on CD. A few years ago, I volunteered for Girl Scouts to be a troop leader. I only did it because nobody else would step up to be the troop leader and I wanted my child to have the experience of being in a troop. The group of moms were pretty awful, there was constant bickering and backstabbing. I had to work hard to make sure it didn't affect the kids. Most of the toxicity came from just two of the moms, but after the year was over and our troop disbanded, I unfriended every single one of those women on FB. I'm glad I don't have to see their nasty faces on my newsfeed anymore.
It might be a consideration to walk away from this group and sever all ties.
Status:
"I don't understand. But I don't care, so it works out."
(set 6 days ago)
35,624 posts, read 17,961,729 times
Reputation: 50650
Quote:
Originally Posted by PriscillaVanilla
I have. Sometimes there really isn't anyone in charge.
I'd be very curious to know what those were, Priscilla. The OP has since responded that there are people in charge - she and the bully are the ones in charge of the program.
Ask her what her problem is with you out loud with other around after one of her insults, she needs to be called out in public. Don't make it an argument, just a question.
Agreed. The bully will just keep bullying if you don't call them out, especially in public.
I do, but not constantly. Imagine Habitat for Humanity with one carpenter and a bunch of guys who've never held a hammer. I'm the carpenter, and I'm watching this person try to build houses out of straw. She gets mad if I tell her anything, and gets mad when her houses fall down. In any case, I don't deny I'm not "popular," but I've never said anything cruel, and have always been very careful (and private) with my "advice." I stopped giving it entirely within a month of her arrival. So regardless of whether or not they like me, I don't think the vicious attacks - which are very personal - are warranted. Just because you don't care for someone's personality isn't a reason to be cruel to them.
Ok, I am going to go out on a limb here...and I am really just curious, but is your professional background "higher" or more successful than hers? Is your spouse more successful? Your children?
In women's groups/clubs/ organizations, oftentimes there is a "pecking order" based on several things. You mentioned popularity. Being a "Joiner" versus just joining in is another one. I imagine you to be in the "joining in" mentality versus Ms Popular and Sparkly's group of active "joiners", meaning that they latch on to the popular members/ the in crowd in the club.
This provides them with a ready made in-group, and an Identity.
I went thru this with an expat group. Hated.MY.Guts because I was able to secure employment anywhere my spouse was relocated to. Most places on the planet need medical staff, so I always found work. They didn't like that too much, since I worked and was not at their beck and call to do things for them. If their spouse was higher than mine in the corporate ladder, well, then I should "drop everything, and do as they wished, such as host a party when they wanted, how they wanted, etc." Said male spouse was always mature and played no such hierarchy games. No surprise here, men respect each other as a general rule and act accordingly.
And with me employed locally, we were able to make contacts with the local natives and were often asked to join their groups and clubs. So they were jealous. I never talked of work, never mentioned other groups or said activities.
One time, a gal said "do you have to work". No kidding......Ah, no, but why did I pursue a Ph.D if I did not want to take advantage of the world wide experience of working amoungst other cultures in other nations?
Sounds like the book "Queen Bees and wanna be's" but in this case, with supposedly fully mature, adult women. Sounds like the OP has been dealing with a few of these sorts all along
The only way you are going to find out why she does this, rather than guessing, is to ask her. This will require strong resolve on your part and the patience to bring Active Listening skills to bear.
In a low-distraction opportunity, when she does not have an audience, try something like, "I heard you say X earlier. What did you mean by that?"
Then it's Active Listening for you: Listening with full attention not only to what she says, but what else she may be trying to say. Accepting what she says without judgement. Nodding, or leaning forward to show her you are listening to every word. Later, paraphrasing what she says to check for meaning. Asking follow-up questions to learn her motivations, and whether you just seem like a soft target, or she actively dislikes you. Do not rush to respond; try to find out more and understand.
After this step, thank her for her explanations and her honesty. Then there may be the opportunity for you to say that you are there to serve the community, and do not enjoy being her "straight man." And that you will say so, clearly and unemotionally, if that sort thing happens in the future. Say that you're glad you can both be honest with each other.
The two of you may never be friends or really get along. But you will establish ground rules for what is acceptable. If your relationship is one of honest dislike, so be it. Do not worry about who is more popular. Your reasons for joining the group were service oriented, not social. However, if it becomes truly unpleasant to be part of this group, another will be happy to have you on your own terms. You have choices.
I do a lot of work for a volunteer group, and the politics can get intense. It's all women, and feels like high school a lot. I suffered horrible bullying as a kid, and find the cattiness and back-stabbing, not to mention the outright name-calling and emotional meltdowns, cause me a lot of stress.
One of the women in our group is very popular, funny, and charming, and seems to have chosen me as a target. She says awful things to me and shouts at me, but is wonderful to everyone else. Therefore, the others seem to think this is my personal issue with her - but I have never done anything to her and have tried to remain professional and calm and not stoop to her level. I'm not sure how to handle it. Some people say to fight back, but I don't want to have some big power struggle. It seems childish. Plus, I'm just not popular like she is. I don't have a sparkly personality - I'm more quiet and serious. So people don't gravitate to me like they do to her.
I don't think she intends to target me for her own enjoyment so much as she just really doesn't like me and feels my very existence has wronged her. As a result, I feel somewhat responsible for just not being a likeable person, and not having the best social skills.
Others say to quit the group and walk away. This is very tempting. I think I would be happier if I left it all behind. On the other hand, I have a big project I've been working on for years, and it isn't over yet. I'm a goal-oriented person, and worry that if I abandon the project now, I'll always regret quitting. I worry that if I stick it out, I'll be happy to have that accomplishment, and don't want to let her take that from me. I also worry about looking bad for quitting, and don't want to feel like she chased me out.
I can't figure out how to handle this situation. I am worried that if I don't leave, she may get the others to turn on me and end up humiliating me in some way, but I'm not sure if that's real or just paranoia based on my teenage experiences.
How can I sort through this and figure out what to do?
If you're a man, you red pill a woman. Act like a man and don't agree with whatever she says. Call her out on her behavior. In many cases I find it ideal to treat women I come across like an overgrown child.. you expect them to behave a certain way out of emotionalism and you scold them firmly but playfully. They'll respect you more for it than if you're a doormat who worships the ground they walk on. For all the talk about feminism, most women biologically seek out a man who is confident and will put them in their place from time to time.. playfully, of course.
It's like the conscious programming they receive tells them one thing while their animal urges tell them another. Thus they tend to be full of contradictions (let's not sugarcoat it.. most women are crazy. ). Many men are like this as well by the way... typically the ones who didn't have a lot of friends who called them out when they started to act like that. Men are supposed to be men, not be passive aggressive whiny kids who pout when they don't get their way.
Ok, I am going to go out on a limb here...and I am really just curious, but is your professional background "higher" or more successful than hers? Is your spouse more successful? Your children?
In women's groups/clubs/ organizations, oftentimes there is a "pecking order" based on several things. You mentioned popularity. Being a "Joiner" versus just joining in is another one. I imagine you to be in the "joining in" mentality versus Ms Popular and Sparkly's group of active "joiners", meaning that they latch on to the popular members/ the in crowd in the club.
This provides them with a ready made in-group, and an Identity.
I went thru this with an expat group. Hated.MY.Guts because I was able to secure employment anywhere my spouse was relocated to. Most places on the planet need medical staff, so I always found work. They didn't like that too much, since I worked and was not at their beck and call to do things for them. If their spouse was higher than mine in the corporate ladder, well, then I should "drop everything, and do as they wished, such as host a party when they wanted, how they wanted, etc." Said male spouse was always mature and played no such hierarchy games. No surprise here, men respect each other as a general rule and act accordingly.
And with me employed locally, we were able to make contacts with the local natives and were often asked to join their groups and clubs. So they were jealous. I never talked of work, never mentioned other groups or said activities.
One time, a gal said "do you have to work". No kidding......Ah, no, but why did I pursue a Ph.D if I did not want to take advantage of the world wide experience of working amoungst other cultures in other nations?
Sounds like the book "Queen Bees and wanna be's" but in this case, with supposedly fully mature, adult women. Sounds like the OP has been dealing with a few of these sorts all along
OP here - it's very similar to what you describe, I think. Although I don't see myself as above her in any way - it's just not in my nature to think I'm all that, but rather to see what's admirable about other people, and if anything I tend to wish I could be more sparkly and less professorish. But she might see things differently.
The only way you are going to find out why she does this, rather than guessing, is to ask her. This will require strong resolve on your part and the patience to bring Active Listening skills to bear.
In a low-distraction opportunity, when she does not have an audience, try something like, "I heard you say X earlier. What did you mean by that?"
Then it's Active Listening for you: Listening with full attention not only to what she says, but what else she may be trying to say. Accepting what she says without judgement. Nodding, or leaning forward to show her you are listening to every word. Later, paraphrasing what she says to check for meaning. Asking follow-up questions to learn her motivations, and whether you just seem like a soft target, or she actively dislikes you. Do not rush to respond; try to find out more and understand.
After this step, thank her for her explanations and her honesty. Then there may be the opportunity for you to say that you are there to serve the community, and do not enjoy being her "straight man." And that you will say so, clearly and unemotionally, if that sort thing happens in the future. Say that you're glad you can both be honest with each other.
The two of you may never be friends or really get along. But you will establish ground rules for what is acceptable. If your relationship is one of honest dislike, so be it. Do not worry about who is more popular. Your reasons for joining the group were service oriented, not social. However, if it becomes truly unpleasant to be part of this group, another will be happy to have you on your own terms. You have choices.
I have tried to talk to her and listen to her, but she refuses to speak with me. The only thing I'd be listening to are hysterical and childish insults. There is no possibility of communicating with her like an adult.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
). Many men are like this as well by the way... typically the ones who didn't have a lot of friends who called them out when they started to act like that. Men are supposed to be men, not be passive aggressive whiny kids who pout when they don't get their way.
