HOA Syndrome - Real or Fantasy (passive, complex, people)
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The Constitution did not specify brick buildings in Boston or Philly - but Ben Franklin did....after many fires.
You'll have to come up with something better.
I don't know about any brick issue but Franklin didn't do so through a private government. Interesting that you chose Franklin who is often quoted for the proposition that "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Isn't that exactly what you promote with an HOA - the false claim that the HOA will somehow protect property values? What a joke. No empirical evidence to support
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Originally Posted by craigiri
"unlimited assessments" - you do know that even regular zoning laws (non-HOA) often specify minimum house sizes (that would seem restrictive, right?) and building codes could require you to do 100's of thousands of dollars of work on even a SFH.
You do understand that a real government is limited by constitutional restraints, etc. right? An HOA is NOT a government so why give it standing and powers as a government? An HOA is not limited by constitutional restraints (as the city imposing zoning restraints is) - why would you support such a lack of restraint on something you want to give so much power to? In most states the HOA has absolutely no obligation whatsoever to the homeowners. In every state but one, the "right to vote" in an HOA doesn't exist at all. Instead it is a "privilege" that is suspended at the whim of the board. How does that "protect" anything other than a sitting regime?
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Originally Posted by craigiri
I have owned single family dwellings my entire life -but now one of our houses (we are chasing the sun) is part of a 12 unit Condo. I am on the board (against my will, but the Prez wants me there and he works very hard so I cannot refuse)....
We don't spend a penny more than we need to. There is a certain standard that the property was built to (plus codes, etc.) and we attempt (but fail) to keep it to that standard
Residents once asked us to give them a plan for the next 10+ years. We told them they wouldn't want to know how much needs to be spent, but they insisted and any decent plan would entail at least a doubling of the condo fees. People prefer special assessments and some figure they will move before the BIG bills come due.
Buying a condo was your mistake not mine. As mentioned elsewhere condos are purely creatures of statute. They are also subject to huge assessment increases and special assessments with little notice. There is no reason for an HOA to do the same.
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Originally Posted by craigiri
The same can be true of SFH...people can know all kinds of things about their houses and never tell you. It's up to you and the home inspector, neither of which are likely to find many systems which might be failing.
Pay me now or pay me later....
The SFH is your property. An HOA is demanding money for its property. Even worse they can borrow money using your home as collateral. Why would anyone voluntarily agree to provide their home as collateral for the HOA to go incur debt? Do you hand out signed checks with a blank amount for an HOA to fill out as it pleases? You have apparently yet to see the schemes utilized by management companies to extract money from homeowners entirely off the books of the HOA or the insurance racket (shared, capped coverage sold via the management company where other clients are unaware they are sharing coverage but each paying full premium - or who owns the policy...)
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Originally Posted by craigiri
I do agree that HOA's bring out the worst in some people. Even with just 12 part-time units, there is one couple who is COMPLETELY off their rockers (hate everyone and everything from day one) and two others who are PITA.
Condos are a different animal than HOA property in virtually every state
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Originally Posted by craigiri
I do prefer a single family house....and my hopes are to live out my later years only in that fashion. As Braveheart Chanted "FREEDOM".....
Well you won't have any if there is an HOA and why should you have to grovel to someone else to get "permission" to change your front door or paint your house, etc.
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Originally Posted by craigiri
The biggest ruse in American history is that a house is a good investment. Shiller calculated that the total rise in the last 150 years is something close to 1% per year.
Depends on where you live. One thing is for sure - an HOA does not protect or preserve value but in fact is the greatest threat to it.
I'm sure he means the president of the condo association. I can see that, it is hard to find good people to volunteer as it is often a thankless job.
I got that he was talking about the president of the association. What is creepy is the idea of his being there against his will because the president wants him there so that he cannot refuse. Even as a figure of speech it is telling and an odd structure to be in.
I got that he was talking about the president of the association. What is creepy is the idea of his being there against his will because the president wants him there so that he cannot refuse. Even as a figure of speech it is telling and an odd structure to be in.
I got that he was talking about the president of the association. What is creepy is the idea of his being there against his will because the president wants him there so that he cannot refuse. Even as a figure of speech it is telling and an odd structure to be in.
In a condo of 12 units, the current Prez owns three. I own one. Two are for sale.
Do the math. Ain't many people left that know how to count to sit on the Board.
The Prez spends countless hours for free doing stuff and I, who am only there when I feel like it, don't......
It's called being a human being. I told them I didn't want to "run again" and tried to get someone else to step up to the plate, but no one did.
Anyway, as with anything else, an HOA or a Condo isn't for everyone. I have never lived in a "development" - not even a "subdivision" my entire life. The condo is a part-time beach place which is in a "paradise" and we have definitely enjoyed our 10+ years owning it.
Still, it will likely be the first of our properties that we sell...just because it is costly. It has a pool and tennis and was built to very high standards...plus it has location, location and location.
Every time my wife mentions selling it, she goes there - opens the windows (it's in a windy place) and says "no way I'm selling this".....
My cousin lived in a little house in Coral Gables FL. You would never know it was part of an HOA - because there are no amenities, gates, private roads, etc.
But when I visited he came out and told me that if my car tire was even one inch on the grass, I would get a $100 fine from the HOA. I guess they would hold HIS house hostage against it.
On the other hand, I accept (and almost experienced) that "the state" can take your house if you forget to pay certain bills. There is always a higher authority and it's up to each family or individual as to whether they can live within the rules.
What would really get to me would be someone who goes and buys and lives in an HOA, but then intentionally decides that the rules don't apply to his place.
"Summarily, I believe that all HOA homeowners have been and continue to be damaged, victimized by the Capos and the Masters."
Wow...that's one of the craziest things I have ever read. I've lived in a HOA neighborhood for nearly 22 years and I have had zero contact with the Association board. Never been chided, never been fined, never been damaged (?) or victimized (??). And I don't know anyone who has. My kids play outside whenever they feel like it and I enjoy going to pick up the mail. Good grief, that article was just ridiculous.
You were lucky. While I can’t say we were victimized I saw plenty of others in our neighborhood targeted and the bullying and abuse inflicted on homeowners was at times astounding. If you were not liked by any of the board members, or you somehow got on their radar they made your life miserable for the tiniest infraction. They actually spent Sunday afternoons driving around the neighborhood looking for anything they could pick on. Hoa abuse is a real problem with little accountability and some states are looking to pass laws Man says battle with Olathe HOA proves need for proposed KS law | The Kansas City Star
They actually spent Sunday afternoons driving around the neighborhood looking for anything they could pick on. Hoa abuse is a real problem with little accountability and some states are looking to pass laws
HA, our board is going out today for that. I look at it this way... there are many residents here who do comply with the rules and it is not fair to the silent majority that some choose not to comply and there is no consequence.
I do think the HOA is an outdated thing and needs to be rained in. I suggest that they be rolled into government and the HOA fees simply become like taxes. Having a private little government that is not regulated and an entire industry is free to make money off of is not in anyone's interest.
A city in my area has a HOA association for the city. This allows for cheaper costs. If that were rolled into a gov't body costs could come down.
But I am done with HOAs going forward. I will stay on mine until I retire. Just so abuse doesn't happen.
HA, our board is going out today for that. I look at it this way... there are many residents here who do comply with the rules and it is not fair to the silent majority that some choose not to comply and there is no consequence.
I do think the HOA is an outdated thing and needs to be rained in. I suggest that they be rolled into government and the HOA fees simply become like taxes. Having a private little government that is not regulated and an entire industry is free to make money off of is not in anyone's interest.
A city in my area has a HOA association for the city. This allows for cheaper costs. If that were rolled into a gov't body costs could come down.
But I am done with HOAs going forward. I will stay on mine until I retire. Just so abuse doesn't happen.
Our neighbors had to repaint their garage doors because at a certain angle when the sun hits it it looks purple and purple is a banned color.
Years back I received a $500 fine for a dirty fireplace vent. The townhome was an end unit, and positioned in a way that was not visible from any other place in the community. To see it you practically had to jump a fence and lean over. There was no warning or friendly reminder, just a fine. And the soot was barely visible.
I ended up spending 5 minutes scrubbing it and then took a picture, sending it in with a letter saying there was no current violation so no fine applied.
Was I technically non-compliant with some soot? Yes. Was it totally ridiculous about how it was handled? Also yes.
The other idiotic thing was more recently when I parked in my driveway while I was cleaning my garage. The rules stated that you were in violation if you parked in the driveway and left your garage door open. In fact, the rules states that the garage door “must be kept closed at all times”. I asked the management company if people ever left their homes, because according to the rules as soon as someone opened their door to drive out they were technically in violation.
Rules I don’t mind. Poorly written and unevenly enforced ones are frustrating.
Professor Gary Solomon, formerly of College of Southern Nevada writes extensively about HOA Syndrome (link). Dr. Solomon describes a variety of symptoms that arise from residing in HOA's including "feeling angry much of the time, sleeping disorders and/or nightmares, fear of going to one’s own mailbox, paranoia,loss of identity,fear of allowing one’s children to play in their own neighborhood" and other symptoms.
I was wondering if others have read or had experience in this area. It's been raised in my HOA, and I wonder.
I'd have more of these feelings if I *didn't* live in an HOA.
Our HOA does a good job, in my opinion. They walk the fine line of not being too intrusive but still keeping the place looking nice.
Years back I received a $500 fine for a dirty fireplace vent. The townhome was an end unit, and positioned in a way that was not visible from any other place in the community. To see it you practically had to jump a fence and lean over. There was no warning or friendly reminder, just a fine. And the soot was barely visible..
My rules require a warning first and then, if you are fined, you have the right to appeal. Plus our fines are like $25.00 per violation.
But I am always stunned at what people send in on their appeal. They just rant and rave like crazy people. This is how it should go..
1. I was in violation.
2. This is the reason why.
3. It will never happen again.
99% of those... appeal granted.
But instead they:
1. Jack is in violation too (or they just say something like everyone is in violation too)
2. I should be forgiven any violation because i help out the young women here who need help (err did anyone ask you to.)
3. the rules are dumb.
And they are caught with another violation a day later.
Appeal denied.
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