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Old Yesterday, 01:08 AM
 
Location: Tucson/Nogales
17,505 posts, read 21,371,064 times
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That mass shooting in Las Vegas, with 600 people shot, doesn't seem to have deterred people from going there, not in the least. Las Vegas benefited from calling it an isolated incident.
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Old Yesterday, 04:55 AM
 
6,327 posts, read 2,939,154 times
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Yes. And to be clear, I cannot outrun a bullet nor the folks utilizing such a kill joy device. I value life and unlike some with the defeatist attitude of ...ohh well when it's my time to go..
I put a seat belt on when driving. I wear a helmet when on a motor cycle. I find that certain proven safety devices have been effective.
My town had its killing spree during the Civil rights riots. Military guns/tanks often guarding the streets. Smoke bombs and gun shots were the norm. But they called it military peace ...what a bizarre term to use when there was little peace and lives gunned down to prove who had the bigger ammo power.
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Old Yesterday, 06:07 AM
 
Location: Wonderland
45,476 posts, read 36,588,233 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FierceKaia View Post
I've lived in Denver/Aurora and I live in Las Vegas but I figure if it is my time to leave the earth that's it, I'm not going to worry about being killed in a mass shooting.

I tend to avoid crowds as a general rule as an introvert but I do shop at Wal-Mart sometimes...
I don't worry about being killed in a mass shooting though~

The thing I think about with these shootings is that people have guns, where were they when these young white boys were shooting up and killing people? It seems to counter the argument that a well armed society is safer, since no one stopped these boys with their guns!
A few years ago, there was a shooting at our local courthouse - in broad daylight an ex husband shot and killed his ex wife right in front of their son (in fact, he also shot the son but didn't kill him!), and then began a shootout right there on the town square. A man who lived downtown had a handgun (not sure what the perp had) and was licensed and tried to shoot the shooter, but he was shot and killed instead. The shooter was wearing a bullet proof vest.
https://www.kltv.com/story/2994393/t...-out-in-tyler/

Anyway, there are many true accounts of licensed gun owners stopping crimes and shootings with their weapons - I won't post them but they are easy to look up. But we don't know if there were any gun owners carrying guns with them in that WalMart that day. Contrary to popular belief, most Texans don't walk around "packing." Less than 4 percent of Texans are licensed to carry. In fact, you bring up Colorado and Nevada - both states have a higher percentage of gun licensed folks than Texas.

The WalMart is next door to a Simon Properties mall. Simon Properties prohibits weapons on their properties. The two places share a parking lot. Even if someone had a license, they would probably leave their gun in the car if they were going to both places - which considering it was the weekend before school starts, makes sense.
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Old Yesterday, 09:21 AM
 
754 posts, read 206,521 times
Reputation: 1927
Quote:
Originally Posted by notnamed View Post
My wife is starting to have this issue. Never big on crowds to begin with, but now mentions being afraid of going to a concert, movie theater, plays, ordering grocery delivery rather than going to the store, etc. And notes the security procedures when we do. If there's some spot checking of bags she gets nervous when her own purse is not checked as it shows not all of them are. Doesn't help that we've frequented several locations that have had mass shootings over the years.
You could try to re- focus her fears on something she could control: be prepared.
Train her to observe the exits, possible hiding places, silencing phone fast, etc- could make it a game? Look out for potential of someone hiding a gun?

Ask her to carry a light scarf and a few feminine supplies in her purse when she is out: a few of OB tampons of different size- on occasion one can plug a bullet hole to stop bleeding .
A feminine pad in a plastic wrapper can be used as well, plastic wrapper can help to cover hole in a lung if wounded. Our soldiers used these tricks.
A pair of nitrile gloves, if she needs to help someone, etc.
Very light weight, and she could help save a life of her own, or bystanders in a case of an accident, etc.
It may help her mentally to deal with her fears so she does not feel completely helpless.
It helps to have a plan, or it is at least a distraction.
Personally, I started to be afraid of drivers, especially young women seem to be “ off their rockers” - extremely aggressive

Last edited by Nik4me; Yesterday at 09:30 AM..
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Old Yesterday, 10:21 AM
 
769 posts, read 498,012 times
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It's not worth much but this is the part I personally can't get past (and online posters always gloss over this or twist it to be something else as many are prone to do but...)...

When I was in school in the 80's we all had guns in high school. It was normal. I got a gun when I was 12 (age to hunt with an adult) and 16 (age to hunt by yourself) We took them to school in our cars and trucks so we could go our target practice, clay pigeon or hunting. We took them into the actual school for hunter clubs! We fired guns in the 5th grade as part of the curriculum for hunter safety. Some teachers were likely armed in rural PA in those days.

There were still fist fights in the parking lot. There was bullying and belittling. But no one ever considered going out to their vehicle to get their gun and "get even" with someone. It never occurred to us.

But flip side violence was double then in the 70's and 80's. Mostly in the urban environments. So their is contradictory info and we have to accept it.

However as far as mass shootings or school shootings? Something has drastically changed in the last 40 years as far as disturbed young white males. And no one wants to talk about that. Soon as you start to explore it or express it, you get shot down. Guns = bad. Orange man = bad. Republican = bad. "You are obviously a 'ist or 'phobe.".

...but something has changed. The media is different then it used to be. I do think they contribute a great deal to the problem. The obsessive focus on the sensational feeds the machine. I don't know the right answer just like NO ONE does regardless of how much e-ink they spill. But something has most certainly changed.
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Old Yesterday, 11:33 AM
 
2 posts, read 112 times
Reputation: 16
Personally, i'm not afraid to go out. I will be a bit more aware of my surroundings but i'm not afraid.
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Old Yesterday, 11:51 AM
 
Location: East Midlands, UK
809 posts, read 286,150 times
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I'm more afraid of what creates those monsters in the first place.
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Old Yesterday, 12:45 PM
 
1,924 posts, read 764,529 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy-Cat-Lady View Post
I'm more afraid of what creates those monsters in the first place.
Their own personalities and therefore, what's in their heads. Two people will react very differently to the same stimulus. No one's upbringings are perfect and everyone goes through hurt as they grow up. Family members, classmates, and/or friends can and have all hurt us in one way or another. One can wallow and hide in their room, another can lash out and hurt others. I imagine these people are very emotionally sensitive and take hurt very personally. But to lash out to hurt another human being, there's a serious lack of emotion of how it feels to kill another person.

I suppose it's similiar to how some people can go through killing themselves, and the average person can't understand how they can go all the way. I suppose is the same with murderers, how the average person can't understand how they could go through with it.
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Old Yesterday, 01:56 PM
 
Location: Middle America
36,882 posts, read 42,204,772 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Loud View Post
It's not worth much but this is the part I personally can't get past (and online posters always gloss over this or twist it to be something else as many are prone to do but...)...

When I was in school in the 80's we all had guns in high school. It was normal. I got a gun when I was 12 (age to hunt with an adult) and 16 (age to hunt by yourself) We took them to school in our cars and trucks so we could go our target practice, clay pigeon or hunting. We took them into the actual school for hunter clubs! We fired guns in the 5th grade as part of the curriculum for hunter safety. Some teachers were likely armed in rural PA in those days.

There were still fist fights in the parking lot. There was bullying and belittling. But no one ever considered going out to their vehicle to get their gun and "get even" with someone. It never occurred to us.

But flip side violence was double then in the 70's and 80's. Mostly in the urban environments. So their is contradictory info and we have to accept it.

However as far as mass shootings or school shootings? Something has drastically changed in the last 40 years as far as disturbed young white males. And no one wants to talk about that. Soon as you start to explore it or express it, you get shot down. Guns = bad. Orange man = bad. Republican = bad. "You are obviously a 'ist or 'phobe.".

...but something has changed. The media is different then it used to be. I do think they contribute a great deal to the problem. The obsessive focus on the sensational feeds the machine. I don't know the right answer just like NO ONE does regardless of how much e-ink they spill. But something has most certainly changed.
I don't know. I was in school in the 80s and mid 90s. I lived rurally. People hunted. But nobody brought guns to school. I certainly didn't own one.

We had an extremely eccentric old history teacher with a Nazi fascination, and a penchant for weapon collecting. Today, he would likely be on watch lists. As a part of one lesson, he brought an antique firearm into class and demonstrated firing it. He was at that point relieved of his teaching duties in short order.
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Old Yesterday, 02:05 PM
 
Location: East Midlands, UK
809 posts, read 286,150 times
Reputation: 1735
Quote:
Originally Posted by sas318 View Post
Their own personalities and therefore, what's in their heads. Two people will react very differently to the same stimulus. No one's upbringings are perfect and everyone goes through hurt as they grow up. Family members, classmates, and/or friends can and have all hurt us in one way or another. One can wallow and hide in their room, another can lash out and hurt others. I imagine these people are very emotionally sensitive and take hurt very personally. But to lash out to hurt another human being, there's a serious lack of emotion of how it feels to kill another person.

I suppose it's similiar to how some people can go through killing themselves, and the average person can't understand how they can go all the way. I suppose is the same with murderers, how the average person can't understand how they could go through with it.
But some people deal with more of the negative effects of life from day one...i.e. rejection by peers, bullying, social exclusion or parents who either neglect or abuse them. In the case of Connor Betts, he had depression and OCD and a fixation with guns. He was rejected by his peers and subsequently, drew up a 'hit list'. What gets me is if they were aware of his problems 10 years ago when he was still a teenager, why didn't anyone intervene? I don't buy the excuse that there are no signs, because people (mostly boys or men) don't suddenly wake up and become mass killers. It's years of torment, loneliness, rejection and pain that they eventually externalise by either committing a violent act against others, or committing suicide, usually with a violent method.

I get how someone can reach that stage, because they become so lost inside their heads that they no longer see people as human beings, but rather the source of their pain and loneliness. And when you throw in a mental illness or undiagnosed developmental disorder, you have a real monster on your hands.


As someone who is marginalised, it's why I say I'm more afraid of the society we live in that creates these monsters than even the monsters themselves, because I know what it's like to stare into the abyss and feel like everyone hates you and I know what it's like to feel intense loneliness and envy of others. In my case though, I'm only capable of hurting myself or ending my own life as I have far too much empathy for others, even though on the other hand I do resent people and society.
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