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Old 12-13-2008, 11:37 AM
 
9,816 posts, read 19,021,080 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NotARedneck View Post
I

However, what I found is that once a man reaches 30, there are very few women available who are really worth the effort. They are single for a reason and unlike the single men, its not because they have been working hard to make themselves a better prospect. The female counterparts are long gone. A few are impossibly demanding, unwilling to settle and are high maintenance but I've not been part of that crowd. Mainly, its just that they have little to offer and many negatives.
I wouldn't disagree with your perspective. I guess what I would say is depends on where you live. I live in a very rural area now where at 18 you either join the army, go away to school, or get a low end blue collar job and/or the woman gets pregnant. There are many gals around here that by 23 have 3 or 4 kids. And we have grandmothers in their late 30's around here. Professional women that are educated and got themselves a decent job don't really exist around here. So in the 25-40 year old age group around here, the people that are here are married or if not the woman almost always has a few kids.

If you go to a larger town or city there are a lot of women in their 30's that went to college or beyond, got themselves a decent, professional job, set their own life up and suddenly they are 30+ wondering where the time went. I think women actually blossom in their 30's, if given time to, and I think the pickings are probably better. In their 20's they go through a conceited arrogant "it's all about me" phase and also lack some life experience and I find with a lot of them, unrealistic expectations about life, jobs, partners, money, etc.. I think in the 30's the fruit is ready to be picked.
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Old 12-13-2008, 11:51 AM
 
9,816 posts, read 19,021,080 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardius View Post
Whether you call it the sexual revolution or the feminist movement, one of the primary effects was to make marriage less appealing to men and to make being single more advantageous for men.

I don't know whether the sexual revolution/feminist movement really improved the lives of women or not. I am not a female. But I do know that it made marriage a really poor choice for men. Modernly, why should any male get married? What is in it for the guy? As far as I am concerned the primary effect of the sexual revolution/feminist movement was to encourage men to stay single.
It is.

I know women will blow their trumpet and have a cow, but I do ask what is in it for me? If I am going to put myself in that commitment and put the effort out then what benefits do I get in return for coupling with you?

When I was younger, 18-28, in all the relationships I had, it seemed like I did all the heavy lifting so to speak. Basically when I stood back and looked at it from the outside, essentially I was being bled of money, time and my health and didn't have anything to show for it. Admittedly, I had made some mistakes and there were things I needed to learn about myself, but once I had that Epiphany I began to view relationships differently.

For me to get married, I have to see the benefit of being in a legally binding couple. If there is no balance and it's all about the woman leeching off me and driving me up the wall, then why bother?
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Old 12-13-2008, 12:06 PM
 
Location: Eastern Missouri
3,054 posts, read 5,029,987 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
It is.

I know women will blow their trumpet and have a cow, but I do ask what is in it for me? If I am going to put myself in that commitment and put the effort out then what benefits do I get in return for coupling with you?

When I was younger, 18-28, in all the relationships I had, it seemed like I did all the heavy lifting so to speak. Basically when I stood back and looked at it from the outside, essentially I was being bled of money, time and my health and didn't have anything to show for it. Admittedly, I had made some mistakes and there were things I needed to learn about myself, but once I had that Epiphany I began to view relationships differently.

For me to get married, I have to see the benefit of being in a legally binding couple. If there is no balance and it's all about the woman leeching off me and driving me up the wall, then why bother?





I agree!
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Old 12-13-2008, 01:15 PM
 
822 posts, read 2,613,430 times
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Thanks everyone; I was afraid to peek at the answers until now - I mean, first of all, no one responded 10 seconds after I posted - what is that about? I'm not even divorced (yet), have a daughter in 1st grade, and have given her my total attention, but about a week ago a rigid, ultraprofessional man (profession I can't mention, ugh) just seemed interested in an "awkward-nervous-attentive" way and then my daughter even picked up on it (and never in her life has that been at issue; I've just been the "ultra-mom-mom"). And people say I'm very attractive and personable, but I would never say so. So I'm feeling a bit obsessive. Maybe the diversion is good for me. He just doesn't seem like a "player" - at all. He seems like someone who just thinks about his job 24/7 but I just left thinking "huh, what just happened?"
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Old 12-13-2008, 01:24 PM
 
Location: Houston, TX
17,032 posts, read 26,025,365 times
Reputation: 16166
Quote:
Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
I wouldn't disagree with your perspective. I guess what I would say is depends on where you live. I live in a very rural area now where at 18 you either join the army, go away to school, or get a low end blue collar job and/or the woman gets pregnant. There are many gals around here that by 23 have 3 or 4 kids. And we have grandmothers in their late 30's around here. Professional women that are educated and got themselves a decent job don't really exist around here. So in the 25-40 year old age group around here, the people that are here are married or if not the woman almost always has a few kids.

If you go to a larger town or city there are a lot of women in their 30's that went to college or beyond, got themselves a decent, professional job, set their own life up and suddenly they are 30+ wondering where the time went. I think women actually blossom in their 30's, if given time to, and I think the pickings are probably better. In their 20's they go through a conceited arrogant "it's all about me" phase and also lack some life experience and I find with a lot of them, unrealistic expectations about life, jobs, partners, money, etc.. I think in the 30's the fruit is ready to be picked.
And many women who are interested in getting married get very antsy about it at 30.
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Old 12-13-2008, 01:49 PM
 
1,020 posts, read 1,430,101 times
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I never found the distinction between players and non-players to be all that useful. Its sort of like the distinction between sluts and good girls. Modernly almost everyone is having sex before they get married. In one sense, all women are sluts and all men are players but in another sense no women is any more of **** than any other and no man is actually a player. Instead the sexual morality just changed and people are clinging to outdated language to put down sexual rivals.

If you assume that most people started being sexually active when they were about 16, and once they got sexually active, they probabably didn't stop. The older you are and the longer you have spent not being married, the more sex partners you are going to have had. The average 40 year old male who has never been married is going to have had sex with a lot of people. Is he a player? Do you see why I don't think the term is that useful?

If you like the guy, express interest. But realise the older you get and the older men get the less reasons either of you have to marry again. You have kids that you probably put before him in any potential marriage. Neither of you are 23 with no assets to your names. So mixing your financial situations is going to be more complicated. Both of you have been around enough to realise that marriage isn't just about love, but its a financial arrangement that may or may not be equally attractive for both partners to enter into.

Breaking up with a boyfriend is less expensive than a divorce because there are no lawyers involved with fees to be paid. So marriage starts out being a less attractive baseline option. From experience you know that marriage isn't forever. I can see the benefits of you getting married to a wealthier guy, but what does he get out of marrying you?

Remember marriage is a permenant transfer not only of your wealth but your earning potential to the spouse that makes less money. Marriage makes sense for the poorer spouse, but why should the wealthier spouse ever marry? To raise your kids who already have an existing father?

Women complain about guys having commitment issues. Why shouldn't they have committment issues? Generally men make more money than women. Marriage tends to create the biggest benefit in the spouse that make the least amount of money. Why wouldn't you have committment issues about a contract where you are getting the worst end of the deal?
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Old 12-13-2008, 02:18 PM
 
822 posts, read 2,613,430 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardius View Post
I never found the distinction between players and non-players to be all that useful. Its sort of like the distinction between sluts and good girls. Modernly almost everyone is having sex before they get married. In one sense, all women are sluts and all men are players but in another sense no women is any more of **** than any other and no man is actually a player. Instead the sexual morality just changed and people are clinging to outdated language to put down sexual rivals.

If you assume that most people started being sexually active when they were about 16, and once they got sexually active, they probabably didn't stop. The older you are and the longer you have spent not being married, the more sex partners you are going to have had. The average 40 year old male who has never been married is going to have had sex with a lot of people. Is he a player? Do you see why I don't think the term is that useful?

If you like the guy, express interest. But realise the older you get and the older men get the less reasons either of you have to marry again. You have kids that you probably put before him in any potential marriage. Neither of you are 23 with no assets to your names. So mixing your financial situations is going to be more complicated. Both of you have been around enough to realise that marriage isn't just about love, but its a financial arrangement that may or may not be equally attractive for both partners to enter into.

Breaking up with a boyfriend is less expensive than a divorce because there are no lawyers involved with fees to be paid. So marriage starts out being a less attractive baseline option. From experience you know that marriage isn't forever. I can see the benefits of you getting married to a wealthier guy, but what does he get out of marrying you?

Remember marriage is a permenant transfer not only of your wealth but your earning potential to the spouse that makes less money. Marriage makes sense for the poorer spouse, but why should the wealthier spouse ever marry? To raise your kids who already have an existing father?

Women complain about guys having commitment issues. Why shouldn't they have committment issues? Generally men make more money than women. Marriage tends to create the biggest benefit in the spouse that make the least amount of money. Why wouldn't you have committment issues about a contract where you are getting the worst end of the deal?
Yes, yes, good points lol. For me it's just a door maybe opening - just romantic feelings I haven't harbored in a very long time. I have an interesting separation agreement - if I stay married I keep the "best" health insurance (which I lose upon divorce, unless I pay a lot of $); if I re-marry, I lose an incredibly valuable pension on a man no company would insure, even 10 years ago (for a 20 year policy). I sound horrible, but I'm just trying to refute some of your financial assertions. He married me for my money, but I figured out how to safeguard it. I gave up a 6 figure salary to raise a child.
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Old 12-13-2008, 02:46 PM
 
9,816 posts, read 19,021,080 times
Reputation: 7537
Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardius View Post
Women complain about guys having commitment issues. Why shouldn't they have committment issues? Generally men make more money than women. Marriage tends to create the biggest benefit in the spouse that make the least amount of money. Why wouldn't you have committment issues about a contract where you are getting the worst end of the deal?
What a lot of women don't get when they complain about men that have "commitment issues", is that for most of us we don't fear commitment, we just don't want to be committed to YOU.

I am more than willing to get married, in fact I would love to be married and have children but I don't want to live out the rest of my days in stress dealing with a screaming meemie. I have to see that it will be a complimentary relationship, not a one sided relationship.

I know a lot of older guys that got married and now are divorced and are living in near poverty because the woman raked them over good. You know when I'm 55 or 60, I don't want to be starting over.
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Old 12-13-2008, 02:46 PM
 
23,910 posts, read 31,137,585 times
Reputation: 28539
Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardius View Post
I never found the distinction between players and non-players to be all that useful. Its sort of like the distinction between sluts and good girls. Modernly almost everyone is having sex before they get married. .... The average 40 year old male who has never been married is going to have had sex with a lot of people. Is he a player? Do you see why I don't think the term is that useful?
I don't consider a "player" or a "sl*t" to be someone that has slept with a certain number of people. However I DO consider the terms useful. Those words, for me and most of the people I know, refer to people that sleep "around". In other words, they are having sex with multiple partners withOUT their knowledge.
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Old 12-13-2008, 02:51 PM
 
23,910 posts, read 31,137,585 times
Reputation: 28539
Quote:
Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
What a lot of women don't get when they complain about men that have "commitment issues", is that for most of us we don't fear commitment, we just don't want to be committed to YOU.

I am more than willing to get married, in fact I would love to be married and have children but I don't want to live out the rest of my days in stress dealing with a screaming meemie. I have to see that it will be a complimentary relationship, not a one sided relationship.

I know a lot of older guys that got married and now are divorced and are living in near poverty because the woman raked them over good. You know when I'm 55 or 60, I don't want to be starting over.
I gave my ex a separation agreement that stated he had to pay NO child support until the divorce was final. We divorced five years later, and I paid for every cent of our legal fees as well. He was having a tough time financially, and I didn't want concerns about money to affect our relationship with our son. Not every man gets "raked" as you think.
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