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ok you savvey commuters...
out of these areas which commute would you choose to RTP (time plus fairly nice ride, open sailing but busy around RTP as opposed to bumper to bumper road rage all the way...)
1-Youngsville- off capital and 96
2- Clayton- (yeah, I know that ones crazy)
3- Garner- near lake Benson
4- Holly Springs
5- west of Hillsborough
6- Roxboro
We are one of those looking for small town large property as trade off for commute....
but as I'M the one commutting I'm a little bit nervouse
I do need to make sure you are aware what is heavier traffic here is not even remotely close to heavy traffic in any of the cities I travel to. Miami, Dallas, Philly, LA, Richmond, etc.
You need to add Atlanta and DC to that list. The traffic there is terrible!
for those saying there are free options.... it's not the point. The state is closing a road to get more people to pay tolls. I already have a major problem with this area being tolled, yet the rest of 540 is not..... 540 was never supposed to be a toll road, and they have selectively picked part of it and that sucks. I live in west Cary, I'll probably suck it up and use it but I'd rather not out of spite.... but not using it won't fix the issue.... it'll just cause them to jack up the rates after a year.
IMO, if they need toll money, they should of just made all of 540 a toll, pay a quarter to get on and make it easy. They'd get a lot more $$$ that way than just picking the western Wake section.
The argument by NCTA and NCDOT was that they couldn't afford to extend 540 to Apex and Holly Springs without incremental revenue from tolls on TriEX/147 south of 40 plus the segment of 540 between 54 and 55. Whether that was true or not, it convinced the General Assembly. Tolling the already-built 540 from 54 east towards RDU and North Raleigh would have generated an enormous stink. In that sense, users of 540 between 54 and 55 were victims of a cold political calculation. The General Assembly decided that there were enough of you for your money to add up, but not so many of you that it would have created a political mess.
The argument by NCTA and NCDOT was that they couldn't afford to extend 540 to Apex and Holly Springs without incremental revenue from tolls on TriEX/147 south of 40 plus the segment of 540 between 54 and 55. Whether that was true or not, it convinced the General Assembly. Tolling the already-built 540 from 54 east towards RDU and North Raleigh would have generated an enormous stink. In that sense, users of 540 between 54 and 55 were victims of a cold political calculation. The General Assembly decided that there were enough of you for your money to add up, but not so many of you that it would have created a political mess.
Calculus in the General Assembly. About as rare as earthquakes in Raleigh.
Time will tell, but it would be ironic if the toll revenues fall shy of the bond payments and the State needs to make up the difference. That will mean we essentially get to pay three different ways for this scheme.
for those saying there are free options.... it's not the point. The state is closing a road to get more people to pay tolls. I already have a major problem with this area being tolled, yet the rest of 540 is not..... 540 was never supposed to be a toll road, and they have selectively picked part of it and that sucks. I live in west Cary, I'll probably suck it up and use it but I'd rather not out of spite.... but not using it won't fix the issue.... it'll just cause them to jack up the rates after a year.
IMO, if they need toll money, they should of just made all of 540 a toll, pay a quarter to get on and make it easy. They'd get a lot more $$$ that way than just picking the western Wake section.
My understanding is that they tried to find a way to keep it open, but it wasn't logistically possible. I can't say how hard they tried, but it seems like a reasonable conclusion to me based on the layout of things.
They CAN'T toll all of 540...it's not permitted under federal law. The only existing portion they could toll is the piece of NC 540, under laws permitting such moves if necessary to make a new toll project work.
The fact of the matter is that there was no money to build the Western Wake portion of 540. It was either toll it or wait a decade or two until, maybe, the state could scrounge the money together.
for those saying there are free options.... it's not the point. The state is closing a road to get more people to pay tolls. I already have a major problem with this area being tolled, yet the rest of 540 is not..... 540 was never supposed to be a toll road, and they have selectively picked part of it and that sucks.
I agree completely and will not drive on the toll road. I am stubborn enough to add time to my commute out of principal. When the State was faced with laws preventing them from adding tolls to an existing road, they simply changed the laws. I will not pretend to have done all my homework and have all the facts, but my perception (again admittedly not based on in depth research) is that:
1) We pay taxes to generate funds for DOT use. How about some better budgeting and planning. Why build an exit from 540 to Davis drive only to tear it out in a few months. How much money was wasted on that alone? This whole toll scheme just feels like double dipping...
2) It seems like when reviewing toll options, the lawmakers looked at RTP with dollar signs in their eyes. What better way to guarantee an income stream than to control access to a large area of employers. People need to go to work day in and day out, lets make it a bit more time consuming to get there, and then offer a quicker route for a price. Does anyone really not believe that hitting a good chunk of commuters in one area was not part of the plan all along?
3) North Raleigh?? No, too many influential folks there. Tolling them would be a nightmare. Nope, they drive free (at least from tolls) unless they work in RTP.
4) Finally, isn't it amazing that the tolled section just happened to be moved down past Wal-Mart on 54. Cant have folks paying tolls to spend their money at Wally World.
The whole toll planning and execution reeks of unfairness. They have throttled traffic in and out of RTP and North/West Cary and slapped a price on easing the commute issues that they in turn created. Sure, there are options to the tolls (and I will pay the cost in time and frustration to use them).
Again, this is my perception... Pay taxes for good roads, and pay again if you want to use them. Yes, I realize that tolls are a way of life in the Northeast, and the rates here are much lower. But, that is why I do not live in the Northeast, and is anyone taking bets on how long it takes them to, "regrettably have to increase the toll rates"?
This is just the start folks. Rather than reign in the DOT and hold them accountable to budgeting and spending, the State has found a way to increase income... Once that happens, they will never look back.
The fact of the matter is that there was no money to build the Western Wake portion of 540. It was either toll it or wait a decade or two until, maybe, the state could scrounge the money together.
Well, in all honesty, it would be more accurate to say that NC DOT and legislature alleges this is a fact. They control the money and the forumla used to allocate money and for years they have made sure that
"podunkville" got plenty of nice multi lane highways if they ran near land they or their buddies controlled, which allowed them to develop and sell that land, while urban areas such as Raleigh and Charlotte paid the way.
So, had that money been allocated and used differently, whose to say what could have been done.
Why build an exit from 540 to Davis drive only to tear it out in a few months. How much money was wasted on that alone?
When the current 540 stub including the Davis Drive exit was designed, NCDOT had absolutely no idea when they would be able to extend it further, and in fact thought it would be on the order of a decade. And they specifically designed that exit so that they could reuse some of the ramps when 147 and the Western Wake section of 540 did come through. Actually sounds like they were pretty smart about it.
Quote:
Finally, isn't it amazing that the tolled section just happened to be moved down past Wal-Mart on 54. Cant have folks paying tolls to spend their money at Wally World.
As far as I know, the plan (once tolling was decided upon) was always to begin tolling after NC 54, because the next exit is the toll Triangle Parkway and the plan was to essentially have one continuous tolled facility coming down the Triangle Parkway and then onto the Western Wake section of 540. There was simply no justification for tolling the section between I-40 and 54.
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Calculus in the General Assembly. About as rare as earthquakes in Raleigh.
