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Old 03-14-2012, 07:12 PM
 
Location: Durham, NC
2,024 posts, read 5,903,347 times
Reputation: 3478

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeJaquish View Post
Salt Lake City
186,000 in the city. 2.234 million in the urban area
TRAX, State-operated accolade-winning light rail, funded by the Feds and property taxes and mostly sales taxes with expansion spurred by Winter Olympics.
1666/square mile
2.234 million population in the metro area
Passenger fare revenue provides about 13--14% of funding.

CAFR/2010 I'll leave this to the accountants.

But, TRAX shows the possible value of regional planning, a la discussion of running commuter rail to Oxford, Sanford, Lillington, Clayton, Creedmore, Rocky Mount, to cover 1600 square miles while population density and land acquisition costs are still much lower than Raleigh's.
FWIW, Salt Lake City is raised by transit boosters in the Triangle as being the best option for the Triangle to model -- largely because it allowed individual towns/cities to concentrate development into town-center models within each suburban community but have intracity connectivity to SLC and work centers. Despite the conservative nature of the state and metro, this has been seen as a smarter way to grow and transit has been popular in Salt Lake City.

Quote:
If the region continued along current growth trends, Gruber explained, it would add more than 300 square miles of development to meet the housing and commercial demand by 2040. Vehicle miles traveled would nearly double, from 49 million to more than 90 million per day, by 2030. By 2020, the cost of new infrastructure could balloon to more than $26 billion.

In just a few decades, a region known for its open space and outdoor lifestyle would be a mighty congested and costly place to call home. [...]

The focus on town centers and TOD isn’t just a selling point for baby boomers and Gen Y professionals who are looking for walkable, urban neighborhoods. It also placates conservative Utahans, who don’t want the government encroaching on their lifestyles with newfangled sustainability mandates. “Not everybody wants to live in a town center. That’s fine,” Gruber said. “But if we can develop in a more concentrated way, with new homes and jobs in town centers, we’re preserving the character of existing neighborhoods, too.”

How Salt Lake City Became a Leader in Transit-Oriented Development | Streetsblog Capitol Hill
This is the part that gets missed. Folks are so busy fearing "AGENDA 21" (whatever that is) that they don't think about what happens if we don't do transit. No one's forcing somebody in Apex to take transit. But with transit, and more people moving to city areas or new town centers (in places like Patterson Place in Durham -- whose funky roads are intended to support transit eventually -- or the NC 54 corridor in communities like Meadowmont), we keep Apex suburban.

If we add 1 million more people to the Triangle in 20 years, then Apex will be like Falls Church, Va. Suburban... but with lots of folks living further out, clogging Apex roads to get in to Raleigh, RTP and Durham. And with more density as single-family homes are worth more for the land under them and get turned into denser development.

The only people who lose from more transit? People who want to turn green fields in places like Harnett Co./Granville Co. into more subdivisions and shopping centers, IMO.
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Old 03-14-2012, 09:00 PM
 
3,375 posts, read 6,232,525 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peperoberto View Post
So where a region of absolutely homogenous folks that all think and behave the same? Now I'm really confused, because I always thought that everyone was an individual that had their own wants and needs. Boy, was I wrong!

You are setting up a false dichotomy. Building light rail does not mean that every person in the Triangle will have to take light rail. It means those that prefer to use rail will, and those that want to keep driving for whatever reason will as well. Even right now, with roads, not everyone takes a car to work. Some walk, a lot of people bike, and even more take the bus. Saying that light rail will eliminate the ability of folks to drive is a ridiculous scare tactic.
And guess what that will do. Allow us to reduce the need to widen our roads even more, and people could have shorter commute times (assuming light rail gets large enough). Its a win all around
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Old 03-30-2012, 04:05 PM
 
3,375 posts, read 6,232,525 times
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As opposed to make another thread

Raleigh group proposes electric transit on elevated tracks :: WRAL.com
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Old 05-01-2012, 07:13 AM
 
91 posts, read 210,089 times
Reputation: 105
I live in Durham and work in Raleigh. I could take a train IF I WANT TO GET HOME TWO HOURS AFTER MY SHIFT ENDS! I like the flexiblilty of my van as I can go directly home and sleep if I need to; I also like to meet up with friends for breakfast sometimes I go to appointments so a train would not work for me.
Also light rail runs on regular roads so accidents etc will make the train late. I do not have flex time and I have to be at work on time.
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Old 05-01-2012, 08:16 AM
 
Location: Downtown Durham, NC
915 posts, read 2,377,145 times
Reputation: 740
Quote:
Originally Posted by moodymoose77 View Post
I live in Durham and work in Raleigh. I could take a train IF I WANT TO GET HOME TWO HOURS AFTER MY SHIFT ENDS! I like the flexiblilty of my van as I can go directly home and sleep if I need to; I also like to meet up with friends for breakfast sometimes I go to appointments so a train would not work for me.
Also light rail runs on regular roads so accidents etc will make the train late. I do not have flex time and I have to be at work on time.

So there's quite a few misconceptions here. Let me clear them up.

1) The proposed light rail and commuter rail lines will *not* run on the streets. They will have dedicated rights-of-way. The only portion that will run on the street is on Erwin Rd in Durham, and for that portion the train will still have a dedicated right-of-way in the median. Accidents will not slow it down.

2) The light rail from Raleigh to Durham will be a shorter transit time than taking a car. This is all in the report.

3) Headways will be every 30 minutes for the commuter rail (Raleigh->Durham) and 15 minutes for light rail. I don't see why you think it will take 2 hours to wait for a train that comes every 15 or 30 minutes.
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Old 05-01-2012, 08:26 AM
 
4,598 posts, read 10,131,540 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peperoberto View Post
3) Headways will be every 30 minutes for the commuter rail (Raleigh->Durham) and 15 minutes for light rail. I don't see why you think it will take 2 hours to wait for a train that comes every 15 or 30 minutes.
Maybe he's talking about the current Amtrak train? I agree that it's pretty ridiculous there isn't an actual commuter train that runs between Durham and Raleigh during rush hour. If they would start that I could ditch my car!
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Old 05-01-2012, 10:43 AM
DPK
 
4,594 posts, read 5,700,879 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evaofnc View Post
Maybe he's talking about the current Amtrak train? I agree that it's pretty ridiculous there isn't an actual commuter train that runs between Durham and Raleigh during rush hour. If they would start that I could ditch my car!
Same here! I could bike to the downtown Raleigh station and then bike from the downtown Durham station. It makes me sad this doesn't exist.

I imagine my road rage / stress levels would plummet and I'd be such a happier person.
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Old 05-01-2012, 10:44 AM
DPK
 
4,594 posts, read 5,700,879 times
Reputation: 6220
Quote:
Originally Posted by moodymoose77 View Post
I live in Durham and work in Raleigh. I could take a train IF I WANT TO GET HOME TWO HOURS AFTER MY SHIFT ENDS! I like the flexiblilty of my van as I can go directly home and sleep if I need to; I also like to meet up with friends for breakfast sometimes I go to appointments so a train would not work for me.
Also light rail runs on regular roads so accidents etc will make the train late. I do not have flex time and I have to be at work on time.
I think you're misinformed on these accounts. See peperoberto's reply for an explanation.
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Old 05-01-2012, 03:29 PM
 
3 posts, read 2,199 times
Reputation: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by peperoberto View Post
So there's quite a few misconceptions here. Let me clear them up.

1) The proposed light rail and commuter rail lines will *not* run on the streets. They will have dedicated rights-of-way. The only portion that will run on the street is on Erwin Rd in Durham, and for that portion the train will still have a dedicated right-of-way in the median. Accidents will not slow it down.

2) The light rail from Raleigh to Durham will be a shorter transit time than taking a car. This is all in the report.

3) Headways will be every 30 minutes for the commuter rail (Raleigh->Durham) and 15 minutes for light rail. I don't see why you think it will take 2 hours to wait for a train that comes every 15 or 30 minutes.
You have to factor in the time it takes to get to where the train is from both home and work, in addition to the train ride. It's not just the train ride.
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Old 05-01-2012, 03:56 PM
 
Location: Downtown Durham, NC
915 posts, read 2,377,145 times
Reputation: 740
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lake Sumter Landing View Post
You have to factor in the time it takes to get to where the train is from both home and work, in addition to the train ride. It's not just the train ride.
And that's why train stations are being built where they serve the maximum number of folks. Look up "transit-oriented development", for example. Trains will be great for the number of folks that want to take trains, which believe it or not is a substantial number. Those that don't want to take trains can still slug it on the highway.

In Durham County, at least, a great majority of residents support public transit. Just look at the poll numbers. If Wake and Orange want public transit as well, then we'll see them pass the tax proposal. Hopefully they'll get a chance to do that in the Fall.
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