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Old 10-31-2013, 07:35 AM
 
Location: NC
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CARY: Wake schools looking at banning 'zero' grades, allowing late work | Education | NewsObserver.com

To me, this is just another in the long line of what I like to call the "p***ification of America" where we can't let anyone's feelings get hurt and we have to bend and break all sorts of time-proven rules and methods so that people are given way too many chances to avoid failure.

I mean seriously...now we are considering that teachers can't give out zeroes for lazy or no effort and allowing people to turn things in late? What happened to parenting, teaching, and having rules and deadlines? It's a critical part of life to learn that things must be done with proper effort and on a certain schedule. That's how the real world works. What are we setting these kids up for if we allow this?
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Old 10-31-2013, 08:17 AM
 
Location: Cary, NC
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Well, this system sure might have made it easier for Coach to have kept me academically eligible as I pursued my Basketball Diploma.
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Old 10-31-2013, 08:40 AM
 
Location: My House
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My concern is less with the zero/no zero issue than the issue of kids not completing assignments so that teachers can determine whether or not they are mastering the CONTENT.

Looks like the lowest grade would be a 50, which is hardly going to keep a kid who doesn't understand the material from passing the class. I'm not bothered by this change. Grades aren't as important as learning, anyway.
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Old 10-31-2013, 08:45 AM
 
Location: NC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meh_whatever View Post
My concern is less with the zero/no zero issue than the issue of kids not completing assignments so that teachers can determine whether or not they are mastering the CONTENT.

Looks like the lowest grade would be a 50, which is hardly going to keep a kid who doesn't understand the material from passing the class. I'm not bothered by this change. Grades aren't as important as learning, anyway.
I understand that this is a "redefinition" of what a zero or lack of doing something means, but I still think there is a valuable lesson to be learned when you simply don't do something and get a zero for it. The number zero has a negative association and that's a good thing when you're trying to encourage a kid to do something, I think.

I agree that learning is the important thing but the old system of grades, deadlines, etc. seems to have worked fine for our generation. Why do the entitled kids nowadays need special treatment and redefinition of the rules to avoid negative feelings? These kids live in a bubble. Part of the "learning" comes from failure, lack of adhering to a deadline, etc.
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Old 10-31-2013, 08:52 AM
 
Location: My House
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Originally Posted by RDUBiker View Post
I understand that this is a "redefinition" of what a zero or lack of doing something means, but I still think there is a valuable lesson to be learned when you simply don't do something and get a zero for it. The number zero has a negative association and that's a good thing when you're trying to encourage a kid to do something, I think.

I agree that learning is the important thing but the old system of grades, deadlines, etc. seems to have worked fine for our generation. Why do the entitled kids nowadays need special treatment and redefinition of the rules to avoid negative feelings? These kids live in a bubble. Part of the "learning" comes from failure, lack of adhering to a deadline, etc.
It worked fine FOR US. We have decent careers and nice homes. It didn't work for everyone. Plenty of dropouts and underachievers back in the day, too.

A good compromise might be to extend the time in which one could get a grade of 50 or higher so that kids are encouraged to complete the work, then, if it's not turned in by the last day of the extension? Zeros. Seems reasonable. There are times when kids switch off because the concept confuses them. Give them more time to grow that foundation before being hit with a zero.
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Old 10-31-2013, 08:56 AM
 
Location: NC
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Originally Posted by meh_whatever View Post
A good compromise might be to extend the time in which one could get a grade of 50 or higher so that kids are encouraged to complete the work, then, if it's not turned in by the last day of the extension? Zeros. Seems reasonable. There are times when kids switch off because the concept confuses them. Give them more time to grow that foundation before being hit with a zero.
Still a redefinition in my book. Why not just set a reasonable deadline to begin with - allowing enough time for 99% of students to "get it" and then after that, the standard system - you get zero if you turn in nothing or whatever grade you deserve based on the quality of the work.
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Old 10-31-2013, 09:06 AM
 
Location: The Carolinas
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I weep for the future, if this type of thing is allowed to go forward--the societal equivalent of a "participation trophy".

Can you imagine the even-more-entitled-feeling the next generations may have? . . . and trying to employ/compensate them?

"well, you missed the deadline--by a lot--and what you did provide to our clients proved useless. So, I'm going to give you an average raise this period."

We need more: "First prize is the Cadillac, second prize is the steak knives. Wanna guess what third prize is?".
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Old 10-31-2013, 09:17 AM
 
Location: My House
33,064 posts, read 26,880,121 times
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Originally Posted by RDUBiker View Post
Still a redefinition in my book. Why not just set a reasonable deadline to begin with - allowing enough time for 99% of students to "get it" and then after that, the standard system - you get zero if you turn in nothing or whatever grade you deserve based on the quality of the work.
Would this feel the same way if grades went from being 0-100 to being... I dunno... 1-4? (think EOG here).

I'm only asking because some teachers drop a grade or two every semester anyway... is that a free ride?

I'd be keen on dropping grades entirely and getting kids to actually learn the material. We'd have a better educated populace.
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Old 10-31-2013, 09:19 AM
 
Location: My House
33,064 posts, read 26,880,121 times
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Originally Posted by adams_aj View Post
I weep for the future, if this type of thing is allowed to go forward--the societal equivalent of a "participation trophy".

Can you imagine the even-more-entitled-feeling the next generations may have? . . . and trying to employ/compensate them?

"well, you missed the deadline--by a lot--and what you did provide to our clients proved useless. So, I'm going to give you an average raise this period."

We need more: "First prize is the Cadillac, second prize is the steak knives. Wanna guess what third prize is?".
But... this is about teaching kids what they need to know to become productive members of society. It's not about holding those who already learned what they needed to know as a baseline to actually perform and not slack off. I see these things differently.

And I don't even want to get into participation trophies. I'm for scoring in sports. Why not? It's extracurricular activity.

Nobody HAS to be on a baseball team.

Kids MUST attend school.
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Old 10-31-2013, 09:33 AM
 
Location: NC
2,872 posts, read 4,961,464 times
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Originally Posted by meh_whatever View Post
Would this feel the same way if grades went from being 0-100 to being... I dunno... 1-4? (think EOG here).

I'm only asking because some teachers drop a grade or two every semester anyway... is that a free ride?

I'd be keen on dropping grades entirely and getting kids to actually learn the material. We'd have a better educated populace.
Again, I know and agree that the end goal is knowledge and being able to apply that knowledge, but in the real world the only way we have to make sure that kids are doing that in a reliable manner that can be compared and analyzed elsewhere is grades and testing. For anyone other than WCPSS to be able to figure out if the kid knows this or that, how else are we going to do it? What colleges will be interested in looking at a teacher-written essay extolling the virtues of the kid who knows all of the material but somehow couldn't turn in assignments on time or do well on tests that are designed to prove the knowledge?
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