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Old 11-12-2015, 06:21 PM
 
Location: Cary
2,466 posts, read 2,827,781 times
Reputation: 2751

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What a crazy thread. My population killing, disease festering, global warming causing, unease in the middle east creating, indoor/outdoor cats will continue their course of doom and destruction. They're females and stay close, so the apocalypse is limited to my 1/4 acre. Keep your birds and coyotes out of my yard and we'll all be in peace and harmony, kinda like the people in the Coca Cola commercial from 1971.
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Old 11-12-2015, 06:53 PM
 
Location: US
274 posts, read 143,253 times
Reputation: 490
[quote=Lycaon pictus;41903532]By your username can I assume you are a cat person? I'm a dog person. Nice to meet ya! I am also a biologist, and I can tell you that you are wrong about cats.

Actually, I also own a very much loved Beagle. And thank you very much for your opinion, but you are wrong about cats.

You're only kinda wrong about coyotes. They will eat most of those animals...but very rarely deer (they're more a threat to fawns) and almost never foxes. But coyotes aren't considered a threat to wildlife, because they are wildlife. Granted, they can be a nuisance in some places--the same way crows, or gulls, or raccoons can be. But they are nowhere near the invasive pest that cats are, sorry.


Sorry But,
I am not kind of wrong about coyotes. I have been in an area with some coyote dens, it's right in the middle of a large populated city in a small wooded area. I had to step over two dead foxes and a raccoon while I was there. They most definitely do kill a lot of foxes I would have thought being a biologist you would have known that fact! If you need to learn about the problems caused by coyotes killing fox:

As coyotes take over their ranges in North America, red fox populations are plummeting, and researchers have found one surprising result: The drop is fueling the spread of Lyme disease.

Missing Foxes Fuel Lyme Disease Spread | Red Fox & Coyote Populations

Bats are the most common vector of rabies to human hosts.

If you are referring to the sea otters, being affected by T. gondii they also become ill from Sarcocystis neurona which you should know. And you should also know that sea otters from unpopulated coastlines are less healthy and more exposed to parasites than city-associated otters. The spillover from wildlife, not pets, dominates spatial patterns of disease transmission.

The coyote is the biggest threat to natural wildlife hands down. There isn't a squirrel, rabbit, fox, opossum where these coyotes live and the list goes on. They do kill deer when they are in a pack they run them down for so long the deer succumbs due to exhaustion.
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Old 11-12-2015, 06:59 PM
 
122 posts, read 94,665 times
Reputation: 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by senecat View Post
There are only 10-20 billion birds in the U.S if cats were killing them at the pace this suggests there wouldn't be any birds left LOLOLOLOLOL
How did you get that math?

Also, the birds do breed each year, so they make new birds. Just less and less new birds each year. That's how populations decline over time.

Quote:
The coyote is the biggest threat to natural wildlife hands down. There isn't a squirrel, rabbit, fox, opossum where these coyotes live and the list goes on. They do kill deer when they are in a pack they run them down for so long the deer succumbs due to exhaustion.
No they aren't. Because again, coyotes are natural wildlife. Coyotes and foxes compete for prey, and coyotes may displace them in the same way that wolves displace coyotes, but I promise you the fox population is just fine. The squirrel, rabbit, fox, and opossum population is fine stable in almost every place in the US. The deer population is better than stable, because of humans have removed most of their predators from the ecosystem. Deer overpopulation is bad for our under story, because a herd of deer can clear every single plant from the ground up. This is horrible for ground nesting birds, small mammals that rely on brushy habitat to live and forage in, soil erosion, and the plant species themselves. Any deer coyotes kill--which is comparatively few--is a good thing. It is nature working the way it is supposed to.

The marine life I was referring to were seals, actually. Not sea otters. Specifically the ones in Hawaii. Like I said, feral cats have the biggest impact on island communities and sensitive habitats. Mittens killing a cardinal or vole in suburbia is less of a problem than the 300-deep feral cat colony spreading disease in Hawaii, or the other one that has set up shop near a wildlife sanctuary, or the ones in FL that prey on ground-nesting seabird colonies.

You are correct that bats are also a rabies vector. That is why I said cats can spread rabies to wildlife, and also contract diseases from wildlife, which they can then spread to humans.

I understand that you don't like coyotes, but they are native wildlife. Cats are not. They have no place in a healthy ecosystem, and if a coyote (or owl, or hawk, or fox, or disease,) kills one, it's not personal. It's just wild animals doing what wild animals are supposed to be doing. Mittens should be doing what it is supposed to be doing, namely napping on a window sill, or chasing a ball of yarn.

Last edited by Lycaon pictus; 11-12-2015 at 07:13 PM..
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Old 11-12-2015, 07:01 PM
 
Location: US
274 posts, read 143,253 times
Reputation: 490
[quote=adlnc07;41903813]

Bring on the coyotes! ;-)

BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU WISH FOR!
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Old 11-13-2015, 06:38 AM
 
Location: US
274 posts, read 143,253 times
Reputation: 490
[quote=Lycaon pictus;41910983]


No they aren't. Because again, coyotes are natural wildlife. Coyotes and foxes compete for prey, and coyotes may displace them in the same way that wolves displace coyotes, but I promise you the fox population is just fine.

Apparently you didn't read the article explaining as coyotes take over their ranges in North America, red fox populations are plummeting, and researchers have found one surprising result: The drop is fueling the spread of Lyme disease.

They aren't just displacing them they are annihilating them.

I understand that you don't like coyotes, but they are native wildlife. Cats are not. They have no place in a healthy ecosystem

So according to your reasoning most people in the US have no place in a healthy ecosystem here because they are not indigent people. Nothing natural about all the transplants from other countries that took over like a bunch of locusts.

I never said anything about not liking a particular animal, just stating the problems that are occurring as the number of coyotes is rising exponentially. Coyotes are creeping into areas of large populations of people and since you say you are a biologist why then wouldn't you see a problem with this?
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Old 11-13-2015, 07:04 AM
 
Location: Carolina Shores NC
5,982 posts, read 7,363,619 times
Reputation: 4590
My next door neighbor's "barn cat" killed chipmonks, moles and mice mostly. It's the hawks killing and eating all the birds.
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Old 11-13-2015, 07:28 AM
 
Location: Chapel Hill, N.C.
36,434 posts, read 41,620,437 times
Reputation: 46994
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poggly Woggly View Post
My next door neighbor's "barn cat" killed chipmonks, moles and mice mostly. It's the hawks killing and eating all the birds.
YES! Everybody automatically blames cats for any dead bird they see. Snakes get into nest to get eggs and baby birds too.

Still I think cats should be kept inside.
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Old 11-13-2015, 07:36 AM
 
Location: Carolina Shores NC
5,982 posts, read 7,363,619 times
Reputation: 4590
Quote:
Originally Posted by no kudzu View Post
YES!

Still I think cats should be kept inside.
I think so too although I don't complain to my neighbor about his cat. I haven't had to set a mouse or chipmonk trap since they moved in.
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Old 11-13-2015, 08:38 AM
 
Location: US
274 posts, read 143,253 times
Reputation: 490
More pet owners should invest in an outdoor enclosure for their pets if they can afford to. Of course it should be coyote proof and the pets still need to be monitored for any problems going on outside. I was told they are becoming more popular not just for cats, but also dogs to protect them from the coyotes.
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Old 11-13-2015, 10:42 AM
 
Location: San Diego
32,799 posts, read 30,034,103 times
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Mine are in-out door cats. They'll get out often even if we tried. Yes, they get a few birds every year. Yes, the Coyotes are a problem in some areas but not overall. Here the Coopers Hawks pick off more birds than anything. Our biggest problem is the dang Crows at nesting time. They kill every young bird and egg they can get.

As far as the local wildlife we now have a ban on hunting Mt Lions and they are taking a toll on local herds. It's odd because they get a lot of the bigger Bucks since the Bucks are solitaire and easier to sneak up on than a herd of Does.

Nothing messes with the big local Raccoon population, not even the Yotes.
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