Wife and I - Moving to Raleigh to Start Family from Massachusetts (need your advice) (Durham: chapel, house)

[RaleighRob]

Originally Posted by Bear717

okay so im way way confused... Cary is a little metropolis of its own?

Bah...Cary's in a universe of it's own.

[MikeJaquish]

Cary is a fantastic place in many ways, IMO, although it inspires strong love/hate reactions.
Cary had 3600+/- population in the 1970 census, I believe.
Today they claim 117,000.
Raleigh has enough Yankees without gaining a 'suburb' of them.

More seriously, Cary is seen as aggressive and imperialistic with its growth ambitions. That seems to aggravate the neighbors who are minding their own business.
Part of the issue is how state law allows town annexation willy-nilly with myriad un-annexed areas known as "doughnut holes."
Chatham County is getting a little tense as Carydevelopment/annexation crosses the County line.

"Beigeness" is a common local insult referring to blandness. Neighborhoods, interiors, plazas, big boxes tend to be colorless, by taste and fiat. You will never hear Cary referred to as "funky" or "edgy." "Safe" is the watchword in all endeavors.

The Circus Ice cream shop and burger joint on East Chatham could never be duplicated today. Some folks consider that a good thing, and they have access to power. The Char-Grill is opening up in the new Fresh Market Plaza. That will be a perversion of all that is right in the world...

Common conversation:
"I live in Cary."
"Oh, I'm sorry," often said in sincerity.
Love/hate.

[Desdemona123]

Originally Posted by MikeJaquish

Common conversation:
"I live in Cary."
"Oh, I'm sorry," often said in sincerity.
Love/hate.

LOL....yes, it is a love/hate sort of thing. My favorite bartender on the coast is from a native Cary family. I tease him that I didn't know they still allowed those.

It is a nice area though and shouldn't be avoided...even if it is a universe all it's own.

[raleighnative]

Basically, the larger "suburban" areas of Wake County are North Raleigh and Cary, with Holly Springs and Wake Forest close behind them. Cary and North Raleigh probably have a few more amenities, like recreational facilities and cultural programs that are close in proximity. But all of the 12 municipalities in Wake County are centered around downtown Raleigh in a way. Besides Raleigh, there are eleven additional towns/cities in their own right, so they do not consider themselves technically suburbs of Raleigh. They have their own elected governments and chambers of commerce. North Raleigh is part of Raleigh. "North Raleigh" also includes the unincorporated portion of northern Wake County in many residents' minds. You have a Raleigh address, but you live outside the city limits and don't pay city taxes in addition to county taxes. The municipalities in Wake County are Raleigh, Cary, Apex, Holly Springs, Fuquay Varina, Garner, Knightdale, Zebulon, Morrisville, Wake Forest, Rolesville, Wendell. I certainly hope I didn't leave anyone out

Believe it or not, there are still some southern country characteristics to some of the smaller muncipalities - Wendell, Knightdale, Fuquay Varina, Garner, Rolesville, Zebulon. To give you an idea of this, Wendell just this week passed an ordinance prohibiting keeping livestock within the town limits. So, no horses if you live inside the Wendell town limits now Wake Forest to some degree is trying to hold onto its southern flare although many people are moving in there from outside of NC, which tends to attract a different type of development to provide for the changing demand.

I've lived in North Raleigh for over 40 years. I've liked it because it is convenient to almost everywhere.... except Apex or Fuquay Varina. And they really aren't too far of a drive either. With 540 open, North Raleigh is very convenient to RTP, plus there is great shopping, you are 15 minutes away from downtown cultural events (if you know the old timers' shortcuts). I have lived west of Capital Blvd and north of the 440 Beltline in several different neighborhoods. It is getting a little hectic and crowded, as I believe it is getting in Cary and other areas, because people are moving in faster than the towns and county can keep up with.

The Falls Lake Watershed is located in this area which limits the number of trees that can be cut down and the size of the lot for each house, so it is nice and wooded and green, even though there are a lot of subdivisions.

You mentioned a home in the $200K to $250K range. One neighborhood that I love that you might want to look in is North Hills. There is also Greystone and North Ridge (you can find some bargains in North Ridge - but there are also multi million dollar homes in this area). These are established, stable neighborhoods. There are newer ones that I don't know as well that could also be of interest.

Don't pick your home based on schools, because the growth makes the school system reassign students to different schools, so just because you are slated to go to a school one year, doesn't guarantee that you will go there the next year. They try not to move everyone all the time, but they are trying to catch up with the huge growth and they have to move students to use the limited space they have right now. Also, assigned 4 track year round schools are being used, so if that is a potential interest for you - you may want to check out the areas where schools are being converted to or opening on a year round calendar (45 days in school, 15 days out - all year long - no summer break). It's been a bit controversial, but some families like it, while others really dislike it.

Good luck!

[Grass Is Greener]

Originally Posted by raleighnative

Basically, the larger "suburban" areas of Wake County are North Raleigh and Cary, with Holly Springs and Wake Forest close behind them. Cary and North Raleigh probably have a few more amenities, like recreational facilities and cultural programs that are close in proximity. But all of the 12 municipalities in Wake County are centered around downtown Raleigh in a way. Besides Raleigh, there are eleven additional towns/cities in their own right, so they do not consider themselves technically suburbs of Raleigh. They have their own elected governments and chambers of commerce. North Raleigh is part of Raleigh. "North Raleigh" also includes the unincorporated portion of northern Wake County in many residents' minds. You have a Raleigh address, but you live outside the city limits and don't pay city taxes in addition to county taxes. The municipalities in Wake County are Raleigh, Cary, Apex, Holly Springs, Fuquay Varina, Garner, Knightdale, Zebulon, Morrisville, Wake Forest, Rolesville, Wendell. I certainly hope I didn't leave anyone out

Believe it or not, there are still some southern country characteristics to some of the smaller muncipalities - Wendell, Knightdale, Fuquay Varina, Garner, Rolesville, Zebulon. To give you an idea of this, Wendell just this week passed an ordinance prohibiting keeping livestock within the town limits. So, no horses if you live inside the Wendell town limits now Wake Forest to some degree is trying to hold onto its southern flare although many people are moving in there from outside of NC, which tends to attract a different type of development to provide for the changing demand.

I've lived in North Raleigh for over 40 years. I've liked it because it is convenient to almost everywhere.... except Apex or Fuquay Varina. And they really aren't too far of a drive either. With 540 open, North Raleigh is very convenient to RTP, plus there is great shopping, you are 15 minutes away from downtown cultural events (if you know the old timers' shortcuts). I have lived west of Capital Blvd and north of the 440 Beltline in several different neighborhoods. It is getting a little hectic and crowded, as I believe it is getting in Cary and other areas, because people are moving in faster than the towns and county can keep up with.

The Falls Lake Watershed is located in this area which limits the number of trees that can be cut down and the size of the lot for each house, so it is nice and wooded and green, even though there are a lot of subdivisions.

You mentioned a home in the $200K to $250K range. One neighborhood that I love that you might want to look in is North Hills. There is also Greystone and North Ridge (you can find some bargains in North Ridge - but there are also multi million dollar homes in this area). These are established, stable neighborhoods. There are newer ones that I don't know as well that could also be of interest.

Don't pick your home based on schools, because the growth makes the school system reassign students to different schools, so just because you are slated to go to a school one year, doesn't guarantee that you will go there the next year. They try not to move everyone all the time, but they are trying to catch up with the huge growth and they have to move students to use the limited space they have right now. Also, assigned 4 track year round schools are being used, so if that is a potential interest for you - you may want to check out the areas where schools are being converted to or opening on a year round calendar (45 days in school, 15 days out - all year long - no summer break). It's been a bit controversial, but some families like it, while others really dislike it.

Good luck!

One of the best posts I've read in this forum!

[Bear717]

Originally Posted by raleighnative

Basically, the larger "suburban" areas of Wake County are North Raleigh and Cary, with Holly Springs and Wake Forest close behind them. Cary and North Raleigh probably have a few more amenities, like recreational facilities and cultural programs that are close in proximity. But all of the 12 municipalities in Wake County are centered around downtown Raleigh in a way. Besides Raleigh, there are eleven additional towns/cities in their own right, so they do not consider themselves technically suburbs of Raleigh. They have their own elected governments and chambers of commerce. North Raleigh is part of Raleigh. "North Raleigh" also includes the unincorporated portion of northern Wake County in many residents' minds. You have a Raleigh address, but you live outside the city limits and don't pay city taxes in addition to county taxes. The municipalities in Wake County are Raleigh, Cary, Apex, Holly Springs, Fuquay Varina, Garner, Knightdale, Zebulon, Morrisville, Wake Forest, Rolesville, Wendell. I certainly hope I didn't leave anyone out

Believe it or not, there are still some southern country characteristics to some of the smaller muncipalities - Wendell, Knightdale, Fuquay Varina, Garner, Rolesville, Zebulon. To give you an idea of this, Wendell just this week passed an ordinance prohibiting keeping livestock within the town limits. So, no horses if you live inside the Wendell town limits now Wake Forest to some degree is trying to hold onto its southern flare although many people are moving in there from outside of NC, which tends to attract a different type of development to provide for the changing demand.

I've lived in North Raleigh for over 40 years. I've liked it because it is convenient to almost everywhere.... except Apex or Fuquay Varina. And they really aren't too far of a drive either. With 540 open, North Raleigh is very convenient to RTP, plus there is great shopping, you are 15 minutes away from downtown cultural events (if you know the old timers' shortcuts). I have lived west of Capital Blvd and north of the 440 Beltline in several different neighborhoods. It is getting a little hectic and crowded, as I believe it is getting in Cary and other areas, because people are moving in faster than the towns and county can keep up with.

The Falls Lake Watershed is located in this area which limits the number of trees that can be cut down and the size of the lot for each house, so it is nice and wooded and green, even though there are a lot of subdivisions.

You mentioned a home in the $200K to $250K range. One neighborhood that I love that you might want to look in is North Hills. There is also Greystone and North Ridge (you can find some bargains in North Ridge - but there are also multi million dollar homes in this area). These are established, stable neighborhoods. There are newer ones that I don't know as well that could also be of interest.

Don't pick your home based on schools, because the growth makes the school system reassign students to different schools, so just because you are slated to go to a school one year, doesn't guarantee that you will go there the next year. They try not to move everyone all the time, but they are trying to catch up with the huge growth and they have to move students to use the limited space they have right now. Also, assigned 4 track year round schools are being used, so if that is a potential interest for you - you may want to check out the areas where schools are being converted to or opening on a year round calendar (45 days in school, 15 days out - all year long - no summer break). It's been a bit controversial, but some families like it, while others really dislike it.

Good luck!

wow!!! thank you so much. im begining to get this beautiful glimpse of the raleigh area, seriously you have helped me out majorly!! you guys and girls in NC are absolutely fantastic!!

(i will write more when i'm not at work )

[zenlife7]

Wow, I also like to thank for this post. I had question concerning the area around Raleigh and now I have a good picture of what to expect and not. Thanks again.

[ajandrews3]

Cary is a satellite town of Raleigh just as Knightdale, Wake Forest, Clayton, Garner and all the rest are since they all surround Raleigh. Cary would be the town that is the most well established of the towns around Raleigh and has the oldest money in the area besides Raleigh and of course Chapel Hill (that's an entirely different string). Cary is not a small metropolis of it's own but it does have it's own "culture". The beige remark refers to the "rules" that Cary has about colors shop's can use for their stores. It's not that they have to use beige but they do have to conform to the current standards of Cary such as putting a thousand trees infront of a business so you can hardly see it. Basically it makes Cary a very aesthetic place to look at, no crazy neon signs or anything like that, with well manicured lawns and the like. People may refer to it as a bit on the high society end or "snooty" at times and it has also become known as C.A.R.Y. Containment Area for Relocated Yankees (haha). Someone from the Chestnut Hill area would fit right in certain neighborhoods in Cary but there are also plenty of average people there as well. I lived in Cary back in 1997 and loved it do to it's relation to Raleigh, the cleanliness of the town, lack of overhead power and phone lines and the amount of stores and restaurants. The downside to Cary is that there is now a lot of people living there and traffic can be a bit of a nightmare but that is the case almost everywhere in the Raleigh area now. I live in Clayton and purchased my home there due to cost reasons (mainly I couldn't afford what I wanted in Cary) and had some reservations back in 1998 but things have really grown and keep growing in Clayton. That goes for almost every town that surrounds Raleigh. Commute times have almost doubled in the last 8 years and the road projects can't seem to keep up. So my advice to you would be to first find out where you are going to be working first and ask yourself how long of a commute you want to take to work. Second, how much land do you want and how much bang for the buck would you like. Cary and North Raleigh are the hot tickets items these days but you can find expensive ($500k +) homes in any town around Raleigh and you can also find modest and inexpensive homes in those towns as well. It really is a great area. If you have children, the school systems are another factor. Johnston county schools are probably not as good as Wake county schools, but Wake is having a time with all the new kids and they are shuffled around like chess pieces these days as well as the whole thing with the system potentially going to "year round" schedule. (look it up) There are also plenty of private schools in the area. The last thing I am going to point out would be how much b.s. you want to put up with (rules and limitations). Johnston county is really still on the verge of country living except for Clayton, you can still pretty much do what you want with your land and no one is going to give you a hard time 'cause you chopped down your tree or burned your leaves. There are many subdivisions in Raleigh and Cary that you are not going to be able to make home modifications or rearrange your flower beds without approval from the homeowners associations (exaggeration but you get the drift). But then again, you could have a community in any county that has strict covenants. There are so many choices here that it is really hard to give anyone a simple answer, it all depends on what you needs are followed by your wants. I lived in the Worcester area all my life until I left for the Army and found that I definitely did not "want" to live in MA any more. The weather makes up for anything that you would miss in MA 10 months out of the year. The other two months, go on vacation or stay indoors. - T

[abdnva]

ajandrews gave a good clarification of the Cary comment. Once you move to the area, you will quickly realize the interplay between the various areas of Raleigh, as well as the nearby cities/towns/villages.

Forty years ago, Raleigh was a very sleepy southern town. Then IBM opened a location there, and transferred a lot of people from their northern offices into Raleigh. Most of them settled just north of the beltline in 'North Raleigh'. Same town, just a different area. This was the first of many major influxes (sp?) of 'outsiders'. The growth of RTP (Research Triangle Park) added to this. In the late 80's, Cary began growing from a small one traffic light suburb of about 10K population to something along the lines of 80K+ population now. This due to the influx of high-tech jobs. Most of those were filled by people from the North. In the 90's & 00's, you saw all areas in & around Raleigh experience rapid growth. The eastern part of the county being the least affected, with the western & northern parts of the county being the most affected, as they were nearest to the higher income jobs.

Probably as a result, you have little 'inside jokes' that have developed in the friendly rivalries between the communites. For example - People who live 'inside the beltline' are all elitist snobs who desire nothing more than achieving 'historical recognition' for the old houses they have rehabbed, so that they can make a fortune off re-selling them. People in Cary are all yankees who want everything to be as Stepford/homogenized as possible. people in Chapel Hill are all tree-hugging communistic liberals. People in Clayton are all rednecks or yankees who mistakenly thought they were moving to the 'cheap' part of the Triangle, only to deal with L.A.-type traffic jams on I-40 heading to work. People in NoRa (North Raleigh) are all IBM kids who hate the 'newcomers', despite having once been newcomers themselves. People in Durham refuse to acknowledge they live in a southern version of Detroit. People in Knightdale & all points east are the only remaining rednecks who watch Andy Griffith every night, and curse the fact that Knightdale Seafood & barbecue moved into a 'fancy' new location. They also all miss the old Winn Dixie.

Those are all generalities that bear a thread or two of truth, along with a tapestry of exagerration.

Bottom line, the Raleigh area is a great place to live. Lots & LOTS of things to do, fantastic education for your children, by any standards. A fairly diverse mixture of cultures. No matter your preference, you can find something that accomodates your tastes, while still encouraging you to broaden your horizons. People tend to be friendly, too. It's not the same Raleigh as portrayed in 'Andy Griffith' back in 1963, but it does have a lot of charm. The winters are VERY mild. You may have the occasional 2-3" snow in Jan/Feb, but by the next day (or that afternoon) it has melted away. I've played golf on both Thanksgiving & Christmas afternoon more years than not, and I don't play in freezing weather. You can basically play golf, or hike/bike or grill out virtually every 48-50 weeks of the year. The summers are hot & humid, but the winters are pleasantly mild. No down parkas required.

You'll probably only meet one person who's a native of the area for every 8-10 who are transplants. Be aware, though, if the subject of barbecue comes up, and it WILL, with the natives at least, there are some rules you MUST follow - Barbecue is NEVER spelled with a Q, nor is it abbreviated into anything other than - 'cue -, and it ALWAYS must involve ONLY pork cooked long & slow over low heat. Don't be shocked when the sauce has no tomatoes, as that is heresy around the area. The word is vinegar, and people will definitely get more upset when discussing the 'merits' of various types of barbecue than they will even when discussing politics or religion. Barbecue is MORE than a religion, some locals would say... ;-)

As an 'outsider' who spent nearly two decades in/around Raleigh, I can see the good/bad of it, and would certainly recommend it to almost everyone. It's a great place to live...

[sinstars]

A few more comments to add to the excellent feedback thus far:
We moved from Chicago area 3 years ago. NJ before that.
We are happy in the North Raleigh/Falls Lake/Wake Forest area. However, it was not the first choice. Cary / Apex was always mentioned as the two top areas to consider. After living in 'cookie cutter" developments and other developments/neighboorhoods, we were looking for something unique. We do not care if the latest "Trader Joes" is just 5 minutes away, or if we have to drive 20 minutes to a good restaurant or Starbucks. (Which before now we thought was a must have.) After looking in the area for several months, we decided to take advantage of the natural beauty and quiet of some of the outer or less developed areas. It takes time, but you can find such areas that still have a decent commute (for me 25-30 to RTP, my wife 10min to Wakefield area, and weekend jaunts to downtown Raleigh are 30min.) Yes, at times i do miss a quick run to S'Bucks, but when you can sit on your front-porch and only see a car go by about every 20 minutes, it is worth the trade-off. Going from a highly developed area to a quiet, wooded, more remote location, was not even in our thoughts, but after seeing what the area had to offer, we decided to go that route. However, if you want all just minutes away, then Cary, Apex, and North Raleigh are all good choices.