DURHAM anyone? less "safe" than Raleigh/Cary? (Chapel Hill: best town, crime rate)

[newenglandgirl]

I am possibly relocating to the Triangle area, older (semi-retired). I know nothing at all about Durham, other than it has Duke and a performing arts center. I've had two Cary realtors tell me to "stay away from Durham." No explanation. Why would they say this?

- Is Durham considered less safe - higher crime?
- Are the city neighborhoods going downhill?
- What parts are nicest/safest in terms of older bungalows, maybe 1500 sq ft or less?
- Should I look in the N or S part of the city?
- What do Durham folks pay for property taxes?
- How good is your drinking water?
- Public transportation?
- And Durhamites, how to you compare your city in general w Raleigh/Cary?

THANKS for any info, I'm coming there soon!

NewEnglGirl

[coltank]

Some areas of Durham are "less safe" than some areas of Raleigh/Cary, while the opposite is also true. The Cary Realtors who are saying you should "stay away from Durham" have bought into a lot of old stigmas, and honestly don't know or care to know about the area. Find a Realtor who is familiar with all the areas to show you around instead.

The most troubled areas right now are in the section just east of downtown. In my opinion, most of Durham is much nicer than most of Cary, it has a lot more character. Drinking water is good, taxes are higher than Cary (though probably less than where you are coming from), although the valuations are lower, and what you pay for services are generally less. Public transportation is so so, depending on what you are expecting.

Old bungalows, look in the historic districts surrounding downtown.

[DanielleNC]

Hi newenglandgirl,

Unfortunately, the Realtors you are hearing from and others not familiar with Durham are simply ignorant. There is higher crime SE of the downtown area, but honestly there is never a reason to go cruising through there. Downtown and most of Durham city and county is awesome. Downtown has been doing a lot of great renovations over the last several years, the opposite of going downhill. I don't know your price range, but I would check out the older neighborhoods outlining downtown like Trinity Park, Watts-Hillandale, Duke Park, and Forest Hills. The American Tobacco Historic District and Brightleaf Square are great areas for shops and restaurants, and closer to Duke is 9th St.

I grew up in North Durham which was great b/c it was nice and quiet, a bit more country, and very pretty. SW Durham is more suburban and where you would find one of the best malls in the state, Southpoint. SE Durham closer to Brier Creek is more and more up and coming with some nice neighborhoods and shopping centers popping up, and is one of the most affordable areas in Durham. Central and SW Durham are the pricier areas, North Durham is still very affordable with less traffic. The water is fine if you don't mind city water. I prefer filtered or well water though. Taxes are some of the highest in the area, someone more familiar with them can help you out with that. Never been on the buses either. I prefer Durham because it has everything I need and I love the vibe of the city. I would never live in Raleigh is because of traffic, and Cary just isn't for me. It's great though because Raleigh and Chapel Hill are just a quick drive.

Here are some local links:
American Tobacco Historic District Homepage
Brightleaf Square :: Fine Dining and Shopping in Downtown Durham
Durham Performing Arts Center :: Your New Home for World-Class ...
2009 Durham Bulls Baseball Club
The Sarah P. Duke Gardens
America's Foodiest Small Town: In the Magazine : bonappetit.com
http://www.bonappetit.com/blogsandforums/blogs/bafoodist/2008/09/where-to-eat-in-americas-foodi.html
Preservation Durham, North Carolina - Durham's Historic Neighborhoods

[CaliBoy]

Originally Posted by coltank

The most troubled areas right now are in the section just east of downtown.

And this is really 'just east' of downtown. Though slowly but surely, community activists are trying to clean things up. We live east of east beyond the 70 from downtown, and we're just fine with lots more property than those closer to downtown.

Though I do love the historic homes close to downtown (ours is too, just not located downtown), they are far more expensive and, if not restored, truly requires someone who loves old architecture and understands how to maintain them. Nonetheless, they, too, get their fair share of crime issues since, I guess, the perceived affluence is more attractive to the perpetrators of crime (of course, I don't know for sure the attraction, I simply don't make it a habit of committing crimes).

I visited a lot of communities much further north of downtown off Guess Rd. and I like them a lot. Though we're fairly content where we are now, and have no plans on moving in the near future.

- Is Durham considered less safe - higher crime?

I think there are a lot of people who still believe in the stigma of crime that Durham has. But, of course, you can't really blame people on either side of the fence. There's commentary to both sides of the issue, and both are valid. However, we are more alert to crime now than we were on the west coast. That's just us. But we are also closer to a lot more things positive, as well as negative. However, we're not living in any fear in Durham. Though we would like to see community members have less tolerance on the subject of crime while, still, embracing the positives.

- Are the city neighborhoods going downhill?

I think they are going the other direction... up. However, I can't speak for all neighborhoods. I'm guessing the areas that are still going down are filled with community members that either feel helpless to the situation, don't care, don't mind or don't know what to do. In that case, in any city really, community members of successful areas (that have improved their crime stats and neighborhoods) could volunteer to help out those that are heading downhill.

- What parts are nicest/safest in terms of older bungalows, maybe 1500 sq ft or less?

I'm guessing budget is not a real concern. The nicest and safest areas combined will just cost you more everywhere. Though I think some of the nicest bungalows of the size you speak are located in the area a lot of people believe is the most unsafe (not arguing that point because I don't know for certain)... NECD (North East Central Durham). Beautiful bungalows with the right amount of support, could be the best seen in Durham. Unfortunately, the stigma prevails there as well as the perceived poverty level (I said perceive, not fact).

Anyway, we have a lot of them here for reasonable prices in our neck of the woods. But most people are unaware of my neck of the woods and probably lump us into the areas they deem poor (not financially) and unsafe (until people visit and find out otherwise).

- Should I look in the N or S part of the city?

Two different ball games in my opinion. Though the further out you go, the more they appear the same since the homes seem to become more like rural housing. I like the south a lot because that puts me closer to the things I visit most (even though we live north and east). But if you are asking the question, without a doubt, look at both! Unless you visit, get out of the car, walk the neighborhoods, you just can't get a true feel to what's comfortable for YOU. My comfort level may be far less than yours, or more. Take what I say with a grain of salt and merely as one guideline of many. Then, visit the locations and come up with your own conclusions.

- What do Durham folks pay for property taxes?

Tax Rates in Durham. Doesn't really matter what each of us pays, it depends on what you're buying.

- How good is your drinking water?

Don't know much about the city water. We drink filtered water and filter just about everything. Don't know if there are any health risks or miracles either.

- Public transportation?

I was born and raised in Los Angeles. I am all about the car regardless of how 'green' we are in most other aspects of our lives. They'll need to pry my car from my dead cold fingers... yadayada. Though I'll be using some form of public transportation soon enough, I just cannot comment right now because I have no real knowledge or first hand experience.

- And Durhamites, how do you compare your city in general w Raleigh/Cary?

I'm not sure. Tons of topics on this. But I get the impression that those in Durham have great regard for their city, will defend it passionately, and generally do less criticizing of other cities as than many in those of other cities do of Durham. Of course, I cannot be absolute or scientific about this statement simply because I have NOT read every single thread on CD nor every single topic on every single blog that exists in the triangle. However, I have read a lot and the amount I've been exposed to helped me make such a conclusion (that can certainly change at any given moment depending on the stimuli and reading material I will be exposed). Were there enough disclaimers there???

Anyway, I think Raleigh, Cary, and Durham all offer some similarities and some differences. You'll need to visit a lot of areas in each city to really come up with a determination for yourself. Good luck!

[Francois]

Originally Posted by newenglandgirl

I've had two Cary realtors tell me to "stay away from Durham." No explanation. Why would they say this?

This makes me LOL

CARY Realtors tell you to stay away from another city? Why would YOU think they'd want to limit your choices from other cities? I wonder if someone at Circuit City [when they were still around] would ever tell someone to "stay away" from Best Buy...

The answer is, the worst parts of Durham probably are worst than the worst parts of other areas. However, Durham has undergone amazing renovations as a city in the past few years, and its "bad reputation" is at least a decade out of date, if it ever really was true in the first place.

[TraumanurseNC]

I love the city I live in, just wish Target was closer by! (tried talking them into moving it, but they weren't interested....). You really do need to look at all the areas you might be interested in, at all different times of the day and week. I personally have had no issues at all with crime, and feel very safe in Durham (both living and working). Durham is a beautiful place to live and work, and yes, has some crime (as does everywhere) issues in certain areas. I can't speak highly enough of Durham, and I have lived in Raleigh and Wake Forest. My mother lives in Oxford and my brother lives in Cary, and while they are nice places, they were not for me.... You really do need to check things out for yourself, but I would drop a realtor that told me NOT to look somewhere without giving solid reasons for the advice.... Where you choose to live is completely personal and individual, and that is something you will have to do your own research on... but definitely find a realtor who is willing to show you ALL the options available to you, unless he/she knows you very well, I can't imagine they know where would be best for you to live. That is for you to decide....

[Charlton Dude]

Originally Posted by newenglandgirl

I am possibly relocating to the Triangle area, older (semi-retired). I know nothing at all about Durham, other than it has Duke and a performing arts center. I've had two Cary realtors tell me to "stay away from Durham." No explanation. Why would they say this?

- Is Durham considered less safe - higher crime? Yes, but there are safe areas. The overall crime rate is higher than surrounding towns due to concentrated areas of high crime.
- Are the city neighborhoods going downhill? Some yes and some no.
- Should I look in the N or S part of the city? Southwest, no question.
- What do Durham folks pay for property taxes? About 50% higher than many in Wake County towns.
- How good is your drinking water? The same as most any other public water. I did taste higher levels of chlorine. I drink bottled water mostly.
- Public transportation? Not much. Some buses.
- And Durhamites, how to you compare your city in general w Raleigh/Cary? Cary is the single best town overall to live in. We don't live there, but we frequent it often. It is beautiful, unique, pleasant, safe and just very comfortable.

THANKS for any info, I'm coming there soon!

NewEnglGirl

See comments in red.

[jill7930]

I am SO glad I didn't have access to a forum like this 9 yrs ago when I was moving to Durham, because I would have been scared (for no good reason) to move here from all the ridiculous crap one reads about Durham being unsafe, not as good as the rest of the Triangle, etc. Can't say if its the place for you- clearly only you can tell, but we LOVE it as do many people who live here. I feel as safe as I have felt anywhere else in the country that I've lived. My in-laws just retired to Durham from a city in the mid-west and are enjoying it. It's smaller with less traffic than Raleigh and has a lot more diversity, quirkyness, and character than Cary!

[Charlton Dude]

Originally Posted by jill7930

I am SO glad I didn't have access to a forum like this 9 yrs ago when I was moving to Durham, because I would have been scared (for no good reason) to move here from all the ridiculous crap one reads about Durham being unsafe, not as good as the rest of the Triangle, etc. Can't say if its the place for you- clearly only you can tell, but we LOVE it as do many people who live here. I feel as safe as I have felt anywhere else in the country that I've lived. My in-laws just retired to Durham from a city in the mid-west and are enjoying it. It's smaller with less traffic than Raleigh and has a lot more diversity, quirkyness, and character than Cary!

I would not say Durham has more character than Cary. I would say that Raleigh, Durham and Cary all have character, just different kinds of character. Not liking what a town or city offers does not mean it does not have character. It just doesn't have the kind of character you like.

[jill7930]

Originally Posted by Charlton Dude

I would not say Durham has more character than Cary. I would say that Raleigh, Durham and Cary all have character, just different kinds of character. Not liking what a town or city offers does not mean it does not have character. It just doesn't have the kind of character you like.

True enough I suppose. And I should say that Durham actually has a different character depending on which part you live in. As has been mentioned by some previous posters, and speaking with some generalizations:

SW Durham tends to be more "sprawlish" with lots of new housing, strip malls, the large Southpoint shopping mall and surrounding bunch of stores, etc. Central Durham includes Duke and downtown, with lots of great restaurants, non-chain stores, the Ballpark, DPAC, Duke Campus resources (Duke Gardens, Nasher art museum, etc). Then there's western and northern Durham which has much less retail, the beautiful Eno River State Park, and a more rural feeling. I know less about East Durham since I have no reason to go there much- there are some "sketchy" areas out East with gang/drug problems. Check it all out and see what feel right for you! I love living in western Durham and would not want to live in SW Durham (though my inlaws are there, close to the Chapel Hill line) and it's a great location for them. I much prefer the "quieter feeling" of western/northern Durham.