Trinity Park and Hope Valley, Durham (Raleigh, Chapel Hill: apartment, violent crime, chapel)

[MaimounaKande]

First, I'll set the record straight. I'm not moving. We just moved to Chapel Hill a year ago and like it a lot. Having said that, when I was looking into Durham for a friend of mine, I kept coming back to these 2 areas and they've peaked my interest.

Trinity Park is beautiful. Love the look. Can anyone tell me how crime is in that area? Price range on a home on the 3,000-4,000 sq. foot end?

Hope Valley is hard to get a feel for (I know, I should just drive out there). Sounds gorgeous too, but I can't figure out if it feels like one of the new golf course developments (which I don't like at all), or if it has a feel of its own b/c it was built long ago and they didn't cram things in like today? I don't play golf, I see no appeal to living on a golf course, but the area and homes sound really nice. Are they?

Just curious!
Thanks,
Nellie

[MaimounaKande]

Where is Bull City Rising on this one??

Someone must know about these areas in Durham!! Anyone??

[Bull City Rising]

Originally Posted by MaimounaKande

Where is Bull City Rising on this one??

Someone must know about these areas in Durham!! Anyone??

At my day job -- on the first day back from being away for a week. :-)

I can post more later, but short answer -- both TP and HV are *wonderful* historic neighborhoods. I know TP better since I live there and I can speak more to it.

I can see nothing to worry about in terms of violent crime in either area. There is the occasional stolen leafblower or bicycle in Trinity Park, but then, we're a large (700+ home) traditional street-grid neighborhood adjacent to downtown and that's just part of life in a city.

There are two new-construction houses from good builders (including McNeill Burbank) in the northern part of T.P. right now. One is a 2,600 sq. ft. home with a 500 sq. ft. over-garage apartment going for $399,000; another is about 3,000 sq. ft. with first floor master and grand vaulted family room for $415,000. There's also an older (built in 1920) 2,900 sq. ft. house on N. Duke St. going for $326,000, listed with Marie Austin.

Older, historic homes will tend to be in the 2000 sq ft range; the larger ones will tend to be in the older southern part of the neighborhood (south of around Green St. or so, between Duke and Buchanan Sts. in that southern district)... I would guesstimate at that sq. footage you're talking $350k up to the high six figures, depending on nature of house, age, historic condition, etc. (Note: houses that are certified as local historic properties by the local preservation society get a transferable 50% reduction in annual property tax.)

Good luck, LMK if more questions!

[scorp200]

Hey Bull City, what if you want a tiny house in Trinity Park? Like 900 square feet!? I live in a 564 sq. foot apartment right now, wouldn't even know what to do with myself in a place over 1000. Anyway if and when I buy I'll want a little old (older the better) bungalow or bungalow-esque home in that neighborhood. Do you think I'll be able to find something for under $200,000 (I hope, I'd be buying alone) or even better under $150,000?

[Bull City Rising]

Originally Posted by scorp200

Hey Bull City, what if you want a tiny house in Trinity Park? Like 900 square feet!? I live in a 564 sq. foot apartment right now, wouldn't even know what to do with myself in a place over 1000. Anyway if and when I buy I'll want a little old (older the better) bungalow or bungalow-esque home in that neighborhood. Do you think I'll be able to find something for under $200,000 (I hope, I'd be buying alone) or even better under $150,000?

Definitely. My wife and my home fits that bill -- 1,500 sq. ft., ca. 1935, 3 bed/2 ba., purchased a couple of years ago in the mid-$100s. The northern part of Trinity Park features homes that, and I quote from the neighborhood's own history from its web site, "the neighborhood expanded north of Urban Avenue in the 1920s through the ‘40s, including the construction of more homes for the less well-to-do." We live in one of those 'less well-to-do houses'

Lots of bungalows and cottages, typically 1000-1500 sq. ft. Prices for those in TP, Watts-Hillandale, Old West Durham (lots of old mill/factory worker homes), Northgate Park, Duke Park have stayed affordable... though if gut renovated they can price up to the mid-$200s or beyond.

[MaimounaKande]

I drove through the old and expensive part of Hope Valley yesterday evening (where there are houses for $4million). WOW. What a gorgeous area. Not just the homes (which are fabulous--built in the 20's-40's and so much character!) but the whole area with the winding roads and trees...wish I'd known about that area when we were looking for homes (we were most definitely NOT looking the $4Million range, but there are areas of Hope Valley which are priced more for the "regular" person too!).

Tried to take a look at Trinity Park but got lost. Another day!

[Bull City Rising]

Originally Posted by MaimounaKande

I drove through the old and expensive part of Hope Valley yesterday evening (where there are houses for $4million). WOW. What a gorgeous area. Not just the homes (which are fabulous--built in the 20's-40's and so much character!) but the whole area with the winding roads and trees...wish I'd known about that area when we were looking for homes (we were most definitely NOT looking the $4Million range, but there are areas of Hope Valley which are priced more for the "regular" person too!).

Tried to take a look at Trinity Park but got lost. Another day!

Ah yes... Hope Valley was built in the 20s-40s during a time when what we now know as Trinity Park, Old North Durham, and other neighborhoods "in Durham" were what were actually streetcar suburbs... areas to live where you generally would take the trolley to get to and from your work (downtown at the factory, naturally.) If you were wealthy, you built a big house as close to the factories/downtown as possible... like Four Acres (where NC Mutual now is), or like the big homes in southern T.P.

Hope Valley represented the early thoughts of suburbanization in America, when wealthy people began to think that living in downtown right near factories wasn't that great. In fact, H.V.'s site was chosen *because* it was outside the streetcar lines... so that you had to be rich enough to afford a car in order to live there! Which is why it has the newer estates/mansions in Durham, while T.P. has some of the older ones... and the very oldest ones have all been lost to "urban renewal."

Now, of course, I feel that we're starting to go through the reversal of this trend again, where downtowns and places like "ITB" Raleigh are the hot places for professionals. Every trend reverses itself eventually...

[Bull City Rising]

PS -- if you're looking for Trinity Park, it's the area bounded roughly by Main St/Morgan St to the south, Duke St to the east, Buchanan to the west, and Club Blvd to the north. TP also includes areas east of Duke St. all the way to the Ellerbe Creek Greenway north of Knox, and some blocks to the east south of Knox. TP, Duke Park and Northgate Park have "annexed" these areas and aligned their boundaries to be inclusive of the previously unrepresented blocks between their old borders. Remember, we're talking about 501(c)3 non-profits, not Homeowners' Associations with covenants here, but these are important advocacy groups with the city. The squeaky wheel and all that...

[callsnap]

I'd planned on finding a historic home in East Durham or the Cleavland Holloway District. Alas, it's not for the faint of heart. Concerns (warranted or not) of crime weren't an issue. My potential neighbors were very friendly and informative about the neighborhood, HOA's & community organizations, and how everyone looks out for one another.
My first home purchase was in Chicago's Near South Side. So, I find "safety" is more feeling, than fact. I felt safe in those neighborhoods.
The barrier to entry for me was the condition of property in my price range. The homes simply needed much more work than my schedule, wallet or expertise would allow. I was elbow greased out of that market.

So, I settled on Trinity Park. I sought what BCR described.

Originally Posted by Bull City Rising

Definitely. My wife and my home fits that bill -- 1,500 sq. ft., ca. 1935, 3 bed/2 ba., purchased a couple of years ago in the mid-$100s. The northern part of Trinity Park features homes that, and I quote from the neighborhood's own history from its web site, "the neighborhood expanded north of Urban Avenue in the 1920s through the ‘40s, including the construction of more homes for the less well-to-do." We live in one of those 'less well-to-do houses'

I found it! I put an offer in for a poor man's castle. It is completely gutted and reno'ed, which will keep my "To Do List" short:
1) unpack
2) enjoy sun room
It's a lovely old neighborhood. I was pleased to find pockets of affordability.

I've lived in Durham several months and scoured CD archives to learn as much as possible about the city. BCR, your posts have been extremely helpful in my house hunt. Everyone's questions and insights have been invaluable (and yet free of charge, which is why I love this site). Thanks!

[MrsSteel]

Congrats on your new home, Callsnap! I'm sure you'll enjoy it.