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Old 02-12-2008, 10:47 PM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 32,491,985 times
Reputation: 2661

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Nice neat clean little deal. Nothing big. Showed a client who we have worked with before a set of houses on Sunday and made an offer Monday AM. Squeezed a little but not a lot. Sent it to the sellers agent noon on Monday with a response by Tuesday close of business.

Bug the agent a little Tuesday in the early PM. Staff claims it is in the pipeline. Request a call from the agent. Get call. Claims clients are in afternoon long neighborhood thing but that he will run them down and get a response this evening.

Finally at 8pm we get the response. They buy the price...minor change to the seller paid costs and some admin details. Goody - we are there...

But...right at the end...a multiple offer clause. Basically that says the seller must again approve an accepted counter before it sticks...

Sheeet....The way I read it is the sellers agent stalled to get another offer in and then hit both potential buyers with a counter based on our offer. Told me the counter to both was the same. So basically he has given the other buyer an opportunity to top our bid. Or we can top our own bid.

What do you say? Fair tactic? All is fair in love and RE? If the offer came from his office I will certainly go after him for failing to present the offer in a timely fashion. However I have reason to suspect the offer came from my office.

Is he guilty of an ethical violation which made his client more money?

What would you do in my shoes? Meet the clients at 8:30 and have to explain to them how the deal has gone weird. I see the choices as ..

Counter all changes out.
Hold...sign the counter
New counter up $1.
New counter up $x000.

And of course walk..."we don't play silly games"

Client however wants the house.
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Old 02-12-2008, 11:19 PM
 
Location: northeast US
739 posts, read 1,820,618 times
Reputation: 446
Three and a half years ago, peak of the boom, we saw a mostly renovated house in an emerging neighborhood listed at $142k.

Made a full price offer/24 hours, didn't hear from agent for 3 days, calls me and says other offers now at $168k, what would I like to counter-offer. I said zero.

Two months ago, just out of curiosity - first real snow day and not much to do, I checked the Registry of Deeds...house actually sold for $134k....$8,000 less than my full price offer!

A few days later, totally by accident, happened on Mass.gov link showing Level 3 Sex Offender living two houses down, same side of road. Glad I don't play silly games either.

Last edited by willdufauve; 02-12-2008 at 11:29 PM..
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Old 02-13-2008, 12:38 AM
 
Location: Houston, Texas
469 posts, read 1,322,025 times
Reputation: 295
Default If client loves house play games just do it better.

So, if the client loves the house and it is the one. Turn arround give whatever they were asking that doesn't hurt your client and stick in an escalation clause were you beat any higher offer by say a 100 bucks up to some point your client feels comfortable with. Most agents don't work this in and in multiple offer situations it can keep your client from paying to much and still have the highest offer. And in the future if you deal with this guy watch him close and don't do him any favors. If he trys to pull the hoopla on you again feel your client out let them know that if they stick in it they will pay to much and leave it up to them.

Good Luck Always Hate It When They Play Games!
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Old 02-13-2008, 10:01 AM
 
Location: Palm Coast, Fl
2,249 posts, read 7,895,962 times
Reputation: 1000
I don't see what is unethical. Am I missing something? Unless you don't believe another offer is on the table I can't see anything unethical. There are two offers, they are asking you to come back with your best and final, they'll look at both and then sign off on one of them.
What am I missing?
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Old 02-13-2008, 11:06 AM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 32,491,985 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by palmcoasting View Post
I don't see what is unethical. Am I missing something? Unless you don't believe another offer is on the table I can't see anything unethical. There are two offers, they are asking you to come back with your best and final, they'll look at both and then sign off on one of them.
What am I missing?
How about...
Standard of Practice 1-6

REALTORS® shall submit offers and counter-offers objectively and as quickly as possible. (Adopted 1/93, Amended 1/95)

Guy had 1 and 1/2 days to present the offer...did not do so until after it expired. Claims client not available during the final afternoon but he had the morning and the prior afternoon to get it done.

Violation? Close call.
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Old 02-13-2008, 11:28 AM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,107 posts, read 34,366,957 times
Reputation: 4893
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
How about...
Standard of Practice 1-6

REALTORS® shall submit offers and counter-offers objectively and as quickly as possible. (Adopted 1/93, Amended 1/95)

Guy had 1 and 1/2 days to present the offer...did not do so until after it expired. Claims client not available during the final afternoon but he had the morning and the prior afternoon to get it done.

Violation? Close call.
Close call yes. Violation? Not sufficent information to render opinion.

1-7 also provides for continuing to present offers. It is also permissable under the code to "shop" offers -
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Old 02-13-2008, 12:14 PM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 32,491,985 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
Close call yes. Violation? Not sufficent information to render opinion.

1-7 also provides for continuing to present offers. It is also permissable under the code to "shop" offers -
I see nothing but the failure to present the offer in a timely fashion. And that could be OK...but if he just did not get around to it I would think it a violation.
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Old 02-13-2008, 12:18 PM
 
Location: NJ
2,212 posts, read 6,174,764 times
Reputation: 2165
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
But...right at the end...a multiple offer clause. Basically that says the seller must again approve an accepted counter before it sticks...

Sheeet....The way I read it is the sellers agent stalled to get another offer in and then hit both potential buyers with a counter based on our offer. Told me the counter to both was the same. So basically he has given the other buyer an opportunity to top our bid. Or we can top our own bid.

What do you say? Fair tactic? All is fair in love and RE? If the offer came from his office I will certainly go after him for failing to present the offer in a timely fashion. However I have reason to suspect the offer came from my office.

Is the sellers agent from Jersey? That is standard practice here - plus plenty of "phantom buyers" always appear at the last minute (on houses which haven't had bids in months). It appeared to work in 2005 (on idiots), not working so well these days, quite a few sellers have lost decent deals recently with this game playing.
Buyers should be willing to walk and not be pushed around, especially when there are a ton of properties in the market.
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Old 02-13-2008, 06:27 PM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
8,847 posts, read 17,443,646 times
Reputation: 6202
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
Nice neat clean little deal. Nothing big. Showed a client who we have worked with before a set of houses on Sunday and made an offer Monday AM. Squeezed a little but not a lot. Sent it to the sellers agent noon on Monday with a response by Tuesday close of business.

Bug the agent a little Tuesday in the early PM. Staff claims it is in the pipeline. Request a call from the agent. Get call. Claims clients are in afternoon long neighborhood thing but that he will run them down and get a response this evening.

Finally at 8pm we get the response. They buy the price...minor change to the seller paid costs and some admin details. Goody - we are there...

But...right at the end...a multiple offer clause. Basically that says the seller must again approve an accepted counter before it sticks...

Sheeet....The way I read it is the sellers agent stalled to get another offer in and then hit both potential buyers with a counter based on our offer. Told me the counter to both was the same. So basically he has given the other buyer an opportunity to top our bid. Or we can top our own bid.

What do you say? Fair tactic? All is fair in love and RE? If the offer came from his office I will certainly go after him for failing to present the offer in a timely fashion. However I have reason to suspect the offer came from my office.

Is he guilty of an ethical violation which made his client more money?

What would you do in my shoes? Meet the clients at 8:30 and have to explain to them how the deal has gone weird. I see the choices as ..

Counter all changes out.
Hold...sign the counter
New counter up $1.
New counter up $x000.

And of course walk..."we don't play silly games"

Client however wants the house.
Hmmm...
Was he acting on his sellers orders? They may have suspected another offer coming in and told him to stall. He may have shared the potential second offer and suggested the stall they agreed to. I think it's brilliant although it sucks for your buyers. The list agent did his job and fulfilled his fiduciary responsibility.

Of course it depends on how it went down and when he really contacted them and what he knew. I can't answer that.
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Old 02-13-2008, 07:01 PM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 32,491,985 times
Reputation: 2661
Well we may find out. Accepted the counter offer as offered. Mama said no more...she knew there are another 20,000 houses out there and she was not going to be pressured into upping her offer. Seller accepted the other offer.

Take the buyers back out in the AM.

Will likely risk the money to find out if the guy had some basis for the delay. If not suspect his broker will end up paying two commissions.
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