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Old 02-24-2008, 08:25 AM
 
Location: Gilbert - Val Vista Lakes
6,069 posts, read 14,730,418 times
Reputation: 3876

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Quote:
You really want to go back through it? The initial point was and remains that the prohibitions on payments to a third party do not apply to the client. You and Captain Bill appear to take the position that they do. I claim they do not. How has this been lost? You certainly have not proven your position.
Obviously we're going nowhere with this. You are operating as you know the Nevada law, and we're operating as we know the Arizona law. It is not necessary that he or I provide any further sources because we operate in different states.

In Arizona the law clearly states that we cannot offer a commission or kickback to an unlicensed person. We can discount our commission to either the buyer or seller provided that it is in the HUD 1 and in compliance with RESPA.

That is the law that I live by. You live by what you understand the Nevada law to be. We all must live by RESPA, and it's entirely up to you how you deal with that.

There isn't anything else that I can add. I'm not trying to convince you; I'm simply stating how I understand the AZ law from reading it, and from my training, and from reading RESPA and Michele Linds (General Counsel of the Arizona AAR) book that deals with AZ real estate law and RESPA.
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Old 02-24-2008, 09:53 AM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 38,073,112 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bill View Post
Obviously we're going nowhere with this. You are operating as you know the Nevada law, and we're operating as we know the Arizona law. It is not necessary that he or I provide any further sources because we operate in different states.

In Arizona the law clearly states that we cannot offer a commission or kickback to an unlicensed person. We can discount our commission to either the buyer or seller provided that it is in the HUD 1 and in compliance with RESPA.

That is the law that I live by. You live by what you understand the Nevada law to be. We all must live by RESPA, and it's entirely up to you how you deal with that.

There isn't anything else that I can add. I'm not trying to convince you; I'm simply stating how I understand the AZ law from reading it, and from my training, and from reading RESPA and Michele Linds (General Counsel of the Arizona AAR) book that deals with AZ real estate law and RESPA.
Sorry Bill but I do not believe you or GD have provided any evidence that such a law exsits in AZ. You have shown you have the same laws (approximately) that we do in Nevada with respect to payment to unlicensed non parties. But specifics that would deal with a participant allude you.

I may well be that such a payment is illegal in AZ. At this point though I doubt it...GD is very knowledgable and would have produced the law if it existed.

We as a profession have a propensity to define as law whatever we are taught or learned. Much of it however turns out to be untrue when scrutinized.

The CYA approaches of the brokerages to the fair housing laws are an example. People swear they are law though they are not.

An instructor a couple of weeks ago stated that new Nevada law requires buyers broker agreements to have a client relationship with a buyer. That would be a very large change here where buyer agreements are almost never done. Turns out however that the buyers agreement can be verbal and need not be in writing...so it is same old same old. Talk to someone about a purchase and you have a buyers broker agreement.

When GD cannot produce the law or regulation it likely does not exist.

I agree though that we have beaten it to death....
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Old 02-24-2008, 10:24 AM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 39,142,425 times
Reputation: 4937
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
When GD cannot produce the law or regulation it likely does not exist.
A) Az law does not make a distinction with the word "client".

B) I have much better things to do than spend my time dealing with your demands. You can choose to accept what Bill and I have said - or not. Matters not to me. You continue doing what you are doing - even though, I know you are wrong - as do others. It is merely your ego that prohibits acknowledging you are wrong
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Old 02-24-2008, 11:04 AM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 38,073,112 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
A) Az law does not make a distinction with the word "client".

B) I have much better things to do than spend my time dealing with your demands. You can choose to accept what Bill and I have said - or not. Matters not to me. You continue doing what you are doing - even though, I know you are wrong - as do others. It is merely your ego that prohibits acknowledging you are wrong

That you always Greatday...can't prove your point...attack...

But you remain unable to prove your point.
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Old 02-25-2008, 01:50 PM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,474,580 times
Reputation: 20674
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bill View Post
I'm not quite sure what you're asking capt, but if you're talking about an agent giving back part of their commission to their client, that can be done as long as it's in the HUD as a discounted commission to assist with closing costs. That's legal as long as it's in the HUD-1.
Absolutely.
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Old 02-25-2008, 02:57 PM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 38,073,112 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
Absolutely.
Ah comeon we already did this one. There is no HUD1 in a cash deal.

RESPA and HUD1 deal with loan disclosure laws not the payment of rebates to clients.
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Old 02-25-2008, 03:18 PM
 
26 posts, read 61,657 times
Reputation: 25
I believe the original question was whether the state of Florida allows Brokers to share commissions with their clients. The answer, according to the Department of Justice's website on this matter, is yes. With regard to the argument between AZ and NM, both of those states allow rebates, as well ( DOJ/Antitrust: Real Estate Laws in Your State).

To Middle-Aged Mom, if your Barrington is the one in Illinois, rebates are currently allowed. However, there is a Bill in the House, right now, that is proposing to ban rebates. The Judicial Law Committee has a hearing scheduled this Wednesday, on that matter.
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Old 02-25-2008, 04:18 PM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 38,073,112 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedSoxMark View Post
I believe the original question was whether the state of Florida allows Brokers to share commissions with their clients. The answer, according to the Department of Justice's website on this matter, is yes. With regard to the argument between AZ and NM, both of those states allow rebates, as well ( DOJ/Antitrust: Real Estate Laws in Your State).

To Middle-Aged Mom, if your Barrington is the one in Illinois, rebates are currently allowed. However, there is a Bill in the House, right now, that is proposing to ban rebates. The Judicial Law Committee has a hearing scheduled this Wednesday, on that matter.
Some of you might profit from going through the link and reading the feds views on rebate restrtictions including banning them after escrow....

It is still amazing what we don't know about what we do...
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Old 02-25-2008, 07:23 PM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,474,580 times
Reputation: 20674
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedSoxMark View Post
I believe the original question was whether the state of Florida allows Brokers to share commissions with their clients. The answer, according to the Department of Justice's website on this matter, is yes. With regard to the argument between AZ and NM, both of those states allow rebates, as well ( DOJ/Antitrust: Real Estate Laws in Your State).

To Middle-Aged Mom, if your Barrington is the one in Illinois, rebates are currently allowed. However, there is a Bill in the House, right now, that is proposing to ban rebates. The Judicial Law Committee has a hearing scheduled this Wednesday, on that matter.
I am painfully aware of the current status in Illinois. Thanks for the link as it will clear up a lot of confusion.
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Old 02-25-2008, 07:24 PM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,474,580 times
Reputation: 20674
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
Ah comeon we already did this one. There is no HUD1 in a cash deal.

RESPA and HUD1 deal with loan disclosure laws not the payment of rebates to clients.
You are right, sir.
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