HOA minutes a big secret for potential buyers??? (agent, settlement, Realtor)

[keeperk]

I am selling lands in subdivided ranches. HOA's which usually which brings changes from original By laws and c and r's, Additional boards and subcommittees. The financial status is documented and any future proposed changes in the meeting minutes. I feel strongly it is the potential buyer's right to investigate this information before they purchase and the hoa minutes should not be held back. I do provide this information regardless of the boards standing on it.

I have some subdivisions which posts everything on their website for the public to find and read thru. Some are password protected. Some boards freely give up this information to me and one in particular thinks everything is none of a potential buyer's business. I get around that one as I can get access to it regardless but their attitudes on it I greatly disagree with. In the event I can't get the info, of course my seller could get it for me. They don't have anything to hide, it's just their attitudes on it. As for who the board members are, one of the members does not want me giving that out either, only her contact info. I give all board members info out in case my buyers want to contact them. They are incorporated and if someone had the know-how, they could look it up anyway.

Your thoughts? Is it a buyer's business or not to read the minutes before a purchase decision?

[Silverfall]

Yes, buyer's should read minutes before they purchase. If a seller was unwilling to provide them to a potential buyer, I would be concerned that there is some proposal that they are trying to hide.

[bentlebee]

I'm serving on a board and on a committee in another HOA. I do agree with you that it should be open to the public/potential buyer. The information can give potential buyers more knowledge about the community and if they decide to buy, they know what the rules are and who to contact. To me if a Hoa wants to keep all that a secret, than you shouldn't buy in that community. Just my opnion.

[golfgod]

Absolutely the buyers have the right to know. We once were prepared to make an offer on a house in a subdivision where we KNEW there was a pending suit between a seller of adjacent land and the HOA. The board's discussions on the suit were all done in "executive session" as is typical. I

The seller's agent said that for that reason we couldn't get copies, we told the seller that THEY were absolutely entitled to copies and if they didn't obtain them and forward them to us then no deal. IIRC they had to pay about FIFTY CENTS per page, or a total of about $75.00 to get all pages. They turned them over to us and we went ahead with the deal.

BTW, a year later I was on the board when we settled (non-financial) with the aggrieved party. The settlement was actually something that worked to the long range benefit of the HOA which the (former) members could have readily seen had they not been led around by one VERY VOCAL (and wrong) board member.

Every house I've bought since then (about 25) we've had two year's minutes required in our initital offer.

golfgod

[rrufast]

While it is in the buyers best interest to obtain and review HOA minutes, the HOA, in and of itself, is in NO WAY obligated to provide minutes for review to ANYONE outside it's own members.

That said, ultimately, it is the SELLER's responsibility to request/provide any pertinent documents, including regular/special BOD minutes. Executive minutes are generally off limits to all but BOD members, HOA mgmt companies, and the HOA legal counsel.

Bottom line is that a buyer who wants to be informed as to what is going on in a community they are considering purchasing in SHOULD either ASK or BE ADVISED (by their agent- if the agent is worth their weight in salt) to request and review the doc's as a contingency of the offer. The potential BUYER should then be able to make a more informed decision as to what they are getting into after reviewing said doc's.

YMMV

[HIF]

As an HOA board member and a CAM, I think it's refreshing that a buyer would take such an interest BEFORE buying the property. I would think that the board would welcome such interest and provide anything that the potential buyers wanted. You sound like a great Realtor!

[rmansfield]

I'm hoping some folks will still read this thread.

I am in a condo association in Kentucky. Our current board is very secretive. I've been stonewalled so far when requesting minutes. Yesterday I was finally told I'd get access to minutes, but only in the presence of a board member. He said that I could not have my own copies. Is this legal?

[chet everett]

Originally Posted by rmansfield

I'm hoping some folks will still read this thread.

I am in a condo association in Kentucky. Our current board is very secretive. I've been stonewalled so far when requesting minutes. Yesterday I was finally told I'd get access to minutes, but only in the presence of a board member. He said that I could not have my own copies. Is this legal?

The laws that govern what HOA can get away with are set on a state (and sometimes local) level. You might have to check with the office of State Attorney General or similar 'consumer protection' office.

Good Luck!

[rmansfield]

Thanks, I sent an email to our attorney general.

Maybe you can help me understand part of our bylaws.

"These bylaws may not be modified, amended, or repealed except by the vote of the owners of units to which greater than 50% of the common elements is appurtenant, at a regular or special meeting of the unit owners; provided, however, that until the time the inception meeting of the unit owners is held, the bylaws may be modified, amended, or repealed by the vote of greater than 50% in number of the members of the board of directors present and voting at a meeting of the board of directors at which a quorum is present."

Our board has changed bylaws without getting a vote from homeowners. The above statement confuses me because it sounds at the beginning that changes cannot be made to the bylaws without a vote of the homeowners. But toward the end of the paragraph, it seems to say the board can make changes without consulting homeowners.

I hope you can help me understand the statement.

[LawoftheLand]

Originally Posted by rmansfield

"These bylaws may not be modified, amended, or repealed except by the vote of the owners of units to which greater than 50% of the common elements is appurtenant, at a regular or special meeting of the unit owners; Yes, this means the Board must ask the homeowners and get a majority vote to make changes. ( But I find it odd that that a "majority" is dependant on which units are appurtenant to the common elements.)


provided, however, that until the time the inception meeting of the unit owners is held, the bylaws may be modified, amended, or repealed by the vote of greater than 50% in number of the members of the board of directors present and voting at a meeting of the board of directors at which a quorum is present."

This section only applies when the developer still controls the HOA entity and appoints all the Board members, prior to turning it over to the homeowners.

I'd recommend that you ask the HOA in writing, sent certified mail with return receipt, that it provide you with either a copy of the minutes or a letter from the HOA attorney explaining why you are not entitled to get this as a member of the HOA. (A per-page fee may still apply.) Good luck!